Cheatr Cam...
Thread Starter
Teching In
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 45
Likes: 0
From: Orange County
Originally Posted by UtOhCop
I'm using a custom cam with a different Lift and LSA but a 212/230 Duration. Look at my numbers in the sig.. Stock manifolds.
Thanks for the reply,
Mike
Launching!
Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 286
Likes: 0
From: Abilene, Tx
Patrick - Where is Victoria located at? I am very interested in hearing how your car sounds. At the moment I have a 224/220 .581/.581 116LSA and this cam actually sounds really appealing to me as a sleeper cam. If it idles similar or better than mine I would consider this cam. At the moment I know to get the RWHP that I want out of this cam I will have to buy some headers, then I will not be as much of a sleeper as I want to be. Although with the Cheater cam it looks as though I would not have to worry about it. Your comments would be very much appreciated!!
Thank you!
Thank you!
Brian, Victoria is in South Texas between Houston and Corpus Christi (near the coast). Probably too far from abilene to hear, but I think Thunder Racing might have a sound clip on their web site (or will soon). If you'd like to keep your factory exhaust, you'll probably maintain your current power level (or pick up a little) and improve your overall street manners a great deal.
You're right, the reverse split cam you have works best with a really free flowing exhaust. The keys to the CheaTR working so well with stock exhaust are: earlier exhaust valve opening, longer exhaust duration, smaller overlap (-10 degrees at .050") and lots of intake lobe area with a short seat to seat duration number (to keep the idle crisp and the power high).
You're right, the reverse split cam you have works best with a really free flowing exhaust. The keys to the CheaTR working so well with stock exhaust are: earlier exhaust valve opening, longer exhaust duration, smaller overlap (-10 degrees at .050") and lots of intake lobe area with a short seat to seat duration number (to keep the idle crisp and the power high).
__________________
2013 Corvette Grand Sport A6 LME forged 416, Greg Good ported TFS 255 LS3 heads, 222/242 .629"/.604" 121LSA Pat G blower cam, ARH 1 7/8" headers, ESC Novi 1500 Supercharger w/8 rib direct drive conversion, 747rwhp/709rwtq on 93 octane, 801rwhp/735rwtq on race fuel, 10.1 @ 147.25mph 1/4 mile, 174.7mph Half Mile.
2016 Corvette Z51 M7 Magnuson Heartbeat 2300 supercharger, TSP LT headers, Pat G tuned, 667rwhp, 662rwtq, 191mph TX Mile.
2009.5 Pontiac G8 GT 6.0L, A6, AFR 230v2 heads. 506rwhp/442rwtq. 11.413 @ 121.29mph 1/4 mile, 168.7mph TX Mile
2000 Pewter Ram Air Trans Am M6 heads/cam 508 rwhp/445 rwtq SAE, 183.092 TX Mile
2022 Cadillac Escalade 6.2L A10 S&B CAI, Corsa catback.
2023 Corvette 3LT Z51 soon to be modified.
Custom LSX tuning in person or via email press here.
2013 Corvette Grand Sport A6 LME forged 416, Greg Good ported TFS 255 LS3 heads, 222/242 .629"/.604" 121LSA Pat G blower cam, ARH 1 7/8" headers, ESC Novi 1500 Supercharger w/8 rib direct drive conversion, 747rwhp/709rwtq on 93 octane, 801rwhp/735rwtq on race fuel, 10.1 @ 147.25mph 1/4 mile, 174.7mph Half Mile.
2016 Corvette Z51 M7 Magnuson Heartbeat 2300 supercharger, TSP LT headers, Pat G tuned, 667rwhp, 662rwtq, 191mph TX Mile.
2009.5 Pontiac G8 GT 6.0L, A6, AFR 230v2 heads. 506rwhp/442rwtq. 11.413 @ 121.29mph 1/4 mile, 168.7mph TX Mile
2000 Pewter Ram Air Trans Am M6 heads/cam 508 rwhp/445 rwtq SAE, 183.092 TX Mile
2022 Cadillac Escalade 6.2L A10 S&B CAI, Corsa catback.
2023 Corvette 3LT Z51 soon to be modified.
Custom LSX tuning in person or via email press here.
Teching In
Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 16
Likes: 0
From: Tallahassee, FL
couple of questions on this... don't wanna hijack the thread, but since we're on the subject:
1) which would be better w/ this cam, comp 915s (good to .625 lift) or 921s (.650)? Are the 915s enough, or would the 921s last longer since they are able to withstand more lift?
2) I've seen people mention the ls2 timing chain @ SDPC for around $28...does this fit the ls1? Will it work as a replacement for my stock chain when I do the cam swap?
Thanks everyone...
1) which would be better w/ this cam, comp 915s (good to .625 lift) or 921s (.650)? Are the 915s enough, or would the 921s last longer since they are able to withstand more lift?
2) I've seen people mention the ls2 timing chain @ SDPC for around $28...does this fit the ls1? Will it work as a replacement for my stock chain when I do the cam swap?
Thanks everyone...
Originally Posted by Patrick G
Theoretically, double springs have a number of advantages over singles.
The inner spring helps to cancel out some of the various harmonics of the outer spring, making the valvetrain more stable.
It's easier to get more pressure with two springs than with one.
If one of the springs fail, there is another one that is there to keep you from dropping a valve (theoretically).
Patrick
The inner spring helps to cancel out some of the various harmonics of the outer spring, making the valvetrain more stable.
It's easier to get more pressure with two springs than with one.
If one of the springs fail, there is another one that is there to keep you from dropping a valve (theoretically).
Patrick
A beehive although it is a single spring has an advantage because it has a beehive shape so it has lots of very small amplitiude resonant frequencies that don't hurt the TQ curve at any one spot.
Bret
Gee, I didnt see any mention of the PRC or PP Gold Springs. Some of the best on the market.
The CheaTR cam sounds like something I wish I had no and then. The current TSP 231/237 is getting old, not only in technology but tiring. I havent dyno'd since this cam went in, last time with the TR 224 I went 363rwhp (cant recall tq), and ran 12.4 @ 109, now running 12.1 @ 112. Not a huge gain, but cant complain since I still run 3.23 gears and a small TC.
Patrick have you run this cam and compare to stock or previous cam on track.
The CheaTR cam sounds like something I wish I had no and then. The current TSP 231/237 is getting old, not only in technology but tiring. I havent dyno'd since this cam went in, last time with the TR 224 I went 363rwhp (cant recall tq), and ran 12.4 @ 109, now running 12.1 @ 112. Not a huge gain, but cant complain since I still run 3.23 gears and a small TC.
Patrick have you run this cam and compare to stock or previous cam on track.
Originally Posted by BriGuy
Patrick - Where is Victoria located at? I am very interested in hearing how your car sounds. At the moment I have a 224/220 .581/.581 116LSA and this cam actually sounds really appealing to me as a sleeper cam. If it idles similar or better than mine I would consider this cam. At the moment I know to get the RWHP that I want out of this cam I will have to buy some headers, then I will not be as much of a sleeper as I want to be. Although with the Cheater cam it looks as though I would not have to worry about it. Your comments would be very much appreciated!!
Thank you!
Thank you!
Is your cam the MTI stealth?
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Hey Charlie, this is the cam i purchased. I considered the 1.8 ratio option however i would need a really good flowing set of heads to get any gains over .600 lift. Stockers would just stall out. When does it end man? lol
Originally Posted by Scoobie
Hey Charlie, this is the cam i purchased. I considered the 1.8 ratio option however i would need a really good flowing set of heads to get any gains over .600 lift. Stockers would just stall out. When does it end man? lol
Scott, you need 4:10 gears and my MS3, if I ever get my car back for the body shop I'll take you for a ride
I need a family friendly cam now
TECH Senior Member
Joined: Mar 2004
Posts: 14,620
Likes: 17
From: BFE
Originally Posted by Drew778
Is your cam the MTI stealth?
The Stealth is more powerful than the cheater and with stage 1.5/or 2 heads, it will make over 420 rwhp.
I'm at 404/383 cam only (but I'm running .045 gasket and portmatched intake and exhaust).
Originally Posted by PREDATOR-Z
If it is an MTI, it is a Stealth II.
The Stealth is more powerful than the cheater and with stage 1.5/or 2 heads, it will make over 420 rwhp.
I'm at 404/383 cam only (but I'm running .045 gasket and portmatched intake and exhaust).
The Stealth is more powerful than the cheater and with stage 1.5/or 2 heads, it will make over 420 rwhp.
I'm at 404/383 cam only (but I'm running .045 gasket and portmatched intake and exhaust).
Not to argue, but at this point no one has tried the Cheater cam with anything other than stock exhaust. It may or may not be better than the Stealth II. I think it is premature to make any comments about it's absolute output since it hasn't been tested.
TECH Senior Member
Joined: Mar 2004
Posts: 14,620
Likes: 17
From: BFE
Originally Posted by Geoff
Not to argue, but at this point no one has tried the Cheater cam with anything other than stock exhaust. It may or may not be better than the Stealth II. I think it is premature to make any comments about it's absolute output since it hasn't been tested.
Cheater cam has its purpose and so does the Stealth.
Originally Posted by PREDATOR-Z
The reason I said that is that guy allready has the Stealth and is willing to switch, which would be a downgrade IMO.
Cheater cam has its purpose and so does the Stealth.
Cheater cam has its purpose and so does the Stealth.
Bottom line:
Factory exhaust: CheaTR (GREAT), Reverse split cam (not optimal)
Long tube headers, high flow y-pipe: Reverse split cam (GREAT), Cheater (not optimal).
Patrick can you find out from Thunder if this cam will clear the AFR's milled .040? My car has the AFR's milled .040 and the the .040 Cometics. If there is plenty of clearance -I'll try the cam. I can see it picking up at least 5 rwhp over the factory Z06 cam-that would put me closer to 420rwhp. I still have to go back with a fresh tank of gas and see if the car still knocks. It was 2 degrees from 4500 rpm and up. This is with sunoco 94 octane but again it was mixed with half a tank sitiing in my car over the winter.
Originally Posted by Vortech
Patrick can you find out from Thunder if this cam will clear the AFR's milled .040? My car has the AFR's milled .040 and the the .040 Cometics. If there is plenty of clearance -I'll try the cam. I can see it picking up at least 5 rwhp over the factory Z06 cam-that would put me closer to 420rwhp. I still have to go back with a fresh tank of gas and see if the car still knocks. It was 2 degrees from 4500 rpm and up. This is with sunoco 94 octane but again it was mixed with half a tank sitiing in my car over the winter.
As far as P to V clearance, I can't see it being a problem. The exhaust is the only one you'd have to worry about, but with only 230 degrees of duration and an early exhaust valve closing, I think you'd be fine, but send a PM to geoff to make sure.
Originally Posted by PREDATOR-Z
The reason I said that is that guy allready has the Stealth and is willing to switch, which would be a downgrade IMO.
Cheater cam has its purpose and so does the Stealth.
Cheater cam has its purpose and so does the Stealth.
I agree. Personally I still think the Cheater cam will have more potential than everyone thinks with headers. This is just speculation on my part at this point, however. Jason is putting headers on his car in a couple of weeks. At this point I think we will have some solid answers on what this thing will do cam only.
Originally Posted by Vortech
Patrick can you find out from Thunder if this cam will clear the AFR's milled .040? My car has the AFR's milled .040 and the the .040 Cometics. If there is plenty of clearance -I'll try the cam. I can see it picking up at least 5 rwhp over the factory Z06 cam-that would put me closer to 420rwhp. I still have to go back with a fresh tank of gas and see if the car still knocks. It was 2 degrees from 4500 rpm and up. This is with sunoco 94 octane but again it was mixed with half a tank sitiing in my car over the winter.
Geoff what do you think the cheatr cam is worth over the stock 02Z06 cam? Is there maybe something more optimal for the Z06 do it's freer flowing exhaust? There's like a 10 degree difference in duration plus the added lift which would take advantage of the AFR's. I'm guessing at least 10rwhp-what do you think? Man that would be like 424 or like 480 horse out of a 346-man these motors are badass!