Check out this setup and feel free to criticize...
Check out this setup and feel free to criticize... I've been collecting parts and buying things for about 8 months. Of course like everyone that is building an engine would love to see high Horsepower to be put down on the dyno. But what do you guys think I'll be doing with this setup?
-6 liter Iron block bored .030
-Manley 4 inch crank.
-H beam rods from compstar 6.125
-Wiseco pistons with -3 cc
-AFR 230 1660 heads 65 cc chambers(12.49:1 afr calculated with .051 gasket)
-lunati lifters hydrolic roller with link bars.
-Fast 102mm with 102TB.
-235/243 621/624 113 LSA
Haven't chosen set of rockers yet.
What are you guys opinion? I'm trying to accomplish 550 RWHP N/A. Is this possible?
-6 liter Iron block bored .030
-Manley 4 inch crank.
-H beam rods from compstar 6.125
-Wiseco pistons with -3 cc
-AFR 230 1660 heads 65 cc chambers(12.49:1 afr calculated with .051 gasket)
-lunati lifters hydrolic roller with link bars.
-Fast 102mm with 102TB.
-235/243 621/624 113 LSA
Haven't chosen set of rockers yet.
What are you guys opinion? I'm trying to accomplish 550 RWHP N/A. Is this possible?
I've been collecting parts and buying things for about 8 months. Of course like everyone that is building an engine would love to see high Horsepower to be put down on the dyno. But what do you guys think I'll be doing with this setup?
-6 liter Iron block bored .030
-Manley 4 inch crank.
-H beam rods from compstar 6.125
-Wiseco pistons with -3 cc
-AFR 230 1660 heads 65 cc chambers(12.49:1 afr calculated with .051 gasket)
-lunati lifters hydrolic roller with link bars.
-Fast 102mm with 102TB.
-235/243 621/624 113 LSA
Haven't chosen set of rockers yet.
What are you guys opinion? I'm trying to accomplish 550 RWHP N/A. Is this possible?
-6 liter Iron block bored .030
-Manley 4 inch crank.
-H beam rods from compstar 6.125
-Wiseco pistons with -3 cc
-AFR 230 1660 heads 65 cc chambers(12.49:1 afr calculated with .051 gasket)
-lunati lifters hydrolic roller with link bars.
-Fast 102mm with 102TB.
-235/243 621/624 113 LSA
Haven't chosen set of rockers yet.
What are you guys opinion? I'm trying to accomplish 550 RWHP N/A. Is this possible?
That's a lot of compression with a smallish cam... Btw, with the piston .010" out of the hole I get 11.9:1 CR with 65cc chambers and a .051" gasket (assuming the gasket is roughly .030" over the bore - AFR 230s might require a much larger bore gasket which would drop the compression another .1 or so). Depending on how far out of the hole the piston actually is, I'd order a gasket that gives you very close to .035" quench. So if it is .010" out, I'd do a .045" gasket, etc. That would give you 12.1:1 per my calculations.
Assuming 12.1:1, I'd recommend either of the following camshafts:
Option A) 243/251 112+2 (good street manners in a high compression 408 - optimized for the 4" stroke and FAST 102)
Option B) 247/255 110+2 (a nastier cam that will make more power and still optimized for the setup)
Either will help get you closer to 550 as well. The 243/251 would still drive well in a 408. The 247/255 would require more tuning but still would be pretty streetable in a high compression 408. Both will outpower the 235 you have chosen. The 235/243 is not as optimized with an earlier IVC and pushes the DCR up too high on 93 (for me at least).
I'd probably do the 243/251 given that you've chose the AFR 230s over the 245s. Sounds like you're looking for torque and engine response. You might even be able to do a 243/247 given the AFR's good I/E ratio and that would reduce some of the overlap and make it drive a bit better still.
Assuming 12.1:1, I'd recommend either of the following camshafts:
Option A) 243/251 112+2 (good street manners in a high compression 408 - optimized for the 4" stroke and FAST 102)
Option B) 247/255 110+2 (a nastier cam that will make more power and still optimized for the setup)
Either will help get you closer to 550 as well. The 243/251 would still drive well in a 408. The 247/255 would require more tuning but still would be pretty streetable in a high compression 408. Both will outpower the 235 you have chosen. The 235/243 is not as optimized with an earlier IVC and pushes the DCR up too high on 93 (for me at least).
I'd probably do the 243/251 given that you've chose the AFR 230s over the 245s. Sounds like you're looking for torque and engine response. You might even be able to do a 243/247 given the AFR's good I/E ratio and that would reduce some of the overlap and make it drive a bit better still.
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Agreed, ^^^
I would go as big as you can fit for your power goals.
I would go as big as you can fit for your power goals.
That's a lot of compression with a smallish cam... Btw, with the piston .010" out of the hole I get 11.9:1 CR with 65cc chambers and a .051" gasket (assuming the gasket is roughly .030" over the bore - AFR 230s might require a much larger bore gasket which would drop the compression another .1 or so). Depending on how far out of the hole the piston actually is, I'd order a gasket that gives you very close to .035" quench. So if it is .010" out, I'd do a .045" gasket, etc. That would give you 12.1:1 per my calculations.
Assuming 12.1:1, I'd recommend either of the following camshafts:
Option A) 243/251 112+2 (good street manners in a high compression 408 - optimized for the 4" stroke and FAST 102)
Option B) 247/255 110+2 (a nastier cam that will make more power and still optimized for the setup)
Either will help get you closer to 550 as well. The 243/251 would still drive well in a 408. The 247/255 would require more tuning but still would be pretty streetable in a high compression 408. Both will outpower the 235 you have chosen. The 235/243 is not as optimized with an earlier IVC and pushes the DCR up too high on 93 (for me at least).
I'd probably do the 243/251 given that you've chose the AFR 230s over the 245s. Sounds like you're looking for torque and engine response. You might even be able to do a 243/247 given the AFR's good I/E ratio and that would reduce some of the overlap and make it drive a bit better still.
Assuming 12.1:1, I'd recommend either of the following camshafts:
Option A) 243/251 112+2 (good street manners in a high compression 408 - optimized for the 4" stroke and FAST 102)
Option B) 247/255 110+2 (a nastier cam that will make more power and still optimized for the setup)
Either will help get you closer to 550 as well. The 243/251 would still drive well in a 408. The 247/255 would require more tuning but still would be pretty streetable in a high compression 408. Both will outpower the 235 you have chosen. The 235/243 is not as optimized with an earlier IVC and pushes the DCR up too high on 93 (for me at least).
I'd probably do the 243/251 given that you've chose the AFR 230s over the 245s. Sounds like you're looking for torque and engine response. You might even be able to do a 243/247 given the AFR's good I/E ratio and that would reduce some of the overlap and make it drive a bit better still.
TECH Fanatic
Joined: Aug 2009
Posts: 1,845
Likes: 255
From: Coast of San Mateo County Between Pacifica & HMB
Header Size ARH 1 7/8 is the perfect header size for your app.
FAST 102 Ported by Tony Mamo +12-15 HP
Get his cam recommendation
I like the 243-247 that Jake suggested with a (114 +3) and Tony probably
Would choose that out of all mentioned so far also (with different valve
Events depending on your conversation W/ him).
Given that he designed the heads I would ask him.
FAST 102 Ported by Tony Mamo +12-15 HP
Get his cam recommendation
I like the 243-247 that Jake suggested with a (114 +3) and Tony probably
Would choose that out of all mentioned so far also (with different valve
Events depending on your conversation W/ him).
Given that he designed the heads I would ask him.
TECH Fanatic
Joined: Aug 2009
Posts: 1,845
Likes: 255
From: Coast of San Mateo County Between Pacifica & HMB
550 rwhp Possible W/ stick and LIGHT Clutch, wheels, tires, EWP and perfect
Valve control, It has been done before just not very often @ 408 CI
W/ Hyd Roller.
Good Luck!
Valve control, It has been done before just not very often @ 408 CI
W/ Hyd Roller.
Good Luck!
TECH Fanatic
Joined: Aug 2009
Posts: 1,845
Likes: 255
From: Coast of San Mateo County Between Pacifica & HMB
AFR 230s Flow 270+ @.400 & 320 @ .550 On a 3.90 bore!
Porting FAST 102 will definitely make a significant difference on
Your build.
Lots of people port Fast manifolds to varying degrees.
Tony isn't cheap, but you get what you pay for!
Exhaust flow of AFR230s is so high (E/I) that NA with good
Exhaust system ( 1 7/8 LTs on back) +4* split on exhaust
Duration is plenty up to 6500RPM which as mentioned before
Will improve drivability on the street with no loss of track
Performance.
I would also go with CamMotion Cam W/ EPS Lobes.
They have made their reputation with smoother less aggressive
Ramp Profiles which provide better High RPM Valvetrain Stability
And quieter valvetrain overall. That is what I am going to do.
You have enough airflow in your heads to achieve your goal,
The correct Cam and valvetrain stability through 6500 RPM
Will be the critical factor IMHO.
Porting FAST 102 will definitely make a significant difference on
Your build.
Lots of people port Fast manifolds to varying degrees.
Tony isn't cheap, but you get what you pay for!
Exhaust flow of AFR230s is so high (E/I) that NA with good
Exhaust system ( 1 7/8 LTs on back) +4* split on exhaust
Duration is plenty up to 6500RPM which as mentioned before
Will improve drivability on the street with no loss of track
Performance.
I would also go with CamMotion Cam W/ EPS Lobes.
They have made their reputation with smoother less aggressive
Ramp Profiles which provide better High RPM Valvetrain Stability
And quieter valvetrain overall. That is what I am going to do.
You have enough airflow in your heads to achieve your goal,
The correct Cam and valvetrain stability through 6500 RPM
Will be the critical factor IMHO.
Last edited by NAVYBLUE210; Aug 17, 2014 at 12:05 PM. Reason: Addition
Why didnt you purchase the larger chamber 1610 heads instead. The 1660 heads are a small bore and shroud the valves quite a bit.
This is the largest issue I see here besides selecting the right cam and I am at a loss about your static CR with 91 octane.....its a bit aggressive.
Having me port the FAST is a no brainer.....especially if you even want to be in striking distance of your goals which IMO are a little aggressive with an out of the box type set-up....you would need to optimize everything including taking your driveline parts into account to get there.
I dont like sugar coating.....if it were easy or even relatively easy alot of others would have achieved it already and that's not the case. It requires a well designed and properly matched package to get there....with perfect valve control as well which plays a large role in the output.
You should PM me or call me at AFR this week....
Regards,
Tony
This is the largest issue I see here besides selecting the right cam and I am at a loss about your static CR with 91 octane.....its a bit aggressive.
Having me port the FAST is a no brainer.....especially if you even want to be in striking distance of your goals which IMO are a little aggressive with an out of the box type set-up....you would need to optimize everything including taking your driveline parts into account to get there.
I dont like sugar coating.....if it were easy or even relatively easy alot of others would have achieved it already and that's not the case. It requires a well designed and properly matched package to get there....with perfect valve control as well which plays a large role in the output.
You should PM me or call me at AFR this week....
Regards,
Tony
Thanks guys. Love all the feed back I'm getting. I'm glad to know that I can definitely do better and I'm sorta in the right track this goal. Tony I'll be emailing you soon thanks again.