Why the f&)&*^ doesnt ARP or anyone tell you this!
08-09-2004, 06:50 PM
#21
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Originally Posted by Pimp_Nas_T
Really sounds to me like you are getting a little air bubble in the system and it's taking a few minutes for it to work it's way out. You got anything fancy for your valve train? You might have oil pooling in the heads dropping your level a bit and allowing the pump to draw some air in. $0.02
08-09-2004, 07:46 PM
#22
For most engine builders, the new rod bolts and main studs get their break-in cycles during measurement anyway. One cycle to assemble the caps w/ the new bearings and take a measurement. Another with the crank in to measure crank endplay. The inevitable machinework to correct the clearances, and another assembly...I've never gotten a shortblock together without at least four pre-assembly iterations.
So, how did you manage to assemble a bottom-end with only one torquing??
So, how did you manage to assemble a bottom-end with only one torquing??
08-09-2004, 07:46 PM
#23
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Try replacing the oil pressure sender. I have seen this on other GM cars.Oil gets by the seal and holds pressure on the back side of the slide that varies the resistance. You can have 60 lbs of pressure but it shows only 40 since it has 20 psi on the back side the seal. You shut the car off the presuure bleds and all good again in a few minutes.
I have torqued many a rod bolt. I would not worry too much about the cycles.You should be using strech gauge,Not a torque wrench.
Scaz
I have torqued many a rod bolt. I would not worry too much about the cycles.You should be using strech gauge,Not a torque wrench.
Scaz
08-09-2004, 07:52 PM
#24
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Originally Posted by crainholio
For most engine builders, the new rod bolts and main studs get their break-in cycles during measurement anyway. One cycle to assemble the caps w/ the new bearings and take a measurement. Another with the crank in to measure crank endplay. The inevitable machinework to correct the clearances, and another assembly...I've never gotten a shortblock together without at least four pre-assembly iterations.
So, how did you manage to assemble a bottom-end with only one torquing??
So, how did you manage to assemble a bottom-end with only one torquing??
08-09-2004, 07:54 PM
#25
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Originally Posted by SCAZ
Try replacing the oil pressure sender. I have seen this on other GM cars.Oil gets by the seal and holds pressure on the back side of the slide that varies the resistance. You can have 60 lbs of pressure but it shows only 40 since it has 20 psi on the back side the seal. You shut the car off the presuure bleds and all good again in a few minutes.
I have torqued many a rod bolt. I would not worry too much about the cycles.You should be using strech gauge,Not a torque wrench.
Scaz
I have torqued many a rod bolt. I would not worry too much about the cycles.You should be using strech gauge,Not a torque wrench.
Scaz
Ill try a new sender. The one I have had been sitting for like 6 months before...
08-09-2004, 07:56 PM
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Also, if it was an assembly problem (IE. clearences) beside the studs.... The OP would be bad all the time, not just at certain times. When its cold, I have ~70-80 PSI and warm crusing is still 60+.
08-09-2004, 08:08 PM
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Oops on the stud/bolt mix up.
I had the same oil thing in my daily driver. Give it a try.
Scaz
Since you guys all do this here goes.
10.39 126 MPH stock heads no mods but a good valve job. Stock bore +.060. Stock stroke. Stock manifold. no blower or juice. Stock lift cam. Commander 950 FI
I had the same oil thing in my daily driver. Give it a try.
Scaz
Since you guys all do this here goes.
10.39 126 MPH stock heads no mods but a good valve job. Stock bore +.060. Stock stroke. Stock manifold. no blower or juice. Stock lift cam. Commander 950 FI
08-09-2004, 10:15 PM
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Why would ls1 fasteners from ARP be different from other engines say sb Chevy?I"ve never heard to re-torque 3or 4 times especially rod bolts,Country Boy I agree you may have gauge problem.When you tighten a stud it puts a strain or down-force on the maincap itself,plus with the 2 side bolts it would be even harder for the caps to move.Double check your gauge,maybe change your oil filter just be sure.Also are you sure that your oil level is right,too full or too low.(just 1 more possibility,not implying you don"t know what your doing)I would check anything I could think of first,I hope you find your problem,I still don't think its your studs,good luck!!!
08-09-2004, 10:31 PM
#31
Well I know you guys have just about all the bases covered so this is just another thought to think about, but for what it is worth I am leaning towards the sending unit. But what I was thinking about is the thick oil you are using just like one of the other guys said what if it is not returning to the pan fast enough under high rpms and so it sucks some air and then you loose prime/presure some what and when you turn it off it gives it just enough time for the oil to return to a good level around the pick up tube etc... You may just try a thinner oil like a 10w-30 or 40 and see what happens it is a lot cheaper than motor work LOL! Of course the sending unit needs to be changed first I think that is a cheap fix also. But if that doesn't work another possible fix.
08-09-2004, 10:32 PM
#32
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I never got any instruction saying to do the TQ and re TQ... All I got was a little piece of paper saying to use only the ARP moly lube and the TQ specs.... nothing about this Retorquing stuff..... I didnt get any of that with my head studs either, nor the rods, nor the cam sprocket set.... nor the cam retainer plate set.... I have alot of ARP stuff 
Gauge wrong? You mean my calipers? If the clearences are wrong, wouldnt it be a problem all the time and not ONLY after alot of WOT? Bad clearences is a constant, not a variable like my OP problem......
Gauge wrong? You mean my calipers? If the clearences are wrong, wouldnt it be a problem all the time and not ONLY after alot of WOT? Bad clearences is a constant, not a variable like my OP problem......
*feels like dumbass now* LOL
08-09-2004, 10:35 PM
#34
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Originally Posted by Inspector12
Well I know you guys have just about all the bases covered so this is just another thought to think about, but for what it is worth I am leaning towards the sending unit. But what I was thinking about is the thick oil you are using just like one of the other guys said what if it is not returning to the pan fast enough under high rpms and so it sucks some air and then you loose prime/presure some what and when you turn it off it gives it just enough time for the oil to return to a good level around the pick up tube etc... You may just try a thinner oil like a 10w-30 or 40 and see what happens it is a lot cheaper than motor work LOL! Of course the sending unit needs to be changed first I think that is a cheap fix also. But if that doesn't work another possible fix.
08-10-2004, 04:19 AM
#35
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Adding an extra qt is an HP killer.
Don't try this at home but, when we go for it we run only three to four qts of oil. It can be worth almost a tenth.
There is no need for thick oil, another HP killer. If you have a pressure problem fix the problem. Don't cover it up with oil.
Scaz
Don't try this at home but, when we go for it we run only three to four qts of oil. It can be worth almost a tenth.
There is no need for thick oil, another HP killer. If you have a pressure problem fix the problem. Don't cover it up with oil.
Scaz
08-10-2004, 08:07 AM
#38
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BUT.... wouldnt a clearence issue be consistant and not only when the car is run hard and it sit for a few and all is well again? I would have OP problems all the time and I dont...
*lots of edits*
*lots of edits*
08-10-2004, 08:10 AM
#39
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It took 4 or 5 passes on my ARP head studs until they did not turn with a torque wrench. I almost fell over when I retorqued them after 10 minutes and they went 1/2 turn more. It took 1/2 hour until they didnt turn any more. That was with the ARP supplied moly.
My racing buddy told me you cant torque ARP stuff once...it takes a couple passes over some time.
My racing buddy told me you cant torque ARP stuff once...it takes a couple passes over some time.
08-10-2004, 08:33 AM
#40
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What is your oil temperature doing. I think that there is a PID that measures Oil Temperature on the LS1. It could be that the oil is getting hot when you are romping around in the car and the viscosity is thinning out causing the pressure to drop. You could check the foaming theory by recreating the oil pressure drop situation, shutting off the engine and draining the oil in a pan and looking at it quickly while it is still foamy, if it is. Also, have a cooking thermometer ready and stick it in the hot oil. Admittedly, it won't be as hot as it was in the engine a minute earlier, but if it is 220 or more, you know it's getting too hot.
I really don't think that this is a torquing issue with the head/main/rod bolts or bolt stretch. From what you are saying, the bolt torque might not be perfect, but the torques are probably as good or better than you're going to find in most performance engine build-ups.
All my best. I've been there before. I too know frustration like this!
Steve
I really don't think that this is a torquing issue with the head/main/rod bolts or bolt stretch. From what you are saying, the bolt torque might not be perfect, but the torques are probably as good or better than you're going to find in most performance engine build-ups.
All my best. I've been there before. I too know frustration like this!
Steve