prc heads and ms3 or order
12-31-2005, 02:26 AM
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prc heads and ms3 or order ok today i ordered a set of PRC 5.3L stage 2.5 heads with resessed valves and a ms3 v.3 cam..
my car is a 2002 full bolton t\a ssf 3500 stall and 3.73 gears and alot of suspension work....
i had a hard time choosing between this cam and a torquer v2 cam BUT being this is my seccond car and i drive it once a week for fun only i figured i wanted to get the most out of my motor.... I was warned that due to the small lowend of this cam the car might buck or surge a bit at part throddle or deceleration but i figure a good tuner should be able to work things out there pretty well....
BEFORE you alll start the whole "you need a bigger stall argument" i do realise this cam would like a slightly larger stall and that if i had perfict traction the T2 cam might have given me a better 60'.... But my logic in choosing this cam is that i do not plan of getting a sticker tire than i have now (315-35-17 nitto 555's) and with the ssf 3500's 2.5 str i waste my tires if i try WOT launches .. so i figure giving up a little power out of the hole might actually do me some good if it ment more top end because i wil not be able to put that increase in low end to the ground but i will be able to use more to end....
in any case this setup should be here in a week or two and i should have in installed by febuary (money issues).. im hopeing to have near the same success predator z has had with the t2 cam and prc heads just on 1.7X 60" instead of his 1.5XX 60" (ideally)
in any case, your opnions and advice are appriciated...
-john
my car is a 2002 full bolton t\a ssf 3500 stall and 3.73 gears and alot of suspension work....
i had a hard time choosing between this cam and a torquer v2 cam BUT being this is my seccond car and i drive it once a week for fun only i figured i wanted to get the most out of my motor.... I was warned that due to the small lowend of this cam the car might buck or surge a bit at part throddle or deceleration but i figure a good tuner should be able to work things out there pretty well....
BEFORE you alll start the whole "you need a bigger stall argument" i do realise this cam would like a slightly larger stall and that if i had perfict traction the T2 cam might have given me a better 60'.... But my logic in choosing this cam is that i do not plan of getting a sticker tire than i have now (315-35-17 nitto 555's) and with the ssf 3500's 2.5 str i waste my tires if i try WOT launches .. so i figure giving up a little power out of the hole might actually do me some good if it ment more top end because i wil not be able to put that increase in low end to the ground but i will be able to use more to end....
in any case this setup should be here in a week or two and i should have in installed by febuary (money issues).. im hopeing to have near the same success predator z has had with the t2 cam and prc heads just on 1.7X 60" instead of his 1.5XX 60" (ideally)
in any case, your opnions and advice are appriciated...
-john
12-31-2005, 02:49 AM
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just got done lisening to your car in the video forum mike...it sounds exastly like i would want a car to sound.. im thinkin im gonna be verry happy once i get this all installed
12-31-2005, 03:46 AM
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ya know looking at the dyon graphs on tsp website it looks that the ms3 makes more power at every point from 3000rpms on up .. yea at some times not much more but from my comparsions of the two graphs it just seems at any rpm (above 3k) your better off with an ms3 cam yea im sure a 4000+ stall would work better for either cam but it just seems that for the track the ms3 is a better (faster) choice in my (already tractionless situation) even with a 3500 stall... now if i was runnin slicks then mabye the situation would be different but as far as JUST shift extensions go i can see why a t2 cam would be looked at as being better cam for smaller stalled cars
again the only advantage i see to a t2 cammed car vs a ms3 car is if you could apply 100% of the power below 3k and hook up... if not, adding more down low and giving up top end just dont seem like a good idea????
all this is overlooking comfort of course..
again the only advantage i see to a t2 cammed car vs a ms3 car is if you could apply 100% of the power below 3k and hook up... if not, adding more down low and giving up top end just dont seem like a good idea????
all this is overlooking comfort of course..
12-31-2005, 04:21 AM
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The only time I've ever tried to apply any sort of power below 3K was either climbing a hill on the highway or trying to launch my M6 on street tires without spinning to high heaven.
I doubt you'd ever really notice the difference between them at WOT below 3K just because you'll never spend any time there.
Since you're a stalled auto I can't really comment on if you'd see a difference between the two below 3k part-throttle street driving, though.
I doubt you'd ever really notice the difference between them at WOT below 3K just because you'll never spend any time there.
Since you're a stalled auto I can't really comment on if you'd see a difference between the two below 3k part-throttle street driving, though.
12-31-2005, 04:31 AM
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yea some just say a 3500 stall is too small for such a big cam.. and yea i agree i could benfit form a bigger stall but for now i think it will be fine , when the tranny goes down the road then mabye il go 4000+ stall next time
12-31-2005, 02:26 PM
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My main concern would be your dynamic compression ratio. I'm gonna assume these heads are unmilled and have somewhat sunk valves and probably need to be used with a relatively thick head gasket also. Sounds like your gonna end up with a static compression ratio of around 10.3 to 1 or so. I'd see if I could get one of the DCR gurus here to figure your DCR for you. A low DCR(dynamic compression ratio) can make for a really spongy engine. Could be just what you need though to keep it hooked up. For optimum engine performance, the parts of your combination need to be well matched.
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12-31-2005, 04:14 PM
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unmilled heads advertised @ 10.75 cr valves will be reesessed and im gonna use a gm mls gasket.... hell the only thing different here from the t2 setup is the cam is a little bigger and the heads have resessed valves .. could this really hurt me ? and by spongy im guessing you mean low tq??? or do you mean all arround **** numbers?
12-31-2005, 06:04 PM
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I only meant spongy down low. Your setup could be dead on. Without knowing your DCA, it's hard to say although with a cam that big, it's gonna be pretty spongy down low anway. More compression will help your engine at all rpms. It sounds like you're definitely not wanting to flycut and I can understand that. It's a hassle on these cars.
12-31-2005, 06:06 PM
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dammit now ya got me worried... all i know is i would have to loose shitloads of lowend to hookup .. as of now my launches are this sort of rolling mush that 99% of the time i end up breaking the tires loose even when tring to do it right .. if i just slam it down, the car likes to go sideways out of the hole and i gotta counter steer to keep it from fishtailin thru 1st... so why focus on making power i cant use when i belive a bigger cam will give me more up top without me having to give up any usable power down low
12-31-2005, 06:08 PM
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now, if your saying that my dcr is gonna be low and that low dcr is gonna cause me to have a shitty midrange and topend compared to a t2 cam then; to me this is cause for alarm!! i dont know much about dcr so edcuate me please..
12-31-2005, 06:12 PM
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ok.. just saw you replied to my above posts... i wouldent mind flycutting mabye if it ment that much but then again i was also under the assumption milling can hurt flow #'s so the question then becomes is it better to have higher compression and less flow or more flow and less compression......
01-02-2006, 10:10 PM
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Hmm. Don't know if milling hurts flow or not. There are some good posts on DCR in the Advanced Tech section here. Check some of them out. I believe someone there has a downloadable DCR calculator also. There's some really smart people hanging around here. If you could one of them to help you figure your SCR and your DCR, I think it might shed some better light on your combo.