What would be the best heads for me?
What would be the best heads for me? Currently have a stock LS1 shortblock with a pretty big cam (not counting out getting a bigger cam). I'm going to get an LSXR 102/102 or MSD Airforce/102 TB to go with the heads, and would like to get the intake ported to match the heads. I am more interested in mid-band power than max power.
Heads that I am thinking about (don't want to go over $2K):
Advanced Induction 223cc Dart/RHS
Advanced Induction 226cc GM LS6/LS2 + used 243/799 cores
Advanced Induction 232cc GM LS6/LS2 + used 243/799 cores
PRC As-Cast 225cc LS1/LS2 Cathedral Heads
Trick Flow® GenX® 220 Cylinder Heads for GM LS2
Heads that I am thinking about (don't want to go over $2K):
Advanced Induction 223cc Dart/RHS
Advanced Induction 226cc GM LS6/LS2 + used 243/799 cores
Advanced Induction 232cc GM LS6/LS2 + used 243/799 cores
PRC As-Cast 225cc LS1/LS2 Cathedral Heads
Trick Flow® GenX® 220 Cylinder Heads for GM LS2
TFS 205s should be considered as well. They are 58cc with stock piston-to-valve clearance. And they are fully CNC ported with a small runner and flow similar to the heads you have listed. That will make a ton of torque (compression + smaller Cross sectional area of the runner). They also have PM guides. And are right at $2k.
Also, the TFS 220s I'd seriously look at, but with the upgrades TEA, BTR, Tick, or VR does to them - installing PM guides (for stock rocker usage), new valve springs, and turned-down LS3 valves, and sometimes, hand porting. Price might creep over 2k with all those options, but they would beat down a lot of heads and offer no real downside.
Also, the TFS 220s I'd seriously look at, but with the upgrades TEA, BTR, Tick, or VR does to them - installing PM guides (for stock rocker usage), new valve springs, and turned-down LS3 valves, and sometimes, hand porting. Price might creep over 2k with all those options, but they would beat down a lot of heads and offer no real downside.
I think it will be between Advanced Induction 223cc Dart/RHS and Trick Flow® GenX® 220
Is there any downside to getting the Trick Flow ones over the machined AI Dart heads? Prices are just about identical, but the AI 223s have better hardware installed.
Is there any downside to getting the Trick Flow ones over the machined AI Dart heads? Prices are just about identical, but the AI 223s have better hardware installed.
Trending Topics
I'm not sure what the valve angle is on the Dart heads but if it's stock 15 degree and both heads have the same 2.04 or so sized valves, then the TF will allow a tad more piston to valve clearance because of the 13.5 degree angle. Or per haps a slightly more aggressive intake lobe could be had and still safely fit due to the added clearance. Both heads are kick *** for sure !!!
LS1 Tech Stories
The Best V8 Stories One Small Block at Time
6 Common C5 Corvette Failures and What's Involved In Repairing Them
Pouria Savadkouei
Retro Modern Bandit Pontiac Trans AM Comes With Burt Reynolds' Autograph
Verdad Gallardo
Top 10 Greatest Cadillac V Series Performance Models Ever, Ranked
Pouria Savadkouei
Top 10 Most Powerful Chevy Trucks Ever Made!
Hennessey's New Supercharged Silverado ZR2 Has 700 HP
Verdad Gallardo
Coachbuilt N2A Anteros Is an LS2-Powered C6 Corvette In Italian Clothes
Verdad Gallardo
Awesome K5 Blazer Restomod Comes With C7 Corvette Power
Verdad Gallardo
10 Camaros You Should Never Buy
10 LS Engine Myths That Refuse to Die
Verdad Gallardo I'm not sure what the valve angle is on the Dart heads but if it's stock 15 degree and both heads have the same 2.04 or so sized valves, then the TF will allow a tad more piston to valve clearance because of the 13.5 degree angle. Or per haps a slightly more aggressive intake lobe could be had and still safely fit due to the added clearance. Both heads are kick *** for sure !!!
You might be surprised at what Brian Tooley charges for TFS 220's hand blended WITH his platinum spring kit. Have you contacted him yet?
Last edited by dr_whigham; Jan 31, 2015 at 12:34 PM.
TECH Fanatic
Joined: Aug 2011
Posts: 1,324
Likes: 6
From: Marengo, Ia
I wish there was more info comparing the TrickFlow 220's to the PRC 225's. The PRC's look to be a really good deal and should really be advertised as semi CNC'd heads instead of as cast, the chambers and valve guides are CNC'd and any transitions for the CNC work to the as cast portion along with any casting defects are hand blended.
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^AGREED^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
The PRC225 heads seem like quite a kick *** cylinder head but just don't seem to get the "check my dyno numbers" cred they deserve. I'd love to throw a set of those on a 4.8 crank/ 4.200" bore LSX block and an 80mm snail shaped muffler thingy....
The PRC225 heads seem like quite a kick *** cylinder head but just don't seem to get the "check my dyno numbers" cred they deserve. I'd love to throw a set of those on a 4.8 crank/ 4.200" bore LSX block and an 80mm snail shaped muffler thingy....
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^AGREED^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ The PRC225 heads seem like quite a kick *** cylinder head but just don't seem to get the "check my dyno numbers" cred they deserve. I'd love to throw a set of those on a 4.8 crank/ 4.200" bore LSX block and an 80mm snail shaped muffler thingy....
OP, I run the AI Dart/RHS heads, and they are bad *** for the money. Phil told me before I ordered mine that these heads are good for 10 to 15 hp over their cnc'd 232 heads.
Hm... so this all changes things a little.. I think AI Dart/RHS, Brian Tooley TFS 220's, and Texas Speed/PRC 225's are the ones that I need to research.
What is the advantage to changing the valve angle, besides piston clearance?
What does relocating the spark plug accomplish?
What is the advantage to changing the valve angle, besides piston clearance?
What does relocating the spark plug accomplish?
As the valve angle gets flatter to the piston, the chamber gets shallower. This unshrouding enhances the mid-lift flow numbers. The shape of the short side radius gets smoother and really responds to the runner being raised. Compare how GM raises the runner floor from LS1 to the LS3 and then again to the LS7. V8 packaging constraints prevent a design where the runner falls on the valve as opposed to the air moving over and turning down.
Combustion chamber shape also plays two huge roles as well.
First you want it to be large and smooth enough to unshroud the valves which are actually in the way of flow. Second it needs to be shaped in a fashion to promote compression turbulence/efficient combustion. This is why engines respond to tightening the quench clearance, it reduces the Brake Specific Fuel Consumption.
Combustion chamber shape also plays two huge roles as well.
First you want it to be large and smooth enough to unshroud the valves which are actually in the way of flow. Second it needs to be shaped in a fashion to promote compression turbulence/efficient combustion. This is why engines respond to tightening the quench clearance, it reduces the Brake Specific Fuel Consumption.
Created this to compare heads... Company A heads are flowed with no exhaust... wouldn't that make the numbers higher than if there was an exhaust pipe?
Company A, 4” bore NO EXHAUST
Intake Exhaust
.100"___68_______56
.200"___145______113
.300"___210______164
.400"___257______200
.500"___300______214
.600"___318______229
Company B 4” bore 1 7/8 exhaust
Intake Exhaust
.100"___66.7____52.5
.200"___149.4___113.1
.300"___217.6___156.3
.400"___262.7___201
.500"___297.3___247.6
.600"___311.4___273.3
Company C 4” bore 1 7/8 exhaust
Intake Exhaust
.100”___67______47
.200”___133_____104
.300”___211_____167
.400”___263_____202
.500”___297_____222
.600"___314_____233
Company A, 4” bore NO EXHAUST
Intake Exhaust
.100"___68_______56
.200"___145______113
.300"___210______164
.400"___257______200
.500"___300______214
.600"___318______229
Company B 4” bore 1 7/8 exhaust
Intake Exhaust
.100"___66.7____52.5
.200"___149.4___113.1
.300"___217.6___156.3
.400"___262.7___201
.500"___297.3___247.6
.600"___311.4___273.3
Company C 4” bore 1 7/8 exhaust
Intake Exhaust
.100”___67______47
.200”___133_____104
.300”___211_____167
.400”___263_____202
.500”___297_____222
.600"___314_____233
I'd do the TFS 220s with the hand porting (as previously stated). The rolled valve angle allows for better mid lift flow as you have a straighter shot into the cylinder.
The PRCs are nice, but I prefer much lighter valvetrain components for both power and reliability. The PRC 2.06" intake valves are a bit heavy especially compared to the 2.04" turned down LS3s you can get for the TFS.
And as I said earlier, the TFS 205s are fully CNC ported, come with smaller chambers, and the PM guides. They flow as well as any of the others listed, but with more velocity due to their mid-lift numbers and cross-sectional area.
One word of advice: don't get caught up in flow numbers. It's a waste. The numbers vary so much bench to bench. Buy what actually makes power.
I went with the TEA Stage 2s... I have yet to find anything that puts out consistently higher power than these LS6 castings (including the TFS 215s). But when I bought these, they were a better deal. If I had to do it today, the TFS 220s is what I'd do.
The PRCs are nice, but I prefer much lighter valvetrain components for both power and reliability. The PRC 2.06" intake valves are a bit heavy especially compared to the 2.04" turned down LS3s you can get for the TFS.
And as I said earlier, the TFS 205s are fully CNC ported, come with smaller chambers, and the PM guides. They flow as well as any of the others listed, but with more velocity due to their mid-lift numbers and cross-sectional area.
One word of advice: don't get caught up in flow numbers. It's a waste. The numbers vary so much bench to bench. Buy what actually makes power.
I went with the TEA Stage 2s... I have yet to find anything that puts out consistently higher power than these LS6 castings (including the TFS 215s). But when I bought these, they were a better deal. If I had to do it today, the TFS 220s is what I'd do.