Setting initial lash for adjustable rockers?
02-27-2005, 09:45 PM
#21
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[QUOTE=mrr23]it's amazing that you rely on teachers. while i rely on the people that make the product. some wonder if teachers are nothing more than failures in the real life. so, they went into teaching.
wonder how many turns it takes a thread pitch of 1.00mm vs 1.50mm to reach .120"?[/QUO
So i guess you don't like teachers even though you wouldn't know how to write or talk if it wasn't for them, or maybe your just not very educated. To me, being taught would in return make me an educated person in life, so my educated guess is that you've never built a race motor in your life.
wonder how many turns it takes a thread pitch of 1.00mm vs 1.50mm to reach .120"?[/QUO
So i guess you don't like teachers even though you wouldn't know how to write or talk if it wasn't for them, or maybe your just not very educated. To me, being taught would in return make me an educated person in life, so my educated guess is that you've never built a race motor in your life.
02-27-2005, 09:45 PM
#22
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ah, maybe it's .060-.080" preload. i do remember roger himself coming on this board and talking about preload. i'll find the post. i have too many numbers in my head. either way, i'd rather do what the manufacturer tells me rather than a teacher that has never seen/used the product.
02-27-2005, 09:54 PM
#23
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Originally Posted by NASTE_SS
So i guess you don't like teachers even though you wouldn't know how to write or talk if it wasn't for them, or maybe your just not very educated. To me, being taught would in return make me an educated person in life, so my educated guess is that you've never built a race motor in your life.
who taught the teachers anyway?
the ones that are successful, aren't teachers now are they? usually they are the ones called GUEST SPEAKERS.
i don't have to be educated like all these engine building PHDers. i just have to know where to find the answers. let's see how long it takes the moderators to lock this thread over personal insults. i'm betting 6 pages.
02-27-2005, 10:01 PM
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ok here's roger vinci's post about preload located here: https://ls1tech.com/forums/showthrea...hlight=preload
like is said, i don't have to be the smartest person. just know where to find the answers. 
and here's something else i told someone recently. i'd rather you hate me for being right, than like me for being wrong.
Originally Posted by joe vinci
We have documented increases of over 25hp and 24ftlbs torque with the installation of our VHP 1.8 accelerated lift roller rocker package. We have consistently received 15 to 18hp and 18 to 20ft lbs torque. There are some other important benefits from the VHP rocker package. The kit not only contains billet aluminum, super quiet accelerated lift 1.8 roller rockers, but also, stronger, lighter, chromoly pushrods, guide plates, screw in studs and poly locks. This allows the installer to properly adjust the lifter preload. There has been a lot of discussion about lifter preload of late. Some cam manufacturers and retailers are leading clients to believe there is a benefit to running very little preload. As little as .004 preload has been touted. This can cause premature valve spring failure, and power losses. Hydraulic roller camshafts do not have clearance ramps like solid roller camshafts. When an aluminum engine heats up, the rocker arms actually become looser and .004 lifter preload can become .002 lash (negative preload). The resulting noise causes knock sensors to remove timing from the spark curve and the power falls off significantly. The cure! We advise our clients to run .060 to .120 lifter preload. We have documented greater horsepower results and far less valve train wear than with lesser preload settings. To learn more about our rockers and cams, click here.
and here's something else i told someone recently. i'd rather you hate me for being right, than like me for being wrong.
02-27-2005, 10:10 PM
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Originally Posted by mrr23
oh, here we go with the personal insults. why is it always the personal insults? here let me stroke your ego a little. i listen to the right teachers. well define race motor? an 8 second motor? no. every motor in everyone of my cars that i take to the track? yes. but, an educated person would ask questions before 'guessing'.
who taught the teachers anyway?
the ones that are successful, aren't teachers now are they? usually they are the ones called GUEST SPEAKERS.
i don't have to be educated like all these engine building PHDers. i just have to know where to find the answers. let's see how long it takes the moderators to lock this thread over personal insults. i'm betting 6 pages.
who taught the teachers anyway?
the ones that are successful, aren't teachers now are they? usually they are the ones called GUEST SPEAKERS.
i don't have to be educated like all these engine building PHDers. i just have to know where to find the answers. let's see how long it takes the moderators to lock this thread over personal insults. i'm betting 6 pages.
I have no ego, but what i know is that i'm stupid for even trying to help out. and waste my time. If you actually read the message i said that .060-.080 would work fine but once again why would you want that much lash. Listen there is no insult intended, sorry that you took it that way, but if you knew who my teacher were than i don't think you'd be insulting teachers. Those people who are speakers now had to learn everything they know from someone much smarter then them. So once agin you have your opinion, it may be educated or not, but i have my opinion which i believe to be very educated. What would you say if i was to become one of those speakers that you praise so much,then you'd think damn you have to start somewhere. Your not born with an education you have to earn it. Sorry about all this drama over nothing.
Sorry about the drama over nothing
02-27-2005, 10:22 PM
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yes you said .060-.080. and you were correct. but it was the whole 2 turns issue. with the older SBC motors, the 3/4 and 1/4 turn is correct. problem is, that way doesn't work with the LSx motors. we went from standard thread to metric thread. the old way of 1 turn = .060-.080 is now 2 turns = .060-.080. too many people think the old way still works. do a search over so many people having issues with preload.
naste_ss - no problem with you coming in and helping. but the personal insult over me being uneducated was uncalled for. and that's what starts long BS threads.
marc_w - not preload being the issue. the 1 turn vs 2 turns being the issue. it's time ot let the past go. the older SBC doesn't exist anymore.
naste_ss - no problem with you coming in and helping. but the personal insult over me being uneducated was uncalled for. and that's what starts long BS threads.
marc_w - not preload being the issue. the 1 turn vs 2 turns being the issue. it's time ot let the past go. the older SBC doesn't exist anymore.
02-27-2005, 10:24 PM
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Originally Posted by marc_w
I just want to clarify - that .060-.080 I mentioned -- that's preload...
I hope that's not where the confusion is from.
I hope that's not where the confusion is from.
hopefully i'll see you guys at the track sometime so i can see that 8 second car and that 11.67 heads and nitrous car.i've got a cam only car that went 7.03 in the eighth so i guess I've been getting the right awnser from someone
02-27-2005, 10:25 PM
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oh and who taught albert einstein? how about the guys that came up with the first nuclear bomb? they thought for themselves. most probably weren't taught. here's a good one. the wright brothers. they weren't taught by pilots or scientists.
02-27-2005, 10:36 PM
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[QUOTE=mrr23]oh and who taught albert einstein? how about the guys that came up with the first nuclear bomb? they thought for themselves. most probably weren't taught. here's a good one. the wright brothers. they weren't taught by pilots or scientists.[/QUOTE
No, but were they taught to think for themselves, and to read and uderstand literature. Yes i'd say so because that's what my history book told me when i was in college. I'm from stuart florida and i'll be in town probably around march 13 becasue my school and i are going to tampa to race our 8 second hotstreet car. I have a high 7 second buick i'd like to race that eight second car you say you built the motor for.
No, but were they taught to think for themselves, and to read and uderstand literature. Yes i'd say so because that's what my history book told me when i was in college. I'm from stuart florida and i'll be in town probably around march 13 becasue my school and i are going to tampa to race our 8 second hotstreet car. I have a high 7 second buick i'd like to race that eight second car you say you built the motor for.
02-27-2005, 10:37 PM
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Originally Posted by NASTE_SS
hopefully i'll see you guys at the track sometime so i can see that 8 second car and that 11.67 heads and nitrous car.i've got a cam only car that went 7.03 in the eighth so i guess I've been getting the right awnser from someone
i wish i had an 8 second car. understand what a 'teacher' is though. someone you learn from. doesn't have to be from a university or school. it can be from anywhere. currently my teacher is roger vinci. he has so many years in drag racing, it's not funny. and these two cars aren't my first stab at this. these two cars make number 14 and 15 in the fbody list of mine.
we each build our cars a different way. if i was looking to do it all motor, i would. her car isn't an all out drag car. she still runs the stock converter. no slicks, 3.23 gears, and full weight.
hell, my own car, the 00 formula, just went 11.81 @ 121.35. only mods are slp airlid, k/n filter, and 200 n2o. again, stock converter, 3.23 gears, full weight, bassani tru-duals, and no slicks. yank ss3400e converter is sitting on the bench at work waiting to go in. imagine what it'll do if i wanted it to be an all out race car. i don't want trailer queens. i drive mine everyday. no trailer. it breaks, it gets towed.
02-27-2005, 10:39 PM
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and you talk about me not reading what you posted. i'll quote myself
come on now. keep up. i'm glad you have such quick cars. but again, i want street cars, not trailer queens.
neat!!! i just made my 1000th post.
Originally Posted by mrr23
well define race motor? an 8 second motor? no. every motor in everyone of my cars that i take to the track? yes.
neat!!! i just made my 1000th post.
02-27-2005, 10:45 PM
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Originally Posted by mrr23
i wish i had an 8 second car. understand what a 'teacher' is though. someone you learn from. doesn't have to be from a university or school. it can be from anywhere. currently my teacher is roger vinci. he has so many years in drag racing, it's not funny. and these two cars aren't my first stab at this. these two cars make number 14 and 15 in the fbody list of mine.
we each build our cars a different way. if i was looking to do it all motor, i would. her car isn't an all out drag car. she still runs the stock converter. no slicks, 3.23 gears, and full weight.
hell, my own car, the 00 formula, just went 11.81 @ 121.35. only mods are slp airlid, k/n filter, and 200 n2o. again, stock converter, 3.23 gears, full weight, bassani tru-duals, and no slicks. yank ss3400e converter is sitting on the bench at work waiting to go in. imagine what it'll do if i wanted it to be an all out race car. i don't want trailer queens. i drive mine everyday. no trailer. it breaks, it gets towed.
we each build our cars a different way. if i was looking to do it all motor, i would. her car isn't an all out drag car. she still runs the stock converter. no slicks, 3.23 gears, and full weight.
hell, my own car, the 00 formula, just went 11.81 @ 121.35. only mods are slp airlid, k/n filter, and 200 n2o. again, stock converter, 3.23 gears, full weight, bassani tru-duals, and no slicks. yank ss3400e converter is sitting on the bench at work waiting to go in. imagine what it'll do if i wanted it to be an all out race car. i don't want trailer queens. i drive mine everyday. no trailer. it breaks, it gets towed.
02-27-2005, 10:46 PM
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now, we could go one all night over all this mess. i was right about the 2 turns for the vinci/ crane rockers. obviously, because marc_w has his truck running. it wasn't about .060-.080 preload. it was about 1 turn vs 2 turns. and because of your education, you were wrong on the subject. again, do what the manufacturer tells you to do. after all, they made it. not the book you read from.
02-27-2005, 10:47 PM
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Originally Posted by NASTE_SS
But you really should doubt anyone until you know who they really are.
i would love to meet up with you one day. here's another thing i learned, not from a teacher also. if you want to go faster than what you are, you hang around the people faster than you, not slower than you. the slower people aren't going to help you. you're already faster than them. 
02-27-2005, 10:53 PM
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Originally Posted by Muffracing
NASTE_SS was just tring to help out. I rather have then too loose then too tight. Bent pushrods anyone? I didn't see the need to get uptight.
02-27-2005, 10:57 PM
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[QUOTE=mrr23]exactly. then you shouldn't have surmised(guessed) about me being uneducated then. until you know who i am. then you can tell everyone i'm uneducated. [/QUO
First of all if you knew what the hell you were talking about the argument wasn't about 1 or 2 turns.It was about me saying that i think that .060-.080 is too much preload. I also stated that it would work on the car, but i bet i'll make more power. Second of all i think your the one who isn't sure who they are talking to and you shouldn't jump to conclusions. Thrid of all only an un educated person would make fun or talk down upon an educated person. so have fun with your cars and if we ever meet up i'll make sure to introduce myself, and maybe then you'll understand.
[/QUOFirst of all if you knew what the hell you were talking about the argument wasn't about 1 or 2 turns.It was about me saying that i think that .060-.080 is too much preload. I also stated that it would work on the car, but i bet i'll make more power. Second of all i think your the one who isn't sure who they are talking to and you shouldn't jump to conclusions. Thrid of all only an un educated person would make fun or talk down upon an educated person. so have fun with your cars and if we ever meet up i'll make sure to introduce myself, and maybe then you'll understand.
02-27-2005, 10:58 PM
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now about the whole 1 turn vs 2 turns issue. if i remember correctly, stock chevrolet studs were 3/8 x 14. 14 threads per inch. most after market studs are 3/8 x 24. or 24 threads per inch. almost double the threads for the same distance. so, that would be why you need to double the amount of turns to get to the same distance. ask your teacher about that.
02-27-2005, 11:01 PM
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oh here, i'll refresh your memory. post #11 yours.
i guess you don't see yourself disputing the two turns in your very first post huh? and now we're back to the personal insults again. you never heard of it, so it had to be wrong. i've done the whole 1/4 turn on all my older design SBC motors. while you are right for the older motors, you were wrong about it with the vinci/crane rockers. now, you know how vinci/crane roclker are to adjusted.
and you're right, i don't know who i'm typing to. just like you don't know who you are typing to as well. you made the first insult with the whole uneducated remark. you didn't know about the proper preload using vinci/crane rockers, but decided to help out. glad you did. but, i do know the proper preload on the vinci/crane rockers. and now you are getting mad at me because of it.
and i'm sure you are way smarter, or more educated(the big word), than me. after all you build and run race prepped cars. and i don't.
Originally Posted by nate_ss
I've never heard of two full turns of preload on hydraulic lifters, and i go to school to be a machinist and engine builder. The rule of thumb is 3/4 of a turn on street motors that go 100,000 miles and 1/4 of a turn on street trip motors, and1/8 turn on race motors. That goes for any hydraulic lifter, there's only .160 travel in the lifter and two full turns would preload the lifter way too much. If you need some help just pm me and i'll tell you anything you want to know.
and you're right, i don't know who i'm typing to. just like you don't know who you are typing to as well. you made the first insult with the whole uneducated remark. you didn't know about the proper preload using vinci/crane rockers, but decided to help out. glad you did. but, i do know the proper preload on the vinci/crane rockers. and now you are getting mad at me because of it.
and i'm sure you are way smarter, or more educated(the big word), than me. after all you build and run race prepped cars. and i don't.
Last edited by mrr23; 02-27-2005 at 11:12 PM.