PRC or AFR heads
07-03-2005, 10:58 PM
#62
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The heads are CNC'd in Texas ,and shipped to me (at my own shop)to perform all of the finishing work.I am sorry that you did not get any more information.I will send you a spec sheet.
07-03-2005, 11:41 PM
#64
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Originally Posted by Terry@RacetechSpeed
The heads are CNC'd in Texas ,and shipped to me (at my own shop)to perform all of the finishing work.I am sorry that you did not get any more information.I will send you a spec sheet.
I saw how they were shipped and I would be pissed, one box 2 heads just in plastic, no foam or anything separating them.
So in a nutshell, from Alabama to Hawaii they were bouncing, rubbing, what ever you want to call it against each other.
My ARR's were packed damn good when I got then
07-04-2005, 12:17 AM
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Y2K SS, I wouldnt put the heads on just yet. At least not the way BlueSS made them sound, I would wait, even if I had to put my stockers back on. I am sure there could have been a mix up, and you got a set of heads that an apprentice started messing with or something, in now way did Blue describe a CNC ported head.
Charlie
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07-04-2005, 01:13 AM
#67
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somebody buy both sets of heads setup to yield the same compression or have them loaned from prc and afr...
install one set of heads on X car and strap it on the rollers...swap the heads and do it again the same day...
does this make sense to anyone else or am i pissing in the wind?
install one set of heads on X car and strap it on the rollers...swap the heads and do it again the same day...
does this make sense to anyone else or am i pissing in the wind?
07-04-2005, 07:19 AM
#68
Originally Posted by Tony Mamo @ AFR
Should we also run the CNC porting programs at .060 "step over" so they look like a lot of the other CNC work you might have seen? (...and only take us eight hours of CNC porting versus twelve!)
Stop down at your favorite speed shop that happens to have an AFR head in hand and look it over closely.....then let me know if you don't see "quality" in every aspect of their execution. We could cut corners in numerous ways (a big one I mentioned above)....and ultimately we could sell it for less but don't think the end results would be as good, or as consistant. The castings are more money, we put in premium parts, we run all the CNC machines at extremely fine levels (more accurate reproduction and better "finish" due to less tool deflection), not to mention we have a ton of time in development and R&D, but honestly, the reasons mentioned previously are where the bulk of the extra costs lie.
Someday we might come out with a "street" version and call the current version our competition package, but don't expect the cheaper product to bring home all the bacon....it won't flow quite as much, nor be as consistant, but it would probably be a decent performing head for a little less money.
Personally, when I'm dropping that kind of coin and the "premium part" is only a few dollars more (especially considering the total cost AND time of the H/C swap), I'm going to opt for the better piece because the nature of what we do always keeps us wanting more....why leave some under the table in the first place.
The AFR's represent value at their current price all things considered....value doesn't necessarily mean low price....it means you get a lot for what you paid for. Your always going to have to pay a little more for quality no matter what product you purchase....the quality is there because more time and better parts went into the finished product.
Redneck Z, this post isn't aimed at you personally so dont take it that way....it's just a topic that keeps coming up over and over and the only people I think that truly get it are the ones that actually purchase the product. I don't know of a single customer that wasn't completely satisfied.
Happy Holiday everyone...
Tony M.
Stop down at your favorite speed shop that happens to have an AFR head in hand and look it over closely.....then let me know if you don't see "quality" in every aspect of their execution. We could cut corners in numerous ways (a big one I mentioned above)....and ultimately we could sell it for less but don't think the end results would be as good, or as consistant. The castings are more money, we put in premium parts, we run all the CNC machines at extremely fine levels (more accurate reproduction and better "finish" due to less tool deflection), not to mention we have a ton of time in development and R&D, but honestly, the reasons mentioned previously are where the bulk of the extra costs lie.
Someday we might come out with a "street" version and call the current version our competition package, but don't expect the cheaper product to bring home all the bacon....it won't flow quite as much, nor be as consistant, but it would probably be a decent performing head for a little less money.
Personally, when I'm dropping that kind of coin and the "premium part" is only a few dollars more (especially considering the total cost AND time of the H/C swap), I'm going to opt for the better piece because the nature of what we do always keeps us wanting more....why leave some under the table in the first place.
The AFR's represent value at their current price all things considered....value doesn't necessarily mean low price....it means you get a lot for what you paid for. Your always going to have to pay a little more for quality no matter what product you purchase....the quality is there because more time and better parts went into the finished product.
Redneck Z, this post isn't aimed at you personally so dont take it that way....it's just a topic that keeps coming up over and over and the only people I think that truly get it are the ones that actually purchase the product. I don't know of a single customer that wasn't completely satisfied.
Happy Holiday everyone...
Tony M.
Not flaming as I would love a set of your heads but That is steep. But then again, so is every thing else when it is new. Headers are now in an exceptable range so I can wait.
07-04-2005, 12:56 PM
#69
Originally Posted by AINT SKEERED
SO does this mean that the sbc and sbf heads are not of as high quality?
Not flaming as I would love a set of your heads but That is steep. But then again, so is every thing else when it is new. Headers are now in an exceptable range so I can wait.
Not flaming as I would love a set of your heads but That is steep. But then again, so is every thing else when it is new. Headers are now in an exceptable range so I can wait.
Perhaps we might have sold more heads if we did choose to produce a less expensive product by running a coarser program thru the CNC equipment, saving money on related hardware, not installing titanium retainers (as standard equipment) or machined hardened spring cups etc., but we felt the LS1 crowd simply wanted the best head money can buy and considering what you guys were forking over not too long ago for ported factory castings that produced a mixed bag of results, the price our heads came in at with superior aftermarket castings and NO compromise in quality seemed like a no brainer. I highly doubt you will ever see a price reduction, and while the chances are greater we might produce a "street" version, I wouldn't hold my breath on that one either. You might be better off keeping on eye out in the used market where a 205 might become available due to someone stepping up to a larger shortblock and wanting to step into a pair of 225's.
Tony M.
PS....Phil, look what you started here....this thread has taken on a life of it's own!! Who would have guessed...LOL
Last edited by Tony Mamo @ AFR; 07-04-2005 at 09:56 PM.
07-05-2005, 09:31 AM
#71
Each set of PRC cylinder heads are shipped in a double thick box specifically designed for shipping heads. They are individually wrapped in plastic & shipped with cardboard dividers between them. This method has worked very well for us & it's pretty much the same way all cylinder head companies ship their heads!
I sent you a IM
I sent you a IM
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Co-Owner, Texas Speed & Performance, Ltd.
2005 Twin Turbo C6
404cid Stroker, 67mm Twins
994rwhp/902lb ft @ 22 psi (mustang dyno) www.Texas-Speed.com
Jason
Co-Owner, Texas Speed & Performance, Ltd.
2005 Twin Turbo C6
404cid Stroker, 67mm Twins
994rwhp/902lb ft @ 22 psi (mustang dyno) www.Texas-Speed.com
07-05-2005, 09:46 AM
#72
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I have a set of the PRC's on my car and I love them.I got them shipped up to Canada and there was nothing wrong with them. The customer service from TSP is great also. I know my dyno numbers are low but it was through a stock lid, TB, Pulley, and a rich tune. I vote for the PRC's. Like mentioned above buy the cheaper ones and put in a good clutch if you do not have one. My centerforce DF lasted one day at the track after the H/C swap.
07-05-2005, 10:02 AM
#73
The PRC heads are definately not overpriced Patriots!
Terry @ Racetech does the finishing up for us with his new valve job & decking setup Terry also cuts all the cnc'd retainers for PRC! Terry previously worked for Patriot awhile back, but he now runs a complete Machine shop & does custom CNC'd parts Trust me those heads will make great power! The heads have the brand new GM guides, Manley oversized valves & PRC platinum springs good to .660" lift. All these parts cost additional $$ over some of the competitions' heads, but its parts that we wanted to run to make sure that every set of heads work perfectly & perform just like expected. We could have saved $$ going with off-the-shelf 2.02" valve like everyone else, but instead we paid more to get a custom oversized valve built. We also only use new GM cores so you don't have to worry about heads that are just looking for a reason to drop a valve seat.
Everything on the PRC cylinder heads was designed to accomplish a goal.
Port was wesigned to flow good CFM while keeping A smaller runner size.
Valves were custom built by a name brand company because they flow better than the off the shelf 2.02 setup.
Heads Are Brand New because we don't want any seat falling out issues/oil consumption issues/selling crappy looking used heads etc.
PRC spring kit installed on each cylinder heads: Built with custom cnc'd retainers to get us exactly the spring pressures we want
We designed every aspect of this cylinder head to offer the customer the best quality product at a good price! The main reason we are able to produce the product for the lower price is because PRC doesn't have huge overhead like a lot of its competition. Anyone in business knows that overhead is a killer, & we work really hard to keep overhead down so the cylinder heads prices can stay where they're at.
Terry @ Racetech does the finishing up for us with his new valve job & decking setup
Terry also cuts all the cnc'd retainers for PRC! Terry previously worked for Patriot awhile back, but he now runs a complete Machine shop & does custom CNC'd parts Trust me those heads will make great power! The heads have the brand new GM guides, Manley oversized valves & PRC platinum springs good to .660" lift. All these parts cost additional $$ over some of the competitions' heads, but its parts that we wanted to run to make sure that every set of heads work perfectly & perform just like expected. We could have saved $$ going with off-the-shelf 2.02" valve like everyone else, but instead we paid more to get a custom oversized valve built. We also only use new GM cores so you don't have to worry about heads that are just looking for a reason to drop a valve seat. Everything on the PRC cylinder heads was designed to accomplish a goal.
Port was wesigned to flow good CFM while keeping A smaller runner size.
Valves were custom built by a name brand company because they flow better than the off the shelf 2.02 setup.
Heads Are Brand New because we don't want any seat falling out issues/oil consumption issues/selling crappy looking used heads etc.
PRC spring kit installed on each cylinder heads: Built with custom cnc'd retainers to get us exactly the spring pressures we want
We designed every aspect of this cylinder head to offer the customer the best quality product at a good price! The main reason we are able to produce the product for the lower price is because PRC doesn't have huge overhead like a lot of its competition. Anyone in business knows that overhead is a killer, & we work really hard to keep overhead down so the cylinder heads prices can stay where they're at.
Originally Posted by Y2K SS
Just so you know, my "PRC's" came from a box from Racetech. When I say came in a box I mean just a box! Nothing else!!! 
So I guess basically I just bought overpriced Patriots. I got some pics I'm gonna ppost of them as well. I have a lot more venting to do but like I said earlier, I wanna give my favorite parts store a chance first. I'm gonna call them at 3am my time just so I can.....oh **** I gotta wait until tuesday. Dunno if I can keep my venting off till then.
So I guess basically I just bought overpriced Patriots. I got some pics I'm gonna ppost of them as well. I have a lot more venting to do but like I said earlier, I wanna give my favorite parts store a chance first. I'm gonna call them at 3am my time just so I can.....oh **** I gotta wait until tuesday. Dunno if I can keep my venting off till then.
__________________
Jason
Co-Owner, Texas Speed & Performance, Ltd.
2005 Twin Turbo C6
404cid Stroker, 67mm Twins
994rwhp/902lb ft @ 22 psi (mustang dyno) www.Texas-Speed.com
Jason
Co-Owner, Texas Speed & Performance, Ltd.
2005 Twin Turbo C6
404cid Stroker, 67mm Twins
994rwhp/902lb ft @ 22 psi (mustang dyno) www.Texas-Speed.com
07-06-2005, 09:51 AM
#74
well im sitting here in south florida on vacation a day before I head off to the Bahamas for some fishing. And in a geek move, I brought my laptop on vacation just to follow this thread. As a reminder, never use dial up again. I was really hoping that a couple guys would have posted some PRC numbers by now to help me.
Im happy to generate the dicussion in this thread. Im impressed that Tony and Jason are openly talking up their heads for all of us to see. Time to go back to fishing. If I make the trip back from the bahamas, Ill buy a set of heads.
Just to close out the thread. Now its getting to me and I started it !
Im happy to generate the dicussion in this thread. Im impressed that Tony and Jason are openly talking up their heads for all of us to see. Time to go back to fishing. If I make the trip back from the bahamas, Ill buy a set of heads.
Just to close out the thread. Now its getting to me and I started it !
07-09-2005, 08:24 AM
#76
Phil-
Heres my .02....
Dont forget theres no core exchange for your heads when you buy AFRs. That means you can sell your stock heads to offset the final cost of getting a set of 205s. Then your reducing the difference a few hundered bucks more to get a proven performance head. If it means taking another week or two to get the extra cash, I would do it.
I was on the same boat as you as I wanted to get a set of stage 2 LS6 heads. ECS talked me out of it (not tony) advising me save some mor emoney and get AFRs. And i didnt even buy from them.
They were right, I only have a baby cam 220/220 on a 115 and I made 412RWHP, 385RWT! It may not seem a whole lot for a
H/C setup but ive beaten cars on the street with bigger cams than me.
AFRs has proven to me they deliver the HP and torque across the powerband. Not just at peak RPM.
Your cam should pair up nicely with 205s. Go with the best for your ride!
Heres my .02....
Dont forget theres no core exchange for your heads when you buy AFRs. That means you can sell your stock heads to offset the final cost of getting a set of 205s. Then your reducing the difference a few hundered bucks more to get a proven performance head. If it means taking another week or two to get the extra cash, I would do it.
I was on the same boat as you as I wanted to get a set of stage 2 LS6 heads. ECS talked me out of it (not tony) advising me save some mor emoney and get AFRs. And i didnt even buy from them.
They were right, I only have a baby cam 220/220 on a 115 and I made 412RWHP, 385RWT! It may not seem a whole lot for a
H/C setup but ive beaten cars on the street with bigger cams than me.
AFRs has proven to me they deliver the HP and torque across the powerband. Not just at peak RPM.
Your cam should pair up nicely with 205s. Go with the best for your ride!
Last edited by eamador11; 07-09-2005 at 09:28 AM.
07-09-2005, 09:41 AM
#78
TECH Fanatic
Originally Posted by eamador11
Phil-
Heres my .02....
Dont forget theres no core exchange for your heads when you buy AFRs. That means you can sell your stock heads to offset the final cost of getting a set of 205s. Then your reducing the difference a few hundered bucks more to get a proven performance head. If it means taking another week or two to get the extra cash, I would do it.
I was on the same boat as you as I wanted to get a set of stage 2 LS6 heads. ECS talked me out of it (not tony) advising me save some mor emoney and get AFRs. And i didnt even buy from them.
They were right, I only have a baby cam 220/220 on a 115 and I made 412RWHP, 385RWT! It may not seem a whole lot for a
H/C setup but ive beaten cars on the street with bigger cams than me.
AFRs has proven to me they deliver the HP and torque across the powerband. Not just at peak RPM.
Your cam should pair up nicely with 205s. Go with the best for your ride!
Heres my .02....
Dont forget theres no core exchange for your heads when you buy AFRs. That means you can sell your stock heads to offset the final cost of getting a set of 205s. Then your reducing the difference a few hundered bucks more to get a proven performance head. If it means taking another week or two to get the extra cash, I would do it.
I was on the same boat as you as I wanted to get a set of stage 2 LS6 heads. ECS talked me out of it (not tony) advising me save some mor emoney and get AFRs. And i didnt even buy from them.
They were right, I only have a baby cam 220/220 on a 115 and I made 412RWHP, 385RWT! It may not seem a whole lot for a
H/C setup but ive beaten cars on the street with bigger cams than me.
AFRs has proven to me they deliver the HP and torque across the powerband. Not just at peak RPM.
Your cam should pair up nicely with 205s. Go with the best for your ride!
07-09-2005, 10:24 AM
#79
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Originally Posted by eamador11
Phil-
Heres my .02....
Dont forget theres no core exchange for your heads when you buy AFRs. That means you can sell your stock heads to offset the final cost of getting a set of 205s.
Heres my .02....
Dont forget theres no core exchange for your heads when you buy AFRs. That means you can sell your stock heads to offset the final cost of getting a set of 205s.
07-09-2005, 11:22 AM
#80
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Originally Posted by 4mula
who is gonna buy stock heads, thats the problem
PHIL, I hope you dont get blown away down there.. might want to head for cover right about now.. lol Hurricanes a comin!
