tim99ws6

iTrader: (31)

the dumbest part of your claim is that you aren't even paying attention to what people are telling you.
1) fact-yes the ls1 is still making power above 6200 stock.....
2)fiction-the idea that your STOCK valvetrain will EVER last under any condition over.....6300 RPM is ridiculous.....and at 6600!!! youve gt to be kidding yourself......listen man....
your car is NOT a race car as you have said. that guys vette is(nice vette btw). if you are so sure-set on revving over 6300 RPM's, do youreslf....and more importantely your car a favor....either buy some upgraded valvetrain....or you better be looking into getting some serious AAA tow service....cause your car will be spending a lot of time in the near future on the tow truck.....

just my .02
Tim

anyone else feel the same?

soslo

iTrader: (12)

Tim, I semi agree with you. I don't know where the shift point should be at in practice/reality - only in theory based on what the engine power is.

I hear terrible things about the stock valvetrain, so I don't know. The cam has mild lift though...who knows. Has anyone bitten into the rotten apple with a stock valvetrain? At what RPM? Was it a missed shift, normal driving, drag racing, what?

Jpr5690

iTrader: (13)

ok back to 6300 it is ...now if i could only findout what settings in a hpp3 i need, to run all shifts up to 6300 rpm i could be done with this. doea anybody know stock a4 shift points

Jpr5690

iTrader: (13)

ok back to 6300 it is ...now if i could only findout what settings in a hpp3 i need, to run all shifts up to 6300 rpm i could be done with this. does anybody know stock a4 shift points
thanks john

ROB'S SS

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Originally posted by tim99ws6:
<strong> 1) fact-yes the ls1 is still making power above 6200 stock.....
</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">um, no its not. if your hp curve starts going down, your no longer MAKING power. and as i stated above, stock LS1's are making peak power around 5500 rpm's. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="gr_images/icons/wink.gif" />

Pro Stock John

iTrader: (34)

1) HPP is useful, but we tend outgrow it.
2) I would not buzz a stock motor with stock valve springs to more than 6200... You will float valves higher than that. If you want to buzz up to 6400-6500 then retard the cam 2 degrees and put in some LS6 valve springs. Your car currently peaks at 5900. Sure you make power at 6300 but it will have ramped down bigtime from floating the valves.
3) Z06/LS6 will peak higher because the LS6 cam has more duration and more LSA... move the power peak up to like 6200.
4) 6600 will result in valvetrain damage that's a certainty.

Jpr5690

iTrader: (13)

humm reading the chart i have in my htpertech manual it says a car with stock wheels and 3.42 gears increases 137 rpm for every mile over the stock shiftpoint. therefore a plus three on the 1-2 shift would net a 411 rpm increase. since i cannot find the stock shiftpoints in rpm from anybody ... at all, in several different posts. i will assume for arguments sake its the revlimit. with a stock shift point of 6k on a stock car this means that hypertech is shooting for a shift arround 6400 rpm. now seeing that the shift point and rev limit are unlikely to be the same i belive hypertech is telling my car to shift in the 6300 -ish range. ironically enough the +6 setting multpulied by the 73 rpm per mile above for the 2-3 shift would net a increase about the same as the 1-2 shift which seems logical. and finally the 3-4 shift with a +9 setting nets a 405 increase in rpm. ALL RESULT WITH DEFNITE SHIFTS BELOW 6400 RPM AND MOST LIKELY ARROUND THE 62-6300 RPM range. which would coenside with my toughts about the best spot for shifts when looking at a dyno form a 2001 stock ls1 and would further prove the people who said to shift arround 63 correct! (just thinking out loud) if anybody finds my logic flawed please let me know but as of now it seems that hpyertech and most of u all have the same opnions. but for some odd rason hypertech sets the rev limit up to 6600 when in fact you could probaly use a limit of 6400 and not hit revlimit with the same shift settings (does tis all make sound right?)
thanks, john

OvalHunter

I just wanted to add that my 224/.581/112 with TEA heads pulls hard right into the stock rev limit. It gets there so easily and fast, I have banged the limit several times. It's too fun. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="gr_grin.gif" />

I'm really interested in finding where it noses over, the thing pulls real hard all the way to 6200. I was planning on going to a 6600 limit and just living with it - even if there's more to be had.
The only other option would be to pull the sprocket and advance the timing a little. I installed the cam dot to dot and it degreed out straight up. NO ground in advance from Comp. With a stock bottom end I would probably be better off with more low end pull and less high RPM. Just seems to be such a waste for ports and a cam that want to breath.

I don't want to scatter the thing in one huge orgasmic catastrophic failure. My wallet or wife won't hack it at this point.

jimmyblue

iTrader: (11)

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Originally posted by ROB'S SS:
<strong> </font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Originally posted by tim99ws6:
<strong> 1) fact-yes the ls1 is still making power above 6200 stock.....
</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">um, no its not. if your hp curve starts going down, your no longer MAKING power. and as i stated above, stock LS1's are making peak power around 5500 rpm's. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="gr_images/icons/wink.gif" /> </strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Of course you are making (outputting) power, on
the declining end of the curve. You think the
dyno is reporting something other than what
it receives?

My opinion is this: You want to upshift at the
point where your rear wheel power output in the
next gear (rising) equals the RW power output
in the current gear (falling). If you shift
later you have given up power*time, if you
shift earlier you have given up power*time.

Where these two points match, depends intimately
on the car's setup. Especially automatics with
the wide variety of converters out there.

Basically, for an automatic, you'll know what
your upshift "shift extension" puts you at, under
WOT acceleration. If you look at that RPM on the
dyno curve, then draw a line straight across to
the falling side, there's your maximum shift
point for best continuous power output.

You'd have to run a dyno session with the rev
limiter set way up there to map this out. Most
of the curves I see just fall off the cliff at
6200 for some reason <img border="0" title="" alt="[Razz]" src="gr_images/icons/tongue.gif" />

Any flies in this ointment?

<small>[ April 17, 2003, 08:53 AM: Message edited by: jimmyblue ]</small>

IronDonut

You're not worried about crankshaft horsepower or even crankshaft torque. You are worried about the total amount of thrust produced (or torque at the rear wheels)

Even as torque falls off in the upper RPM reaches there is still more rear wheel torque available than when you switch to the next gear and are in a fatter part of the torque band.

300ft/lb in 2nd gear makes more rear wheel thrust than 375ft/lb in 3rd gear.


</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Originally posted by BlakeSS:
<strong> It's pointless to take a stock cammed car past 6 grand.

6600?

Not only are you going to break a spring but you're losing so much torque (and hp) at that rpm its not even funny. You're gonna lose more races than you win shifting that high.

You had better have the seat of your pants recalibrated.

Blake </strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">

jimmyblue

iTrader: (11)

So then, you would want to shift where RW torque
has fallen to lower-RPM torque / gear-ratio-step
on the uphill side of the torque curve? This
would be an even higher shift point than even-HP
I guess?

Jpr5690

iTrader: (13)

SO.. AM I THE ONLY ONe WHOS HAVING A HARD TIME FOLLING THE LAST FEW POSTS... correct me if im wrong but jimmy you are sayng what? im not clear please explain. and tell me if my idea (above) has and faults... I would assume that you want to get the highest avg hp between the shifts that you can. and if thats true than shifting at like 63 or 64 seems like the best idea sepaclly since you dont fall as far back on the hp curb for the next gear resulting in startinbg the gear arround 4700 (300hp) and ending the gear arround 6400 (300hp) instead of starting at 4500 ish (280hp) and ending at at 6000 (305hp) like i said im no experet but it just seems more logical that the higher avg hp you have the better accelration IF THIS IS WORNG CAN SOMEBODY PLEASE EXPLAIN WHY IN A TONED DOWN FASHON SO NEWBITES LIKE I CAN UNDERSTAND AND STOP POSTING INCORRECT FACTS.

EdmontonSS

I agree, if this discussion continues, people have to start talking about torque rather than horsepower.