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I've picked up a 5.3 from the local junk yard to build up a dirt late model circle track engine. We plan to bore it out to 5.7. It has 706 castech heads on it right now (little battery icon). My plan "A" before I saw the castech heads was to send them out to Texas Speed for CNC and bigger valves and run with them. I'm concerned about spending $1,300.00 on heads that might crack. Is my concern misplaced ?
Any thoughts on what would be a good set of budget heads for this application ? I'd like to get into the mid-to-high 500's on HP with a good wide power band to get me off the corners. I have no need for idle quality at all
I'm kind of doing something new here as the racing series just changed the rules to allow LS setups. Engine will be going in this vvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvv
Thanks ddnspider .. with nearly 8k posts I'm going to assume you know what you're talking about
Na, no idea Seriously, its just not worth the risk when used heads are abundantly available. Maybe a vendor will let you use them as a core or something, but otherwise just find a set you like and youll avoid a headache.
Hold up. Let’s talk rules. Give me a link to the rules you are running with. I raced pavement late models in multiple engine classes.
And as far as that battery symbol goes, every set of GM heads I’ve ever owned had that symbol in them, from my multiple sets of 317’s, 706’s, 823’s, even my GM ls7 heads had the symbol, among others. Maybe some don’t have it?
test post .. it looks like my reply to che70velle is being moderated or something ?
anyway, i was trying to post a photo of the 706 heads i have, and the board isn't letting me. che70velle .. there are no rules for my class other than steel block on the LS option. so any head is fine (that fits in my budget .. and I'd like to keep it under $1,500 for an assembled and ready to go set)
hopefully the moderator will get my photo (approved ?) and put the post up.
test post .. it looks like my reply to che70velle is being moderated or something ?
Hopefully the moderator will get my photo (approved ?) and put the post up.
thanks !
Yeah, you need a certain post count (NO idea what it is... ) to post pics.
Yeah, you need a certain post count (NO idea what it is... ) to post pics.
ok .. it let me do the first one, but i think in that instance i pointed it at a URL instead of UL'ing the pic. i'll host the other to so i can get them up.
So...iron block, and any LS Head, or any GM ls Head? Any carburetor? Any compression?
Iron block. Any head. Any carb ( I already have a 750 Race Demon) Any compression, but I'd like to stay on pump gas for economy purposes.
I do realize that you could build a 900 horse motor under the rules, but I'm trying to do it on the cheap. Planning to run this 5.3 short block I got bored out to 5.7, stock crank, new pistons for the bigger bore, stock rods, ARP rod bolts, and some heads I hope to grab under $1,750 for an assembled set.
Here's what it says right from the rules :
Engine Packages
Any 23* head legal.(LS heads are legal)
Roller Cams are legal
No dry sumps allowed at all
No aluminum blocks
Rev Limitations
6800 chip for a crate motor,
7200 for any engine with a bore bigger than 4.070,
7800 for any engine with a bore of 4.070 or smaller.
The weight rule
2250 Weight Crate Motors
2300 Weight for engines with steel cylinder heads
2350 Weight for engines with aluminum cylinder heads
LS Motor Rules
2350lbs
7200 Chip
12’’ Spoiler
5.3 & 6.0 Cast iron blocks only
(No Weight In Front of Motor Plate Required)
Where are you located? If you have a local pull your own salvage yard you might be able to score a 6.0 for a reasonable price, I worked at one for 5 years and they sold a few and the price was $250 complete with all accessories. Spend the money on oil control and a cooler if you want it to last. Improved Racing is a good place to start looking.
Where are you located? If you have a local pull your own salvage yard you might be able to score a 6.0 for a reasonable price, I worked at one for 5 years and they sold a few and the price was $250 complete with all accessories. Spend the money on oil control and a cooler if you want it to last. Improved Racing is a good place to start looking.
I checked one yard for a 6.0 but didn't have any luck. I probably need to look around harder. The only thing they offered was to order one in for $1,500 I like that baffle you linked to, but it's a bit over priced @ 200.00
test post .. it looks like my reply to che70velle is being moderated or something ?
anyway, i was trying to post a photo of the 706 heads i have, and the board isn't letting me. che70velle .. there are no rules for my class other than steel block on the LS option. so any head is fine (that fits in my budget .. and I'd like to keep it under $1,500 for an assembled and ready to go set)
hopefully the moderator will get my photo (approved ?) and put the post up.
thanks !
For $1500, get a set of 243 heads and Texas Speed stage 1 porting.
I would not have a problem running castech heads , provided they have been tested and checked by one of the best head shops or vendors on here. Many head shops rebuild and reconditon these heads now , they are tested and then any weak or prone areas are reinforced and welded to be on the safe side.
It’s perplexing for me. When I raced there was no budget. If you wanted to win, you had to outrun money, and there was lots being spent by the front runners. I ran a steel head class with a 350 carb mostly. Those engines were $30k for a nice one, and you better buy 2 of them a season, because there wasn’t time to re-fresh after mid season.
So for a budget type build, your gonna want to find a 6 liter engine with 823 heads on it. The bigger bore will help you here. Displacement is your friend. Compression is free horsepower, so if you can swing race fuel, I’d go as high as I could. The 823 heads flow very well. Spend as much as you can on an intake with porting. I’d go 4.060” bore, buy the best rings you can afford, get a cam spec’ed for 5500-7300, and bounce it off the chip all night. I ran against some sealed crate guys and they were bouncing off the chip before the flag stand, and the rest of the straight. They had to gear the car that way to get off the corner with us.
I think you may have already talked to tsp about that, they were asking me some questions about it too.
Not all castech heads have issues, they do offer different combos, or their outright 5.3 2.5 heads also. The ones we have sold through them that customers got werent castech so thats a good option. Using a 243/799 and milling them is a good option and the 243 should flow a little better, you can get in stage 1 or 2.5 and mill them to 62cc or 60/59 and raise the cr also for pump.
As a former short track asphalt racer, I have a few comments. First, I like the car. Second, use a Gen I. The parts are everywhere and cheap. Don't think you are going to out flow a Gen I with an LS. There are so many SBC heads that flow, flow, flow. The LS is a great motor but its key design feature is a massed produced head which flows well out of the box. That why GM made the switch., besides the better electronics.
These motors are expensive to build. Not in comparison to a Ford Coyotte, but when compared to an SBC. You must have eight coils for instance. You can use a crank trigger to get the same spark performance as a reluctor wheel. I don't think it will make more power unless you bend the rules. There are so many reasons that I do not know where to start. Think about it.
Also I am glad to see a short tracker on the forum. In general, this forum is all about drag racing. These guys do not know what their missing. My first race was with a stock car on a 3/8ths dirt track. It was an open stock class with the B models being stock except for safety upgrades and the A class allowing headers and cams. I won't tell you the year of the car because it will give away my age :-), but the car was locked in second.When the race starts, everyone starts fighting for the rail. Door handle to door handle banging away at each other fighting for the rail. God, I loved it! The experience is almost as good as the first POA.
You got me excited. Keep us posted with the results, and certainly show us your first trophy.
Iron block. Any head. Any carb ( I already have a 750 Race Demon) Any compression, but I'd like to stay on pump gas for economy purposes.
I do realize that you could build a 900 horse motor under the rules, but I'm trying to do it on the cheap. Planning to run this 5.3 short block I got bored out to 5.7, stock crank, new pistons for the bigger bore, stock rods, ARP rod bolts, and some heads I hope to grab under $1,750 for an assembled set.
Here's what it says right from the rules :
Engine Packages
Any 23* head legal.(LS heads are legal)
Roller Cams are legal
No dry sumps allowed at all
No aluminum blocks
Rev Limitations
6800 chip for a crate motor,
7200 for any engine with a bore bigger than 4.070,
7800 for any engine with a bore of 4.070 or smaller.
The weight rule
2250 Weight Crate Motors
2300 Weight for engines with steel cylinder heads
2350 Weight for engines with aluminum cylinder heads
LS Motor Rules
2350lbs
7200 Chip
12’’ Spoiler
5.3 & 6.0 Cast iron blocks only
(No Weight In Front of Motor Plate Required)
A little nitpicking here, but I think you have the weight allowances reversed. I think it show read 2350 for iron heads and 2300 for aluminum.
11-08-2018, 08:11 AM
New 5.3 -> 5.7 build for circle track racing 
Seriously, its just not worth the risk when used heads are abundantly available. Maybe a vendor will let you use them as a core or something, but otherwise just find a set you like and youll avoid a headache. 
