Patman thanks for the info. I actually went to their site after I posted. It should be in the mail. I will run it for a few thousand and see what I find.

 

Hey Robert, BP also bought Amoco along with lots of other cool stuff. I know folks who work there too...

I'm not a chemical engineer by trade either. But, my family is located in the Houston area, and most everyone in my family has been involved in crude refinement including base feed stock, blending and refining, and lab analysis.

So, in short I have been around it since I was born. Along the way I'll venture to say I have picked a little bit up...

From what I have read in Patman's posts, on bobistheoilguy.com, in various trade publications, web searches, and in my own personal hands on experience, I have seen nothing in Patman's posts that would lead me not to believe he is not qualified to give some advice related to oil selection, and the pro's and con's of certain oils. I also don't see Patman present himself in any other way other than an enthusiast. In most every post I have seen him present an opinion in, he posts his opinion, and the data that leads him to this opinion. I find no flaw in this method, as this is based quite simply on the scientific method.

I have found his posts to be educational, and to be quite factual. If you have some scientific data either from an oil analysis, or from a chemical engineeer who would dispute some of the statemnts that have been made, then by all means post them.

At this point all I have seen you do is attack Patman's credibility based upon your perception without any hard data to back those claims up. Again, I think we're all after facts first and foremost. If you have any hard data to dispute any of the points or posts made, then share them with us as I said. But, simply blasting someone based on your perception with obvious errors does not provide you with a strong postion from which to speak from at this point.

 

Well said, J-Rod. You bring dignity back to this thread. Thank you.

 

I'm so glad other humans rely on factual, hard data, to make educated and validated responses to certain issues that necessitate them.

 

I'm betting I can sum up barstch pretty accurately, never even having met the man..

He's an older gentleman, and thus feels his age automatically brings wisdom.
He's a cheapskate - from looking at the tools section - and a "good deal" must always be better
It gets under his skin when someone knows more than him, and his word isn't taken as gospel by the masses.
He's stubborn, and HAS to be right - even when he's wrong.

Am I close?

 

I don't work as a Chem E. I went to college for it though. I'm no oil expert, but Patman presents data based on research and analysis. Until someone produces factual data that exposes Patman for the fraud that you claim him to be, you may not want to post anything else negative about him since you are only making yourself look like a complete ***.

Have a nice day!

 

since this thread started out asking about flushing engines, let me throw my $.02 in.
in the past I would pour a quart of trans fluid in the crankcase and go to the beer store, then back home and do an oil change. the extra detergents in the trans fluid seemed to do an exceptional job of cleaning the engine and all its moving parts. I did this on several different models I owned and never had a problem, and did it as a preventive measure probably once a year. I have not done this on my LS1, or my work beater since they both use synthetic oils. I'm not sure how using a dino based 'cleaning fluid' would affect the fresh oil, plus the synthetics seem to perform so well I don't feel it's necessary.
FWIW, I went from mobil 1 5-30 to redline 10-30. didn't worry about what was left over from the first oil change and haven't had any problems.

 

I just want to thank everyone who is backing me up in this thread, you guys are awesome! There will always be someone like Robert in every bunch though, someone who asks for advice but then doesn't like the answer so he gets pissed off and starts questioning everything that is said. Pretty sad really.

I think Robert is most pissed off because Royal Purple sent me some free oil to test out, and I did not like the results I saw. Maybe Robert has got a boner for Royal Purple and doesn't like hearing bad things. I've never claimed to like Royal Purple's street oils, but their racing oils do work very well.

Perhaps I'm not working in the oil industry, but that doesn't mean I can't offer up my opinion on oil. I spend a huge portion of my day being an administrator on the oil message board on BOBISTHEOILGUY.com so I'm constantly exposed to the latest info on oil, as well as oil analysis reports. Plus I have a lot of friends from that board who are in the industry. When they speak, I listen, because I know their info is top notch. Whenever possible, if these guys don't swear me to secrecy, I share that info with others. I simply have a huge interest in oil, and like to help others who have the same interest.

And for the record Robert, I was one of the first ones on the internet to own an LS1 f-body, I factory ordered a 98 Formula back in early 98 and had that car for 2.5 years. And I'm about to pick up another LS1 vehicle this week. So you need to do some more research before you claim to know all about me!!

 

FWIW I'd like to know who manufactures Royal Purple, Amsoil, Redline and other specialty oils. I can almost guarantee you that one of the big refiners make these products, puts in some dye along with a beefed up additive package.

 

Robert, you do a good job of representing every other dumbass in the world that relies off of second or third hand data, recites it as his own, and is completely WRONG all in the process. Congrats!

When is the last time you sent oil to a LAB for testing?

 

Patman being back in an LS1.........ahhhhhh......the good ole days.

 

It'll be even better than the good ole days this time around, as I'm finally getting the LS1 powered vehicle I wanted in the first place, a C5!

 

Hello all, after having one of your own (a oil analysis customer) visit me today here at the shop I decided to sign up and cross over from BITOG. We inspected his LS6 based on some issues we discovered through the low cost tuning technique we call oil analysis. WHOA , you guys are really heated in this discussion about tribological issues! I am not into calling names but I do know a little bit about flushes and whether or not a engine needs it.

First I want to say that Patman is a long time oil analysis customer and most importantly a valued friend. Yes he pays the same price as all do for our work !

He is smart in that he is willing to stop guessing about what is going on in the life blood of his engines by using analysis.

As far as motor flushing heres a take from someone who independently tests and interprets proprietary testing for motor oils. NO motor oil can clean deeply enough to stop high pressure/high heat areas from developing a microscopic layer that will affect ring seal , valve and valve guide seal,PCV coking.

A periodic internal cleaning is a needed thing and if you are a serious racer teardown is usually the way to do it.

The less intrusive and lower cost method is oil analysis ,visual inspection ,and compression testing ID' ing the need.

Even if you use synthetic oils exclusively, you will still get the build up described above.

If you need an internal cleaning what should you do ? I suggest Auto-RX because it is safe, effective, and can be used with the current oil 1500 miles before changing it out. " in- situ".

In prepping a test engine for a oil chemistry change we also use 20w20 non detergent motor oil and 12 to 16 ounces of Lube Control. Running this with a fresh oil filter for 10 minutes or so at idle. This clears the older oil out and has some cleaning affect, just not as deeply or slowly as the Auto-RX.

The powerful and strong solvents that most associate with flushes are not recommended due to seal and lubricity issues. ATF or other tricks that Grandad used in the family Desoto will harm or best case do nothing to help a LS1 engine.


Thanks for allowing me into the mix.

Terry

 

Although it is kind of a no-no to revive an old thread like this, thanks for doing so! I laughed till tears at the retarded criticisms of Patman and their rebuttals. "Interval" is too heady of a word??

Patman

 

Good to see you on here Terry! I hope you visit often!

 

Sorry for jumping in on a thread that was suppose to be toast. I am at best a PC retard, no offense to anyone by that.

TD