EarlsWS6

I am getting SDPC to build a 422 Iron Block. I am going to have a 4.040 Bore 4.125 Stroke motor. I need some help with parts selection.



Stuff I already own

2002 TA Convertible 6 speed
255 lph fuel pump and 42 lb injectors
1 7/8 headers to true duals w/ cutouts on the headers
Full BMR Suspension (all the goodies)
Spec 3I Clutch Billet Flywheel
12 Bolt Spool 4.11 Gears
6 Point roll cage

Stuff I am thinking about buying.
Fast 90 and Nick Williams TB
Patriot LS6 Stage III Heads 2.08 IN 1.60 EX 321@ 600
TSP Texas Giant Cam: 248/254, .629"/.622", 113 LSA
Denny's NR Driveshaft

I want to run low 10's all motor Please help me do it.

I drive this car on the street also so I would like to stay with a hydraulic cam.

Thanks,
Earl

TAQuickness

iTrader: (28)

Not that you couldn't do it with PP, but I would ante up and get AFR or ET heads.

EarlsWS6

which heads would do better? Any other suggestions on the parts list?

DAPSUPRSLO

iTrader: (14)

The heads and cam choice will be your biggest factor in this area. I'd definately look at some of the bigger ET Performance offerings, maybe the 240 head with a little more cam. That's a big stroke and with a 6.125" rod or smaller you will see tons and tons of piston speed so don't be scared of the bigger cams out there, especially with a fast intake. Have you thought about the edlebrock victor single plain? It will be much much more work to get it to work but will feed that motor much better. Good luck.

Just an FYI, the comp cams camaro with sb2 heads (they are the equivalent of some of your larger ETP heads, probably with better exhaust numbers though) with a 230/236 112 lsa cam and 10.5 to 1 compression made 675 horsepower at 6800rpm with a single plane intake and 4150 style throttle body (like i'm suggesting to you). The motor was only 410 inches with a 3.75 stroke. Cam was a solid roller but only around .59x" lift, you definately could run that with the hydraulic technology out there. Car also only has 3.50 gears with a richmond 6 speed.

EarlsWS6

Maybe ET Performance or AFR cam chime in here, also if a sponsor has a better cam for this goal please check in also. I dont have a unlimited budget maybe in the $7000.00 range for the whole setup that is why I was thinking Patriot. For the money they are hard to beat. I dont want to do this twice either.

SAM98WS6

I would go with at least AFR 225s...you will be leaving alot of power on the table if you dont.

Other stuff looks great...make sure you get the BMR K-member too.

J02ws6transam

iTrader: (4)

i would go with the afr 225cc mongoose heads. I just purchased them for a ls1 455ci motor that i am working on. The afr heads along with the fast90/nw throttle body would be the best setup. That is that i will be running. Give tony a call at afr. they are great people there and make the best heads out there.
Jon

DAPSUPRSLO

iTrader: (14)

Well here are the flow numbers for the 240 cc ET Head on a 4.00" bore. Like I've said before with a pistons speed like that of the 4.125" stroke and 6.125" or smaller rod will have this head would probably be killer. I wouldn't worry about velocity too much, that motor is going to create plenty of velocity with that piston speed. Good luck. What are the flow numbers like on the AFR 225 head on a 4.00 bore?

Valve Lift Intake Exhaust Valve Lift
.100" 73 57 .100"
.200" 152 114 .200"
.300" 210 164 .300"
.400" 266 204 .400"
.500" 312 224 .500"
.550" 327 228 .550"
.600" 338 231 .600"
.650" 346 234 .650"
.700" 320 236 .700"

383ss

iTrader: (14)

no way would I put patriot heads on it, go with some ET performance, DART or AFR 225's. if the AFR's ever come out in small chamber. I'd also go with 1 3/4 headers for a street setup. they will make close to the same peak hp unless you are spinning it over 6500. I like the cam. the clutch won't hold up to too much abuse, I've had 2 with my 408, so if you plan to go to the track a lot, I would get a stage 4 or 5 spec or go with a RAM VDS.

low 10's are going to be tough unless you are pretty light.

EarlsWS6

Well mid 10's would be great also.
I appreciate all the help guys.
I think that I am about ready to finish my ordering.

I think that this cam looks like a good grind I was just thinking that it might need to be a little larger for my goal of low to mid tens.

Thanks,
Earl

stevemilz

iTrader: (3)

EarlsWS6

I just talked to Texas Speed how do you guys think this cam will do.
I really think that with a 4.125 stroke this will be a torque monster so I will need a large cam to get the HP out of it.

257in 264ex duration 623in 646ex Lift on a 113 lsa

Thanks,
Earl

383ss

iTrader: (14)

I would go with a little bigger gear, maybe a 4.30. do you plan to run 28's at the track? guess I should ask that first.

EarlsWS6

Yeah I plan on running 28" tires, but I have a set of 26" ET Streets right now I can use. However I really want to keep this gear.

DAPSUPRSLO

iTrader: (14)

Ha ha, now you're getting some where. That motor is going to swallow up some big cammin, especially with an intake which limits the air flow potential of just about any head you put on it. Cam looks good to me, now just get yourself some top notch heads and you'll be set!

EarlsWS6

DAPSUPRSLO I called ET Performance and I cannot afford their heads I wish that I could those flow numbers are sick. I just cant justify putting almost the same money in the heads as the shortblock. I might be able to someday so I am having SDPC to install headstuds in the block so heads will be a easy change over.
I would go with a diffrent intake, but that single plane will end up costing too much. I hope a large cam will help make up some.


Guys will this bigger cam fit?

And I talked to Kris and they can sonic test the block so I am now going 4.060 bore -- 427

Heads will be stock deck height.
3 cc valve reliefs ( or do I need larger notches )
pistons come 10 thousandths out of the hole
2.08 in 1.60 ex valves

and last but not least I was thinking 11.5 - 11.6 cr what do you guys think I should set my compression ratio at.

It has to run on 93 octane


Thanks,
Earl

DAPSUPRSLO

iTrader: (14)

I understand man, funny how the budget factor always has to come into play, ha ha. I think she'll still make plenty of power though for ya. As far as piston to valve clearence I don't know on that one. My gut feeling says that it will not clear and you may need bigger notches but I am not sure on that by any means. Like I said before one thing you have going for you is the fact that those pistons will move very fast, especially around TDC so that will gain you some p/v clearence. I'd say go a little bigger on the notches though to be safe and MAKE SURE TO CLAY IT for safety sake. As far as compression goes the short r/s ratio motors send to be less sensitve to detonation cause of the speed at which things happen at TDC. I would think 11.5 11.6 to 1 wouuld be just fine. And here is some food for thought. I've been told by a very knowledgeable source that some of the c5-r teams run as much as 17 to 1 static compression cuase the intake flow to the motor is very limited. Don't get me wrong, not saying you should run 17 to 1, but I am saying that a motor which is limited on the intake side will be limited to the BMEP (break mean effective pressure) it can produce so one way to gain some of this back is to bump up the static compression a little. Remember, BMEP (think of it as the total sum of all factors creating a total cylinder pressure, this what we try to achieve more and more of) is what causes nock issues, too much of it for a given octane and bad things will happen. Good luck!!!

DAPSUPRSLO

iTrader: (14)

Looks like you just added that little bit about the bigger bore there. With a 6.125" rod your r/s ratio will be 1.48 and with a 6.200" rod your r/s (rod/stroke) ratio will be 1.5. These numbers are on the lower end of acceptable r/s ratios from everything i've seen as well for a street motor. I would think about going that big on the iron block as it will reduce the integrity of the cylinder walls and with these low r/s ratios these cylinder walls will see much greater loads then something with a r/s ratio of 1.7 and up. Once again, talk to your engine builder about this and see what he is comfortable with doing.

Good articles on r/s ratios and their effects on power and longevity.

http://www.stahlheaders.com/Lit_Rod%20Length.htm
http://victorylibrary.com/mopar/rod-tech-c.htm

EarlsWS6

Man thats some good reading I just briefly looked over it. I will read the rest of it now.

As far as cylinder wall thickness the Kris @ SDPC said they will test enough blocks until they feel it is safe to bore .060 or if they cant find a good enough block I will step back down to 422. I dont think there will be a diffrence in power. I just really liked the Idea of 427. I also thought that it wouldnt be much, but it would bring my motor a little closer to square.

PS. Thanks for the articles

DAPSUPRSLO

iTrader: (14)

No problem, it's good to read and edumacate your self