Lifter Shootout which lifter and why? Everyone's opinions welcome
05-04-2015, 09:44 AM
#26
Thanks martin! Did you just go at it with a dremel? I think what I might do is mock the heads up with everything and see where they rub then take them back off and clearance them.
Pretty excited about this setup.... Even though I sold the jesels, the money was right and the yella terras should be good. The pac 1206x should make for a pretty strong stable curve.
I do have to admit I was a little scared when you told me the open pressure on them with the shims but since you guys run that combo frequently, I trust ya lol.
Pretty excited about this setup.... Even though I sold the jesels, the money was right and the yella terras should be good. The pac 1206x should make for a pretty strong stable curve.
I do have to admit I was a little scared when you told me the open pressure on them with the shims but since you guys run that combo frequently, I trust ya lol.
05-04-2015, 10:00 AM
#27
Let's clear up a few things.
The 5315's is a good lifter but it is still based on the OEM type design with a .700" wheel. ANY lifter like this is going to be limited to amount of lobe intensity you throw at it. The lifter is also limited to amount of spring pressure it can take.
Morel failure rate. This is Bull. I supply over 1000 sets of LS Morel lifters to many of vendors on this board. If there was a huge issue I would see it. It is true that Morel had some issues with the swedge axle design backing out on the 5290's. NOw was it the lifters fault or was it the customers fault in trying to use a budget lifter on a serious build. Some think since it is a link bar lifter it can do anything. Wrong. It is a street lifter designed for mild lobe profiles and peak of 6500 rpm. That is the intent of the lifter.
2 years ago Morel went from a swedged axle design, OEM technology, to a wire lock design that is used on the high end lifters that are run in Cup.
This year the 5315's and 5290 received another improvement after years of testing in the Truck and Xfinity series. This new design increases the service life of the lifter.
Morel has damn few customers. They are not accepting any new customer because at this point they can't keep up. They have turned down several companies that wanted direct accounts because they simply can't supply what customers they have now. Why make it worse.
These rumors of quality issues are just that rumors. I feel that the some people haven't gotten bent out of shape because they can't buy Morel direct like they can other manufacturers. Again my opinion but I do know this, more money can be made on products that you buy direct.
The 5315's is a good lifter but it is still based on the OEM type design with a .700" wheel. ANY lifter like this is going to be limited to amount of lobe intensity you throw at it. The lifter is also limited to amount of spring pressure it can take.
Morel failure rate. This is Bull. I supply over 1000 sets of LS Morel lifters to many of vendors on this board. If there was a huge issue I would see it. It is true that Morel had some issues with the swedge axle design backing out on the 5290's. NOw was it the lifters fault or was it the customers fault in trying to use a budget lifter on a serious build. Some think since it is a link bar lifter it can do anything. Wrong. It is a street lifter designed for mild lobe profiles and peak of 6500 rpm. That is the intent of the lifter.
2 years ago Morel went from a swedged axle design, OEM technology, to a wire lock design that is used on the high end lifters that are run in Cup.
This year the 5315's and 5290 received another improvement after years of testing in the Truck and Xfinity series. This new design increases the service life of the lifter.
Morel has damn few customers. They are not accepting any new customer because at this point they can't keep up. They have turned down several companies that wanted direct accounts because they simply can't supply what customers they have now. Why make it worse.
These rumors of quality issues are just that rumors. I feel that the some people haven't gotten bent out of shape because they can't buy Morel direct like they can other manufacturers. Again my opinion but I do know this, more money can be made on products that you buy direct.
05-04-2015, 10:00 AM
#28
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Johnson ST2116lsr (.053) travel preload unknown - preload with that is around .035 or so cold in an aluminum block. I set mine for .034-038 across the board and it'll grow as it heats up to close to .028-.032" or so.
I would advise against the 5290s. They have a lot of failures on this site. They are a cast body as well. If you're going to do that, might as well just get the LS7s.
But I think the link bars are worth the money. So stepping up to a 5206 or the Johnson 2110s or better would be worth it.
Also, I got my ST2116LSRs for the same price as the 5206s. I was able to sell off my 5206s and offset the swap. For the price (if they are within $100 of each other) it's not a contest. You do the ST2116s every. single. day.
I would advise against the 5290s. They have a lot of failures on this site. They are a cast body as well. If you're going to do that, might as well just get the LS7s.
But I think the link bars are worth the money. So stepping up to a 5206 or the Johnson 2110s or better would be worth it.
Also, I got my ST2116LSRs for the same price as the 5206s. I was able to sell off my 5206s and offset the swap. For the price (if they are within $100 of each other) it's not a contest. You do the ST2116s every. single. day.
05-04-2015, 10:43 AM
#30
Although unless you're going really radical the 2116 is a fine option. The 5206 and the st2116 are normally the same price with the 2116 being cheaper but it still only has .093 of travel. Personally I'd like to have a little more travel so I can screw with the preload more. But its still a lot less than a 5315 at .200 or 5290 at .150
05-04-2015, 10:56 AM
#31
Let's clear up a few things.
The 5315's is a good lifter but it is still based on the OEM type design with a .700" wheel. ANY lifter like this is going to be limited to amount of lobe intensity you throw at it. The lifter is also limited to amount of spring pressure it can take.
Morel failure rate. This is Bull. I supply over 1000 sets of LS Morel lifters to many of vendors on this board. If there was a huge issue I would see it. It is true that Morel had some issues with the swedge axle design backing out on the 5290's. NOw was it the lifters fault or was it the customers fault in trying to use a budget lifter on a serious build. Some think since it is a link bar lifter it can do anything. Wrong. It is a street lifter designed for mild lobe profiles and peak of 6500 rpm. That is the intent of the lifter.
2 years ago Morel went from a swedged axle design, OEM technology, to a wire lock design that is used on the high end lifters that are run in Cup.
This year the 5315's and 5290 received another improvement after years of testing in the Truck and Xfinity series. This new design increases the service life of the lifter.
Morel has damn few customers. They are not accepting any new customer because at this point they can't keep up. They have turned down several companies that wanted direct accounts because they simply can't supply what customers they have now. Why make it worse.
These rumors of quality issues are just that rumors. I feel that the some people haven't gotten bent out of shape because they can't buy Morel direct like they can other manufacturers. Again my opinion but I do know this, more money can be made on products that you buy direct.
The 5315's is a good lifter but it is still based on the OEM type design with a .700" wheel. ANY lifter like this is going to be limited to amount of lobe intensity you throw at it. The lifter is also limited to amount of spring pressure it can take.
Morel failure rate. This is Bull. I supply over 1000 sets of LS Morel lifters to many of vendors on this board. If there was a huge issue I would see it. It is true that Morel had some issues with the swedge axle design backing out on the 5290's. NOw was it the lifters fault or was it the customers fault in trying to use a budget lifter on a serious build. Some think since it is a link bar lifter it can do anything. Wrong. It is a street lifter designed for mild lobe profiles and peak of 6500 rpm. That is the intent of the lifter.
2 years ago Morel went from a swedged axle design, OEM technology, to a wire lock design that is used on the high end lifters that are run in Cup.
This year the 5315's and 5290 received another improvement after years of testing in the Truck and Xfinity series. This new design increases the service life of the lifter.
Morel has damn few customers. They are not accepting any new customer because at this point they can't keep up. They have turned down several companies that wanted direct accounts because they simply can't supply what customers they have now. Why make it worse.
These rumors of quality issues are just that rumors. I feel that the some people haven't gotten bent out of shape because they can't buy Morel direct like they can other manufacturers. Again my opinion but I do know this, more money can be made on products that you buy direct.
For Instance, I am running a XE lobe 224/228 112 cam with a 155/380 .650 dual spring. I am using the SLP 1.85 stock style rocker arm so the lobe intensity is increased but should still be around 50-51. Which is still a bit milder then a XE-R of 49. Total lift comes in around .580 and duration ends up around 227/231 @ .050. My research came up with this lifter being a good choice, but I had to dig to find it.
Again it would be nice if the lifter capabilities were provided by the Vendors in the description.
Last edited by kinglt-1; 05-05-2015 at 11:23 PM.
05-04-2015, 11:13 AM
#32
Exactly, I;m going off what I was wtold by very trusted people who, just like others on here use these lifters in builds every day. If they tell me that they have more problems with the morels, a lifter I wasnt even considering in the first place what are they really gaining? So there is no point in them lying.
But ya morel doesnt say anything about hte rev limit. The stock ls6 lifter went to 6600, the ls7 went to 7000, and the ls3 still goes to 6700 all in stock form. Now those engines all use light parts, I understand that however you're basically telling me in a blanket statement a 5315 cant duplicate those same things. Why make a lifter and promote it as a performance piece if its not even rated for what the stock ones could handle.
But ya morel doesnt say anything about hte rev limit. The stock ls6 lifter went to 6600, the ls7 went to 7000, and the ls3 still goes to 6700 all in stock form. Now those engines all use light parts, I understand that however you're basically telling me in a blanket statement a 5315 cant duplicate those same things. Why make a lifter and promote it as a performance piece if its not even rated for what the stock ones could handle.
05-04-2015, 11:19 AM
#33
I'd like to know who is telling you that a 5315 can't handle what a factory lifter can? I don't think that is what Chris is implying, but I could be wrong?
I have more engines than I can count running around using 5315's in place of factory lifters. Heck we have even pulled other companies drop in lifters out and replaced them with 5315's and picked up power across the board.
I have more engines than I can count running around using 5315's in place of factory lifters. Heck we have even pulled other companies drop in lifters out and replaced them with 5315's and picked up power across the board.
05-04-2015, 12:29 PM
#36
What is the max amount of spring pressure the 5315 can handle? The only issue I see is this kind of information is not provided with the lifter. It would be nice if the lifters had a max spring pressure and rpm rating in their description.
For Instance, I am running a XE lobe 224/228 112 cam with a 155/380 .650 dual spring. I am using the SLP 1.85 stock style rocker arm so the lobe intensity is increased but should still be around 51-52. Which is still quite a bit milder then a XE-R of 49. Total lift comes in around .580 and duration ends up around 227/231 @ .050. My research came up with this lifter being a good choice, but I had to dig to find it.
Again it would be nice if the lifter capabilities were provided by the Vendors in the description.
For Instance, I am running a XE lobe 224/228 112 cam with a 155/380 .650 dual spring. I am using the SLP 1.85 stock style rocker arm so the lobe intensity is increased but should still be around 51-52. Which is still quite a bit milder then a XE-R of 49. Total lift comes in around .580 and duration ends up around 227/231 @ .050. My research came up with this lifter being a good choice, but I had to dig to find it.
Again it would be nice if the lifter capabilities were provided by the Vendors in the description.
Any of the street series Morels I would not recommend over 150# seat pressure.
05-04-2015, 12:33 PM
#37
I'd like to know who is telling you that a 5315 can't handle what a factory lifter can? I don't think that is what Chris is implying, but I could be wrong?
I have more engines than I can count running around using 5315's in place of factory lifters. Heck we have even pulled other companies drop in lifters out and replaced them with 5315's and picked up power across the board.
I have more engines than I can count running around using 5315's in place of factory lifters. Heck we have even pulled other companies drop in lifters out and replaced them with 5315's and picked up power across the board.
Just in case you havent noticed I'm the one who bought the 1206's this morning lmao
05-04-2015, 12:36 PM
#38
See thats the thing though, lots of springs exceed 150. And we still want to know about the rpm range many cam only guys spin over 6500 so is the 5315 still ok? I would say yes as is the ls7. Its confusing when people selling morels or even making them sya they're fine for cam swaps and higher spring rates but then turn around and say they have a 6200-6500 rpm limit. Pretty much every cam build exceeds those rpms
05-04-2015, 12:43 PM
#39
Exactly, I;m going off what I was wtold by very trusted people who, just like others on here use these lifters in builds every day. If they tell me that they have more problems with the morels, a lifter I wasnt even considering in the first place what are they really gaining? So there is no point in them lying.
But ya morel doesnt say anything about hte rev limit. The stock ls6 lifter went to 6600, the ls7 went to 7000, and the ls3 still goes to 6700 all in stock form. Now those engines all use light parts, I understand that however you're basically telling me in a blanket statement a 5315 cant duplicate those same things. Why make a lifter and promote it as a performance piece if its not even rated for what the stock ones could handle.
But ya morel doesnt say anything about hte rev limit. The stock ls6 lifter went to 6600, the ls7 went to 7000, and the ls3 still goes to 6700 all in stock form. Now those engines all use light parts, I understand that however you're basically telling me in a blanket statement a 5315 cant duplicate those same things. Why make a lifter and promote it as a performance piece if its not even rated for what the stock ones could handle.
I sold over 500 sets of 5315's last year. I had 1 set come back listed at noisey. So my return rate on mores is .002%
The LS enjoys a large cam core and light valvetrain. Because of this some feel they can run much more aggressive cam profiles on these lobes. And I agree, they can, BUT you need to put a lifter that is going to take the lobe intensity that your throwing at the engine. Match the lifter with the cam profile.
05-04-2015, 12:46 PM
#40
See thats the thing though, lots of springs exceed 150. And we still want to know about the rpm range many cam only guys spin over 6500 so is the 5315 still ok? I would say yes as is the ls7. Its confusing when people selling morels or even making them sya they're fine for cam swaps and higher spring rates but then turn around and say they have a 6200-6500 rpm limit. Pretty much every cam build exceeds those rpms