JPR 427 Coming Apart....Literally
Man oh man.... it seems really a trip that some folks (noone here that Im aware of) used to go on aand on about MTI being expensive.
Based on my experiences with ARE and the experiences y'all have had with JPR and MMS...
MTI is the bargain of the century. Its why I send my car and work there from OREGON.
I feel bad for each of you. I ended up in a similar, but not quite as expensive situation with ARE. I have never regretted cutting all ties adn just handing my car over to the most qualified shop I could find, reguardless of price.
In the end, the cheapest rarely *is* the cheapest.
Based on my experiences with ARE and the experiences y'all have had with JPR and MMS...
MTI is the bargain of the century. Its why I send my car and work there from OREGON.
I feel bad for each of you. I ended up in a similar, but not quite as expensive situation with ARE. I have never regretted cutting all ties adn just handing my car over to the most qualified shop I could find, reguardless of price.
In the end, the cheapest rarely *is* the cheapest.
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Agreed, IN THE END, the cheapest isnt always the cvheapest. I am finding out the hard way. Its costing me $3500 plus parts for the damage that was done. This is crazy. Add parts and we are at $4500-$5000 more. 
I know you gotta be bumming, Bear. It will work out in the end. I have a bunch more parts on the way, and my heads are going to TEA to get flowed before I get them. I am getting cosmetic gaskets with them so I should be good, right? Will run NPG for sure.
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From: NV
Originally Posted by OSR 1
Head gaskets aside the main damage to Bear engine was from aluinuim in the pump and pan which came from the #8 piston hitting the reluctor wheel
Diamond clearanced the piston as they always do but it is never enough it always needs final fit and finshing . I have never had a 4 inch stroke piston that didnt need a couple of hours of finish work
Diamond clearanced the piston as they always do but it is never enough it always needs final fit and finshing . I have never had a 4 inch stroke piston that didnt need a couple of hours of finish work
Sure glad to hear about Bear (and others) finally getting their motors straigtened out and done correctly. There sure were a bunch of pitfalls just waiting to bite people in the *** on these wet sleeved strokers, I.E., the Cometic gasket vs. Fel Pro fiasco.
I guess this was a learning process for everyone, including Darton and others. I got caught up in the middle of it with my 427, but seem to have dodged the bullets and found out about the problem areas in time to avoid them. I was familiar with Evans coolant from other projects, and insisted on it before they ever manufactured the race type, and had to send my regular NPG back in and trade it for the new thinner viscosity racing coolant. Also went with one of there first WP setups, and the Evans 160* Stat, when they got it done. Anyone contemplating one of these Darton sleeved strokers now, have the benefit of many trial & error problems from the beginning, and have folks like Bear and others to thank for blazing the trail at great personal expense and GRIEF/STRESS 
Hopefully the road ahead will be much smoother from now on out.
It has been blood, sweat & tears up until now. Thread Starter
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Here are the pics that a fellow JPR'r took for me. It is hard to see the sleeve damage on these pics, but the piston damage..... 
Last edited by Bear; Jun 10, 2004 at 10:06 PM.
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Cannibal, if u wanna know how to link 16 rooms of Audio/Video equipment, Im your man. I wear a shirt and tie for a living. God blessed me with a BIG ******* mouth. I can talk for days on end about nothing to anyone, Its who I am. I am not terribly gifted with tools or my hands. More like retarded if you ask anyone whose ever had the "pleasure" of installing my 16 room AV link systems. My Dad on the other hand was a sheet metal mechanic his whole life. He could fix anything if he had the tools. I need help with my car, I am no fool, I choose to pay people to do something I cant. 
In answer to your question, I have no ******* idea about what a clearanced pistion should look like!!!!
In answer to your question, I have no ******* idea about what a clearanced pistion should look like!!!!
Thats an abortion.Pistons are supposed to be machined and smoothed neatly and wegihed to make sure they are within a certain weight.Are all 8 clearence or just this one piston.Looks like the reluctor wheel got that baby,This was and is SHOTTY work,An absolute discrace.Ask Steve about this stuff bear or the guys at esp,The will tell u there own opinion of that mess,It was thrown together with no concern to detial.
Get your 1000 bucks and start over.
Its a terrible lesson learned,Stay away from HACKS.
Get your 1000 bucks and start over.
Its a terrible lesson learned,Stay away from HACKS.
Last edited by JS; Jun 10, 2004 at 11:29 PM.
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Originally Posted by Bear
Cannibal, if u wanna know how to link 16 rooms of Audio/Video equipment, Im your man. I wear a shirt and tie for a living. God blessed me with a BIG ******* mouth. I can talk for days on end about nothing to anyone, Its who I am. I am not terribly gifted with tools or my hands. More like retarded if you ask anyone whose ever had the "pleasure" of installing my 16 room AV link systems. My Dad on the other hand was a sheet metal mechanic his whole life. He could fix anything if he had the tools. I need help with my car, I am no fool, I choose to pay people to do something I cant.
In answer to your question, I have no ******* idea about what a clearanced pistion should look like!!!!
In answer to your question, I have no ******* idea about what a clearanced pistion should look like!!!!
Very nicely put! and No..those are just straight up stress risers..they should be smoothed....by the looks of it though..kinda seems like the reluctor wheel did a little clearancing of it's own?Carter
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From: CT
Gold finger
I use Diamond pistons in all my motors and we clearance #8 because on the 4 inch strokes it is not clearanced enough but with a little work it clears fine ( we made 850 hp and went 8.90 with a diamond piston in our LS1 car
Joe prince must of saw that it was machined and never checked the clearance
because all those marks are from the reluctor wheel (I wonder if Joe Prince was a drinker)
I use Diamond pistons in all my motors and we clearance #8 because on the 4 inch strokes it is not clearanced enough but with a little work it clears fine ( we made 850 hp and went 8.90 with a diamond piston in our LS1 car
Joe prince must of saw that it was machined and never checked the clearance
because all those marks are from the reluctor wheel (I wonder if Joe Prince was a drinker)
FWIW, when Joe sent me my Diamond pistons a month ago, he wrote a note reminding me to check the clearance on #8. So it would seem that he would have checked it on Bears motor. I don't know the real deal either way, just thought I'd throw that out there.
Easy to say that after a disaster,I hope he rebalanced all 8 after clearancing #8.Bravo I gotta hand it to u,your as blind as a bat.This is shotty crappy work,thank GOD your having someone else build your 1yr old fully paid for no warrantied stroker.
Bear OSR is gonna make that baby scream.
I wish that motor was going in my car
Bear OSR is gonna make that baby scream.
I wish that motor was going in my car
Originally Posted by JS
Easy to say that after a disaster,I hope he rebalanced all 8 after clearancing #8.Bravo I gotta hand it to u,your as blind as a bat.This is shotty crappy work,thank GOD your having someone else build your 1yr old fully paid for no warrantied stroker.
I was told by him to check the number 8 in early May. So unless I'm mistaken (could be), he did not tell me that AFTER this disaster with Bears was discovered. I'm not defending him or anyone else or saying he did a good job building the motor. Come on dude, don't insult my intelligence. Just putting out info.
Originally Posted by JS
Fair enough,U actually had a gaurdian angel watching over u.Even though it took a yr to get your parts having someone else build the engine was a blessing in disquise.
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Well its time for an update. The motor is back from R.E.D. and is off being balanced and align honed. I had to "clean up" the block and get new pistons. I ordered a new 90mm intake and Tb since it was apart. I added a bigger, meaner cam and some small other details. I never recieved the money or main caps from JPR. I've had it with him and his BS. I left him a lovely message saying not to bother sending me money or the parts. He is a piece of **** and I want nothing more from him. I paid for the pistons myself and the damage to the block. This whole thing has taken a ridiculous amount of time because of all the bs. The pistons are a custom bore size so that took forever. The shipping of the block to and from CA was shitty. All in all this project has sidelined my car for a 2nd straight racing season. It should be done in early Oct. I am going to Amsterdam then so I plan on picking up the car when I get back around the 15th or so. Steve says that I need a solid 3000 miles on the motor to properly break it in, THEN I can race. It will be a long wait for the 3000 miles. I will also have no speedo or odometer after I get the TH400 installed, so that should be fun trying to guess how many miles I put on. Well thats my update. See you guys at the track in the spring. Later, Bear
I cant imagine what u have into this stroker..
Its gotta be sickening....
Get a GM Truck speed sensor and adapt it to the F-car so u can run the speedo.
Your in my prayers Brother...
Its gotta be sickening....
Get a GM Truck speed sensor and adapt it to the F-car so u can run the speedo.
Your in my prayers Brother...
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Originally Posted by OSR 1
Diamond clearanced the piston as they always do but it is never enough it always needs final fit and finshing . I have never had a 4 inch stroke piston that didnt need a couple of hours of finish work
wouldnt this be noticed during assembly when the motor was being turned over by hand?
