warind8191

Hey all, I tried the search function (both here and google) but can't really find anything specific to what I'm looking for. I recently bought a rebuilt short block from a local/private seller, and he assured me that everything in the lower end of the motor (rods, mains, etc..) was assembled correctly. I have no reason to think that anything to the contrary was done, but it would make me feel a whole lot better if knew for sure that it was. I would just hate to get this motor all together and then have it grenade on me. All the fasteners, as far as I can tell, are the typical TTY type so my question is this. Is there any way to check these to make sure they were done correctly? If I'm not mistaken, once a TTY bolt has been used.. it's done for. So taking them apart and going back through the tightening sequence again would not be possible, right?

Any insight into this would be greatly appreciated.

G Atsma

I would check that they were torqued to spec. Check with an ACCURATE torque wrench set to the max spec for that particular bolt. No way to check for over-torqueing, though.

warind8191

Would that work for a TTY bolt though? They are all torque plus angle, so unless I'm mistaken you wouldn't know what the ending torque reading would be. If this is possible, is there some kind of list somewhere that shows what the proper torque reading would be?

JC316

iTrader: (1)

It's my personal opinion that the TTY bolts are the biggest crock of **** in the mechanic world. The aluminum in the block is softer than than the steel bolt, so how exactly is the damned thing going to stretch? Hell, Fel Pro put 15Klbs of load on their bolt and it stretched 1mm. I've personally reused them in the past and never had a single issue.

I will change them if they're cheap enough, but I certainly wouldn't worry about it unless you're planning a high HP build. Of course if you are, you'd be better off with ARP hardware.

KCS

iTrader: (20)

You can't really check bolts torqued to an angle, you would just have to back them off and retighten. It's seems to me that black bolts (mains, rods, rockers, etc) are reusable, they just torque to an angle value, but not to yield. I've reused the main bolts many times without any problems.

cookseyb

Replace them with ARP if you don't trust the TTY, which I don't. If you are worried the bolt threads are deforming the block threads use studs.

warind8191

Excellent, that's what I've been looking for. This is my first time dealing with this whole torque plus angle/TTY thing and didn't realize there was a difference. I just assumed that if the specs called for a bolt that was torqued, and then angled was a TTY bolt.

Thanks for the info, makes me feel a lot better about busting into these to check them.

Che70velle

iTrader: (6)

But their designed to be a one time use, correct? So you, in theory, can’t back them off, and re-do them. I personally don’t like them, speaking of the headbolts, and I buy the arp bolts for each build.
I am however using Oem mains currently on my nephews 6 liter build, but only because he’s strapped for cash.

mOtOrHeAd MiKe

iTrader: (8)

I just reused a set of TTY bolts in a junkyard turbo 5.3L (Gen III, still on the stand) over the holidays. I started by marking the heads with a sharpie and went through the proper tightening procedure using angles (holes chase, threads cleaned, and lubed with ARP Permatorque on the threads, shoulders and under the heads) - then out of morbid curiousity I grabbed a torque wrench.

An M11 bolt should be around 80-85 ft/lbs wet.

The reused TTY bolts broke away at:

88ft/lbs on the long bolts; and
76ft/lbs on the short bolts.

So there you go... totally scientific. But, will they hold under boost?

KCS

iTrader: (20)

I don't think so. Just because they torque to an angle value does not mean they are torqued to yield. For example, K1 connecting rods come ARP bolts and instructions to torque them to an angle, but they can be reused because the bolts do not reach their yield point. I think the LS main and rod bolts are the same way.

Darth_V8r

iTrader: (4)

100% correct. The first bit of bolt stretch is "elastic", meaning it will return to its original length. The easiest way to tell is to compare a used, properly torqued bolt to an unused bolt.

A few years back, I effed up the head installation, using a brand new set of OE head bolts. I asked the same question, and never got a straight answer, so I decided to grab a new set of bolts to be safe. The new bolts were about 1/16" shorter on average than the ones I removed. So, by definition, they had yielded.

Che70velle

iTrader: (6)

My bad guys. I thought that the Oem headbolts are TTY, not TTA.

KCS

iTrader: (20)

As far as I know, the head bolts are TTY. The bolts in the bottom end don't seem to be though. They can be and are often reused.

farmington

iTrader: (14)

yes. the only bolts that are tty are the head bolts, so your shortblock should have all normal fasteners. check their torque and run it.

computerz

also, the oem balancer bolt is tty.

1FastBrick

iTrader: (16)

After turning all the bolts to the desired degree, I run a Torque wrench over them very carefully to find the value where they start to move. run the torque range up slowly. Then back off 1 Ft Lbs and then check them all to see that they are in the same torque range.

I at least feel better knowing that none are loose. And if one or two do move a little to reach that desired torque range, I feel better knowing it won't come loose.

The Biggest thing I have found for consistency is the Bolt holes in the block must be thoroughly cleaned with the proper size Bolt Chase.

A.R. Shale Targa

iTrader: (2)

Also putting EPL (extreme pressure lubricant) under the bolt shoulder helps the stretching process to feel more consistent. TTY you want material stretch not resistance to rotation

mOtOrHeAd MiKe

iTrader: (8)

Couldn't agree more. I did this with the new TTY bolts on our TBSS' Procharged LS2 and the LS1 in the wagon - that and taking the orange (locking ?) compound off the threads.

They haven't blown up - yet.

warind8191

Great info everyone, thanks for the input on this!