The LS1 EWP is out
On The Tree
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Re: The LS1 EWP is out Again i will say Visceral's proposition is a very good one and fair. If he and MTI can get a 17+rwhp gain i will bet that everyone will be suitably impressed regardless of any other claims. And it would be great press for the EWP *if* it can be done.
Raughammers car is down right now. Viscerals car and offer utilizing MTI are good. JUMP ON IT! <img src="gr_grin.gif" border="0">
Raughammers car is down right now. Viscerals car and offer utilizing MTI are good. JUMP ON IT! <img src="gr_grin.gif" border="0">
Re: The LS1 EWP is out [quote]Originally posted by ls1fun:
<strong>Again i will say Visceral's proposition is a very good one and fair. If he and MTI can get a 17+rwhp gain i will bet that everyone will be suitably impressed regardless of any other claims. And it would be great press for the EWP *if* it can be done.
Raughammers car is down right now. Viscerals car and offer utilizing MTI are good. JUMP ON IT! <img src="gr_grin.gif" border="0"> </strong><hr></blockquote>
I have to admitt I'd like to see that happen too.
<strong>Again i will say Visceral's proposition is a very good one and fair. If he and MTI can get a 17+rwhp gain i will bet that everyone will be suitably impressed regardless of any other claims. And it would be great press for the EWP *if* it can be done.
Raughammers car is down right now. Viscerals car and offer utilizing MTI are good. JUMP ON IT! <img src="gr_grin.gif" border="0"> </strong><hr></blockquote>
I have to admitt I'd like to see that happen too.
TECH Apprentice
Joined: Nov 2001
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From: NJ
Re: The LS1 EWP is out ok I think some of you didn't understand all that i was saying so i'll go over it
talonws6's car 00 6sp WS6 14rwhp 15rwtq STock Tuning
Joe's 00SS ed wright tuning previous to baseline dyno 25rwhp 15rwtq
so the waterpump itself "freeing up" 14rwhp/15rwtq and with a combination that can use the extra cooling charcteristics ie FI,N2O, or advanced timing will get better results, like those we got with Joe's SS. I want to reiterate the the Programming was done prior to the baseline dyno graph. so if we do the math again and we get 14 from the pump and 11 from the tuning which is great, but what you have t realize that without the pump we WOULDN'T have gotten that additional 11 rwhp without the reverse cooling,which enabled us to achieve the performance we did. What i'm trying to say, Pro Stock Jon realizes it, is that the pump is actually a tuning aid, that can help lessen or eliminate detonation which will release the true output of your combination.
Jay
talonws6's car 00 6sp WS6 14rwhp 15rwtq STock Tuning
Joe's 00SS ed wright tuning previous to baseline dyno 25rwhp 15rwtq
so the waterpump itself "freeing up" 14rwhp/15rwtq and with a combination that can use the extra cooling charcteristics ie FI,N2O, or advanced timing will get better results, like those we got with Joe's SS. I want to reiterate the the Programming was done prior to the baseline dyno graph. so if we do the math again and we get 14 from the pump and 11 from the tuning which is great, but what you have t realize that without the pump we WOULDN'T have gotten that additional 11 rwhp without the reverse cooling,which enabled us to achieve the performance we did. What i'm trying to say, Pro Stock Jon realizes it, is that the pump is actually a tuning aid, that can help lessen or eliminate detonation which will release the true output of your combination.
Jay
Re: The LS1 EWP is out Not to be the devil's advocate, but it sounds like if the tuning alowed the waterpump to gain 25hp, it was some pretty inappropriate tuning initially. To take it to an extreme, you can say that jmX's recent replacement driveshaft gave him 405hp <img src="gr_stretch.gif" border="0">
It is often said that if you remove uneeded advance, the engine will not over compensate and add knock retard beyond what is necessary. For example, 26 degrees advance is better than 29 degrees of advance and 8 degrees of knock retard. It cannot be said that previously the tuning was all whacky for the car. The water pump, while allowing perhaps 2 degrees more advance actually may have been preventing 8 degrees of knock retard.
Im not trying ot be a pain in the ***... Im just pointing out that the 25hp figure is not necessarily from one optimized combination to the next.
The 14hp number is pretty good. It would be cool to see that on several cars, including heads/cam cars and other non-stock combinations.
Chris
It is often said that if you remove uneeded advance, the engine will not over compensate and add knock retard beyond what is necessary. For example, 26 degrees advance is better than 29 degrees of advance and 8 degrees of knock retard. It cannot be said that previously the tuning was all whacky for the car. The water pump, while allowing perhaps 2 degrees more advance actually may have been preventing 8 degrees of knock retard.
Im not trying ot be a pain in the ***... Im just pointing out that the 25hp figure is not necessarily from one optimized combination to the next.
The 14hp number is pretty good. It would be cool to see that on several cars, including heads/cam cars and other non-stock combinations.
Chris
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From: NJ
Re: The LS1 EWP is out Chris
We are both thinking alike now the #'s that i have quoted are the real numbers that we have seen on the dyno and that can be duplicated with confidence. I'm sorry but i don't have any other instances that we have tested under (AT THE MOMENT) so I can't give you any other information.
the idea for a back to back test at another shop is a good idea butas you all want unbiased #'s we still want to know that the #'s are true as well, so we're going to have to need some control over the situation, which most of you will agree is fair. I'm currently working on a testing scenario at the moment and i will update you with what comes of it.
I enjoy how this thread has gone technical as opposed to complaining, and I'm trying to work out a way where you will all see the benifits that Joe and I have seen. Although i know all of you will not buy this pump,Joe and I are still proud of the job we've done to bring this project to market.
Jay
We are both thinking alike now the #'s that i have quoted are the real numbers that we have seen on the dyno and that can be duplicated with confidence. I'm sorry but i don't have any other instances that we have tested under (AT THE MOMENT) so I can't give you any other information.
the idea for a back to back test at another shop is a good idea butas you all want unbiased #'s we still want to know that the #'s are true as well, so we're going to have to need some control over the situation, which most of you will agree is fair. I'm currently working on a testing scenario at the moment and i will update you with what comes of it.
I enjoy how this thread has gone technical as opposed to complaining, and I'm trying to work out a way where you will all see the benifits that Joe and I have seen. Although i know all of you will not buy this pump,Joe and I are still proud of the job we've done to bring this project to market.
Jay
Re: The LS1 EWP is out </font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Originally posted by MelloYellow:
<strong>ttt
Back from the grave...
What ever happened with this?
Was it ever released?</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Yes, it was released. Don't think many were sold though....very few people willing to sell a kidney or mortgage their house in order to buy a waterpump. <img border="0" alt="[angel]" title="" src="graemlins/gr_angel.gif" /> <img border="0" alt="[jester]" title="" src="graemlins/gr_jest.gif" />
Seriously though, I think they're still available on JPR's website.
BTW...why are you asking...did you hit the Powerball? (sorry, couldn't resist <img border="0" alt="[devil]" title="" src="graemlins/gr_devil.gif" /> )
<strong>ttt
Back from the grave...
What ever happened with this?
Was it ever released?</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Yes, it was released. Don't think many were sold though....very few people willing to sell a kidney or mortgage their house in order to buy a waterpump. <img border="0" alt="[angel]" title="" src="graemlins/gr_angel.gif" /> <img border="0" alt="[jester]" title="" src="graemlins/gr_jest.gif" />
Seriously though, I think they're still available on JPR's website.
BTW...why are you asking...did you hit the Powerball? (sorry, couldn't resist <img border="0" alt="[devil]" title="" src="graemlins/gr_devil.gif" /> )
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Re: The LS1 EWP is out I was under the impression it was never released. I know of two or three people now that would try out the waterpump. I think after a few months $850 doesn't seem so bad after all, especially if it gains even 5-10rwhp.
Re: The LS1 EWP is out I believe Joe is making them in regular flow not reverse.
Call JPR and ask them.
IMO,Reverse could be beneficial but not nessessary/Mezeire has a pulley and a pump for the LS1 NOW.Terry sez u dont need a stat and runs it on his car.
I would want a stat if it were my car.
Call Joe or Jay
JS
<small>[ August 13, 2002, 11:43 AM: Message edited by: JS ]</small>
Call JPR and ask them.
IMO,Reverse could be beneficial but not nessessary/Mezeire has a pulley and a pump for the LS1 NOW.Terry sez u dont need a stat and runs it on his car.
I would want a stat if it were my car.
Call Joe or Jay
JS
<small>[ August 13, 2002, 11:43 AM: Message edited by: JS ]</small>
Re: The LS1 EWP is out If you look at it as $850 for a 25 HP gain and not $850 for a water pump, then it becomes acceptable by LS1 performance mod standards. After all we do pay $1200 bucks for headers you know. This is assuming the stated HP gains are accurate enough enough to be attained by the average enthusiast on this board.
There are side benefits; cooler running engine which can allow for more timing, lighter weight (every bit counts right?), cleaner looking engine compartment, simple installation.
Jay - Indepedent testing would do this piece wonders. Maybe sell 4-5 units at a very reduced price to select people across the country in various climates for extensive testing (i.e. dyno,track,a-tap and street). Then have them report it back to you. That way you have empirical data logged to back up the HP claims.
There are side benefits; cooler running engine which can allow for more timing, lighter weight (every bit counts right?), cleaner looking engine compartment, simple installation.
Jay - Indepedent testing would do this piece wonders. Maybe sell 4-5 units at a very reduced price to select people across the country in various climates for extensive testing (i.e. dyno,track,a-tap and street). Then have them report it back to you. That way you have empirical data logged to back up the HP claims.
Re: The LS1 EWP is out The EWPs will be available soon- Joe has had some delays with the machine shop- problems with the CNC program. There are about five prototypes being run on different cars- all with no problems. The pump can be run either reverse-flow or regular flow, and my understanding is that it will be very easy to switch direction if the customer wants to try both configurations on their car.
TECH Apprentice
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From: NJ
Re: The LS1 EWP is out </font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Originally posted by Jay 95WS6:
<strong>i have NO connection with the product that JPR is now selling and as a matter of fact JPR should be recieving a subpeona for the lawsuit from the product we were to produce together
Jay Fisher</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">
<strong>i have NO connection with the product that JPR is now selling and as a matter of fact JPR should be recieving a subpeona for the lawsuit from the product we were to produce together
Jay Fisher</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">
TECH Fanatic
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From: High Point North Carolina
Re: The LS1 EWP is out </font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Originally posted by Jay 95WS6:
<strong> </font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Originally posted by Jay 95WS6:
<strong>i have NO connection with the product that JPR is now selling and as a matter of fact JPR should be recieving a subpeona for the lawsuit from the product we were to produce together
Jay Fisher</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif"></strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Wow, I'm shocked to hear this....
<strong> </font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Originally posted by Jay 95WS6:
<strong>i have NO connection with the product that JPR is now selling and as a matter of fact JPR should be recieving a subpeona for the lawsuit from the product we were to produce together
Jay Fisher</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif"></strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Wow, I'm shocked to hear this....
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From: Raleigh, NC
Re: The LS1 EWP is out Hey, I respect you just for wading into that verbal gauntlet.
It'll be interesting to see what your first customers' comments are. Good luck!
Actually, if the claims were true, the time it takes to change out a water pump is SIGNIFICANTLY less daunting for a "nearly first" mod, compared to hearders, cam, stage I heads or mild stall converter.
It'll be interesting to see what your first customers' comments are. Good luck!
Actually, if the claims were true, the time it takes to change out a water pump is SIGNIFICANTLY less daunting for a "nearly first" mod, compared to hearders, cam, stage I heads or mild stall converter.
