Great information Tony! Comparing his dyno graph, to my base line graph, on my 383, something doesn't seem right. Of coarse we don't have the same setup, or the same dyno, or part of the country, but somewhat similar. Maybe. Mostly I was also comparing the tq curve. His setup is actually beating me in tq under 3500 rpm. After that my curve takes off. Something doesn't seem right. Of coarse the pyramid at 5600 as well. I think it's a good compare. Let's say you moved the curve up 30-40 hp, wondering maybe a weak dyno, the tq#'s would not make sense for a 383.

Can't wait to see the results.

 

That's what I'm saying. There could be something else wrong. It's best to troubleshoot that and get it fixed before changing a bunch of variables. That's no way to troubleshoot.

 

Fact of the matter is below 5600 RPM's nothing looks amiss in the slightest.

Perhaps the dyno is stingy....perhaps the valvejob is butchered on the heads....maybe he is getting alot of knock retard. There are countless variables but assuming he gets a baseline at the same dyno he runs the final combination on, there is still plenty of comparison to be drawn because nothing would change below 5600.....anything that could be fixed or sorted out would only help his current combo carry better past 5600 and looking at the curve and the information, the numbers would likely fall right in line with what I discussed in my previous post (peak power around 60000 or so).

Now maybe on a different dyno the whole baseline (and peak figures) would be higher or lower, but as long as he dyno's before and after on the same dyno its all good.

Also, for a guy that's stretching to buy all the right parts for the new combo.....spending time or money sorting out the old combo is kind of fruitless. That money is better spent in hollow valves or a ported FAST for the new combination.

Jake....this guy never said he wanted to compare and do a more "scientific" comparison between the two combinations.....he only provided the old data as helpful reference and I'm thrilled if we simply get the new combo on the same dyno whether it be a stingy dyno or one that reads a tad optimistic....as long as both runs are on the same equipment, it represents a valid apples to apples comparison to draw conclusions from and the net gains are what we all should be focusing on as well as the shape of the curve which I anticipate will change dramatically.

-Tony

 

I found out a long time ago no matter what I do or spend there is going to be a bunch of people that did more and got better "Numbers" or a faster car. FWIW I think the dyno was a little stingy. A Maggie LS1 GTO made 390 RWHP and a built small block old Camaro with a ProCharger made 427. A 480 c.i. S-10 made in the low 400s. As to comparisons we are going to be changing the cam as well so heads to heads comparisons aren't really going to be there. BTW I don't have a warm-fuzzy about the current cam in this car. I think it's beating up the valve train a lot for what it does.

What I'm going for is seeing what Tony can do with my current setup with a new cam and heads which are the major components of the engine, and maybe if the mod bug and funds happen some day tweak on it. I don't have the money to do this and fix the current issues even if it's something as "minor" as springs and valve seats. It also just wouldn't make sense seeing I'm replacing everything in the valve train but the lifters. I can say that even with the current build this car is a blast to drive on the street and I just want a fun, reliable solid build. If I wanted a race car I would have gotten a robot driven automatic. I already can't fit on any bigger tires so the new build is going to be interesting.

Let's just keep the powder dry and see where this little 383 ENDS UP. Now that we know that there are issues and where it dynoed maybe I should give a list of exactly where it started.

*LS6 block honed to 3.903
*Callies Compstar 4" stroke crank
*Callies H-beam rods
*Clevite coated bearings
*Wiseco -8cc pistons and rings
*243 58cc heads w/a so-so CNC 2.02 intake, stock exhaust valves
*Cometic .040 head gaskets
*FTI Hellraiser cam 229/236 .631/.631 111 LSA
*72532 Lunati (Morel) High RPM Hydraulic Link Bar Lifters
*CompCams 5/16" push rods
*Stock rockers w/Harland Sharp trunion upgrade
*Lunati dual valve springs w/Ti retainers
*FAST 102
*Nick Williams 102
*SD MAFless tune
*My "Svede" airbox ducted to the front grills
*SLP 1.75" long tube headers
*2 1/2" duals with Pypes X-pipe !cats
*Borla Pro XS mufflers
*Ford "Greentops" 42# injectors
*SLP underdrive pulley
*Melling oil pump
*RollMaster adj. timing set
*LS2 chain dampener
*All ARP bolts and head studs
*23# billet flywheel
*McLeod RST twin disk clutch
*Tremec T-56 6 speed trans
*DriveShaft Shop 1 piece aluminum drive shaft
*DiffTech 3.91 gears
*NGK TR6 plugs w/Taylor wires

*3,750# car 200# 65 y.o. driver

Where we're going:

*Mamo Motorsports 220 heads w/light weight valves and Ti retainers
*TonySpec cam
*Yella Terra Ultra Lite rockers
*11/32" .120 walled push rods

*Wish List: ATI underdrive (taking donations!)

 

All that really matters is if you are happy. That looks like a really solid parts list. Always great to get all the details. Good luck man, can't wait to see the outcome.

One of the only things I myself overlooked was also an ATI super damper. Wish I would have had it on the motor since the get go. Just received one, now just have to install.

 

Ya and it's a PITA to install at least on my car. Pulling the radiator isn't horrible but you have to get the condenser for the AC out of the way by bending the lines and praying. I don't want to have to do this a bunch of times.

 

Kind of a noob question, but what makes the ATI so much better than say a powerbond or any other brand?

 

The quality!! Reliability is top notch also. A ATI balancer is really balanced to perfection directly from them. The are heavier than a powerbond also. I know a guy with a cheap balancer on his car ..... looking at the serpentine belt you'll see a little wobble/misalignment from the side of the motor. His car have slung a couple of belts before too. Otherwise my car have a ATI balancer that never slung a belt and looking at the balancer while the motor is running the belt is just as straight as a arrow.

 

here here! I noticed less vibrations than stock damper, and it finally got rid of three years worth of belt squeal

 

I would be interested in your 243's if selling

 

I have a local that said he wanted them. If it falls through I'll get a hold of you.

 

Shootz!!!

 

Look what showed up today. I'm going to cover all the bases on the valve train. Now just waiting on Tony. . .

 

Subbed...
Dyno'd mine this weekend on a different dyno and got a sad number from previous dyno session...

I also have a 383...
Previous numbers were almost 487hp and like 429tq (done on a dynopak)
This dyno showed 423hp and 403 tq (done on a dynojet)
Not sure what the difference is however I need to make some changes...
I wanted to be closer to the 600 mark N/A

So I want to see where these heads put you at as that is the next big thing on the list for me.

Sorry to hijack a bit...

 

I'm getting anxious. I can hear winter howling. LOL. I'm going to be putting them on as soon as I can after getting them. There'll be the wait for push rods and whatever. Then I'll have to get my tune dialed in and find a DynoJet within reasonable driving distance. I'm hoping for high 400s to 500. 600 IMHO would be hard to impossible NA with a LS1.

 

I'm no expert, and have no personal experience with the hellraiser cam, but I have to agree that it's doing nothing more than beating up your valvetrain.

And, in my opinion, that cam has too much exhaust bias for what a cathedral port head needs. A 232/236 .631/.631 113 would probably be closer to what you want. Once again, just my under-educated, over-voiced opinion.

Definitely in for your results with the mamo motorsports top end.

 

I've had very good results before with Ed Curtis' cams and my results may have more to do with the springs but it did have a lot of lift for the 243 heads I have now. I already got the new cam from Tony. It's a 235/240 .620/.615 113+1. I'm just waiting on the heads which he said should be ready soon as I only want to take things apart once and spew coolant all over.

I have to pull the oil pump off to re-degree my crank gear. (it's at -2 now) I'm not looking forward to that. R&R of a pump on an engine stand is a piece of cake. On a GTO with limited ability to drop the oil pan it's a major PITA.

 

I like the looks of that cam, and can't wait to see what it does with the new heads.

What's your final static compression ratio?

 

From my calculations static is about 11.5:1 using .040 x 4.160 gaskets.

 

Whoo hoo! Heads are done! I just have to get the money out to him and start ordering my other parts. It's going to be happening soon! #happydance