FTRA Flow Test ----> Updated version!
01-22-2002, 11:04 PM
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FTRA Flow Test ----> Updated version! Hi Everyone,
This past weekend, I conducted extensive testing on the FTRA (Fast Toys Ram Air Kit) in conjuction with various intake lids (both stock and aftermarket). The following are my results.
Caveat: Testing was conducted to be as fair and consistent as possible. However, some variables could not be precisely controlled so a margin or error does exist. I did average results and threw out the highest and lowest readings. Also, the fixed air source was focused and not as even as actual air speed would be from the forward motion of a vehicle through the atmosphere (sorry - no wind tunnel here). I feel that even air flow would have resulted in ever better results!
All tests were performed on a work bench (not on the vehicle). The stock lower air base assembly, air tray and oem style air filters were used in all cases.
First off, I have been emphasizing how important it is to have a GOOD seal on the FTRA. I found that ALL of the lids including the oem one leaked (although the oem leaked the least). Leaks were common on the following arears:
1. At the latch where the lid clamps down to the base
2. All around the gap between the air lid and the base
3. Around the air filter tray within the air box
4. At the base of the lower air filter assembly
By sealing up all the leaks, I picked up over 5 MPH air speed on the outlet side of the air box starting with a 40-50 MPH muzzle velocity air speed! That's over 10 % folks and it will only get worse at higher speeds!
All testing after this point with done with all lids properly sealed to help eliminate that variable.
Test series one: All using K&N Air Filter
Compare air speed at base of ram air kit, hence forward called inlet speed (bottom of the ram air plate) to output air speed from the air box neck.
Stock Lid - No Baffles:
Inlet speed: 60.3 MPH
Outlet speed: 36.2 MPH
Whisper Lid
Inlet speed: 58.8 MPH
Outlet speed: 23.4 MPH
Direct Flow Lid
Inlet speed: 57.0 MPH
Outlet speed: 30.4 MPH
Now before you all wonder why the stock lid seems to have performed the best, you have to realize that the stock lid has the smallest outlet flow area. Here are my measurements:
Stock lid outlet area: .0434 FT^2
Whisper and Direct flow outlet area: .0668 FT^2
To compare all these lids, I measured average CFM of air flow on the outlet. I took this data and multipled by outlet area to give me a flow index number. This is what I came up with:
Stock lid w/ no baffles @ 36.2 MPH outlet speed: 140.92
Whisper Lid @ 23.4 MPH outlet speed: 141.95
Direct Flow Lid @ 30.4 MPH outlet speed: 166.94
There you have it!
Sorry but I was not able to test air speeds beyond the 60 MPH area but obviously as you drive faster, you will get more air flow from the added pressure.
Interesting Data
The K&N filter was worth a full 3.6 MPH more outlet speed over a paper WIX filter @ 55.0 MPH inlet speed!
Upgraded FTRA Ram Air Plate
As you have all seen, I updated the design of the FTRA ram air plate. That was the original intent of my test which slowly expanded scope because I like this sort of thing
My main goal in the new design was to provide more even and consistent air speed across the entire ram air duct. This will cut down on turbulance and increase the volume of air entering the air lid.
To test this theory, I measured air speed at the bottom of the ram air plate and then at the top of the duct where the air enter the air lid. I took average readings in the center or the duct and on the left and right hands sides. I then averaged the flow rates to give me an index. Comparing the results from the new and old plates gave me the answer I was looking for!
Old ram air plate index: 1344
New ram air plate index: 1554
That's 13.5 % improvement at less than 60 MPH air speed!
Looking at the individual data points, the reasons became obvious! The flow rates across the outlet of the duct with the new ram air plate design were higher and much more even! Goal achieved!
Some Conclusions
The stock air lid design with the baffles removed isn't as bad as I expected. I believe the fins on the inside and the oval to round outlet style helps achieve greater air velocity. The only thing that really seems to hurt the performance is that the outlet size is significantly smaller than the aftermarket lids.
There is a difference between lids when encountering fast moving air. This would not show up on a dyno!
Recommendations
Get a FTRA, K&N Filter and a Direct Flow Lid! We even sell them as a package
Thanks everyone!
This past weekend, I conducted extensive testing on the FTRA (Fast Toys Ram Air Kit) in conjuction with various intake lids (both stock and aftermarket). The following are my results.
Caveat: Testing was conducted to be as fair and consistent as possible. However, some variables could not be precisely controlled so a margin or error does exist. I did average results and threw out the highest and lowest readings. Also, the fixed air source was focused and not as even as actual air speed would be from the forward motion of a vehicle through the atmosphere (sorry - no wind tunnel here). I feel that even air flow would have resulted in ever better results!
All tests were performed on a work bench (not on the vehicle). The stock lower air base assembly, air tray and oem style air filters were used in all cases.
First off, I have been emphasizing how important it is to have a GOOD seal on the FTRA. I found that ALL of the lids including the oem one leaked (although the oem leaked the least). Leaks were common on the following arears:
1. At the latch where the lid clamps down to the base
2. All around the gap between the air lid and the base
3. Around the air filter tray within the air box
4. At the base of the lower air filter assembly
By sealing up all the leaks, I picked up over 5 MPH air speed on the outlet side of the air box starting with a 40-50 MPH muzzle velocity air speed! That's over 10 % folks and it will only get worse at higher speeds!
All testing after this point with done with all lids properly sealed to help eliminate that variable.
Test series one: All using K&N Air Filter
Compare air speed at base of ram air kit, hence forward called inlet speed (bottom of the ram air plate) to output air speed from the air box neck.
Stock Lid - No Baffles:
Inlet speed: 60.3 MPH
Outlet speed: 36.2 MPH
Whisper Lid
Inlet speed: 58.8 MPH
Outlet speed: 23.4 MPH
Direct Flow Lid
Inlet speed: 57.0 MPH
Outlet speed: 30.4 MPH
Now before you all wonder why the stock lid seems to have performed the best, you have to realize that the stock lid has the smallest outlet flow area. Here are my measurements:
Stock lid outlet area: .0434 FT^2
Whisper and Direct flow outlet area: .0668 FT^2
To compare all these lids, I measured average CFM of air flow on the outlet. I took this data and multipled by outlet area to give me a flow index number. This is what I came up with:
Stock lid w/ no baffles @ 36.2 MPH outlet speed: 140.92
Whisper Lid @ 23.4 MPH outlet speed: 141.95
Direct Flow Lid @ 30.4 MPH outlet speed: 166.94
There you have it!
Sorry but I was not able to test air speeds beyond the 60 MPH area but obviously as you drive faster, you will get more air flow from the added pressure.
Interesting Data
The K&N filter was worth a full 3.6 MPH more outlet speed over a paper WIX filter @ 55.0 MPH inlet speed!
Upgraded FTRA Ram Air Plate
As you have all seen, I updated the design of the FTRA ram air plate. That was the original intent of my test which slowly expanded scope because I like this sort of thing
My main goal in the new design was to provide more even and consistent air speed across the entire ram air duct. This will cut down on turbulance and increase the volume of air entering the air lid.
To test this theory, I measured air speed at the bottom of the ram air plate and then at the top of the duct where the air enter the air lid. I took average readings in the center or the duct and on the left and right hands sides. I then averaged the flow rates to give me an index. Comparing the results from the new and old plates gave me the answer I was looking for!
Old ram air plate index: 1344
New ram air plate index: 1554
That's 13.5 % improvement at less than 60 MPH air speed!
Looking at the individual data points, the reasons became obvious! The flow rates across the outlet of the duct with the new ram air plate design were higher and much more even! Goal achieved!
Some Conclusions
The stock air lid design with the baffles removed isn't as bad as I expected. I believe the fins on the inside and the oval to round outlet style helps achieve greater air velocity. The only thing that really seems to hurt the performance is that the outlet size is significantly smaller than the aftermarket lids.
There is a difference between lids when encountering fast moving air. This would not show up on a dyno!
Recommendations
Get a FTRA, K&N Filter and a Direct Flow Lid! We even sell them as a package
Thanks everyone!
01-22-2002, 11:16 PM
#3
Speed freak
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Re: FTRA Flow Test ----> Updated version! Does this mean you'll be replacing our old plates for free? <img src="gr_grin.gif" border="0">
<img src="gr_images/icons/wink.gif" border="0"> j/k
Thanx for the info. Sounds like you were busy. I'm sure this will help many people make a decision on their choices of air induction as well.
<img src="gr_images/icons/wink.gif" border="0"> j/k
Thanx for the info. Sounds like you were busy. I'm sure this will help many people make a decision on their choices of air induction as well.
01-22-2002, 11:19 PM
#4
Re: FTRA Flow Test ----> Updated version! Thanks for the results. My dealings with you personally when I bought my pullies, LCA's, and FTRA were great. Make sure you post when you have the updated plate, for those of us with the old version, available. I want one. <img src="gr_stretch.gif" border="0">
01-23-2002, 12:39 AM
#7
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Re: FTRA Flow Test ----> Updated version! Just read on another site:
Quote from Preddy
"For those of you that want to upgrade to the new ram air plate design, updates will be available in a couple of weeks for 20.00 + shipping.
Please keep in mind that the old design is still excellent and will provide a very noticeable improvement in performance. We just strive to continually improve our product
I know all of you are going to ask "How much better will the performance be with the new design"? Unfortunately, we have 8 inches of snow on the ground, so all my results were on the flow bench. I saw a 14% improvement in peak air flow in my simulations. What this will translate into at the track is hard to say."
Quote from Preddy
"For those of you that want to upgrade to the new ram air plate design, updates will be available in a couple of weeks for 20.00 + shipping.
Please keep in mind that the old design is still excellent and will provide a very noticeable improvement in performance. We just strive to continually improve our product
I know all of you are going to ask "How much better will the performance be with the new design"? Unfortunately, we have 8 inches of snow on the ground, so all my results were on the flow bench. I saw a 14% improvement in peak air flow in my simulations. What this will translate into at the track is hard to say."
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01-23-2002, 12:50 AM
#8
Re: FTRA Flow Test ----> Updated version! I bought my FTRA used, thus didn't get the blockoff plate nor front seal (both which I ordered later). But I had already sealed all but the front bottom edge of the air lid against the metal support so that absolutely all air would come frmo the front or bottom. However, the RTV slightly interferes with the installation of the blockoff plate, as the plate is now too wide. I haven't yet decided what to do about that.
01-23-2002, 06:53 AM
#9
TECH Junkie
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Re: FTRA Flow Test ----> Updated version! So, what exactly has changed with the new ram air plate? I think I can handle a $20 upgrade <img src="gr_stretch.gif" border="0">
01-23-2002, 09:28 AM
#10
Re: FTRA Flow Test ----> Updated version! Interesting results.
How about a photo of the new plate?
[moderator job]
Sure would be nice if you were a sponsor and we could just click on the side bar to get to your site. <img src="gr_grin.gif" border="0"> <img src="gr_stretch.gif" border="0">
[/moderator job]
How about a photo of the new plate?
[moderator job]
Sure would be nice if you were a sponsor and we could just click on the side bar to get to your site. <img src="gr_grin.gif" border="0"> <img src="gr_stretch.gif" border="0">
[/moderator job]
01-23-2002, 10:03 AM
#12
TECH Senior Member
Re: FTRA Flow Test ----> Updated version! Interesting, the stock lid being practically as good as the Whisper is VERY suprising. I certainly would have thought there to be far more difference between stock and a Whisper v/s a Whisper and a Direct Flow. Hmmm...might have to upgrade! <img src="gr_images/icons/wink.gif" border="0">
C'mon! IT'S SPONSOR TIME PHIL!!! No telling how many of these things you could sell with a banner up and a couple of GPs going.
I know I've recommended the FTRA to countless numbers ever since I installed my first one. You've probably sold enough of them by word of keyboard to pay for quite a few years of sponsorship. <img src="gr_images/icons/wink.gif" border="0">
C'mon! IT'S SPONSOR TIME PHIL!!! No telling how many of these things you could sell with a banner up and a couple of GPs going.
I know I've recommended the FTRA to countless numbers ever since I installed my first one. You've probably sold enough of them by word of keyboard to pay for quite a few years of sponsorship. <img src="gr_images/icons/wink.gif" border="0">
01-23-2002, 11:36 AM
#13
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Re: FTRA Flow Test ----> Updated version! Colonel/Nineball: I send you guys a note about sponsorship and someone was supposed to get back to me and never did <img src="gr_sad.gif" border="0"> Send me the info again <img src="gr_stretch.gif" border="0">
I was very surprised about the performance of the stock lid. However, as I stated, THIS WAS WITHOUT the baffles in place. Those baffles are joke and kill performance more than anything. Do you guys remember when MTI lids were 249.99 and people where just cutting off the baffles on the stock lid and getting similiar results? Since the whisper lid is a copy of the MTT lid (as far as I know), it makes sense that results were similiar.
The direct flow surprised me. I didn't expect the margin to be as big. However, it makes sense that radiused (rounded) edges will keep air speed and flow at a higher level than squared corners. People are already accusing me of being biased because we sell the direct flow, but believe me, I wasn't. We used to sell the Whisper too until an unfortunate (cough cough copied our FTRA) incident occurred.
Keep in mind, that this was lid performance in conjunction with the FTRA...can't say "exactly" what would happen when used alone.
Do I think an even better lid can be made? To quote Stone Cold Steve Austin "Hell YEAH!" However, this would take a lot of time and substantial investment and with the fbodies being retired, probably will not happen.
During the testing, I had to remove and seal the lids OVER AND OVER....needless to say, I got pretty good at it! The EASIEST and quickest way to get a good seal is to seal the air box from the inside out. For my purposes, I took duct tape and ran a strip from the edge of the ram air duct flange to the sides of the air filter tray. I also took tape and ran it from the air filter tray to the edge of the air box (because that leaked as well). To top it all off, I took a strip of black electrical tape and went around the gap between the air box lid and base.
Of course, the tape method would prevent you from easily installing the block off plate but if you only care about performance, this is the easiest and surest route.
Other ways to seal:
1. Adhesive foam weatherstripping as supplied in the kit or get some more and go around the whole air box.
2. Thin layer of silicone under the air box.
3. Tape on the outside of the kit.
If costs permit, I am thinking about one day having a plastic insert made which will eliminate a lot of the sealing problems.
Once I have a chance, I will be updated our site with more information and pictures. The new ram air plate design basically has vertical walls on the top portion of the plate to effectively route and trap more air into going into the main duct. It significantly helped to improve average flow rate and velocity.
Hope you guys enjoyed the tech.
Phillip Reddy
Fast Toys Performance Parts
[ January 23, 2002: Message edited by: Fast Toys Performance Parts ]</p>
I was very surprised about the performance of the stock lid. However, as I stated, THIS WAS WITHOUT the baffles in place. Those baffles are joke and kill performance more than anything. Do you guys remember when MTI lids were 249.99 and people where just cutting off the baffles on the stock lid and getting similiar results? Since the whisper lid is a copy of the MTT lid (as far as I know), it makes sense that results were similiar.
The direct flow surprised me. I didn't expect the margin to be as big. However, it makes sense that radiused (rounded) edges will keep air speed and flow at a higher level than squared corners. People are already accusing me of being biased because we sell the direct flow, but believe me, I wasn't. We used to sell the Whisper too until an unfortunate (cough cough copied our FTRA) incident occurred.
Keep in mind, that this was lid performance in conjunction with the FTRA...can't say "exactly" what would happen when used alone.
Do I think an even better lid can be made? To quote Stone Cold Steve Austin "Hell YEAH!" However, this would take a lot of time and substantial investment and with the fbodies being retired, probably will not happen.
During the testing, I had to remove and seal the lids OVER AND OVER....needless to say, I got pretty good at it! The EASIEST and quickest way to get a good seal is to seal the air box from the inside out. For my purposes, I took duct tape and ran a strip from the edge of the ram air duct flange to the sides of the air filter tray. I also took tape and ran it from the air filter tray to the edge of the air box (because that leaked as well). To top it all off, I took a strip of black electrical tape and went around the gap between the air box lid and base.
Of course, the tape method would prevent you from easily installing the block off plate but if you only care about performance, this is the easiest and surest route.
Other ways to seal:
1. Adhesive foam weatherstripping as supplied in the kit or get some more and go around the whole air box.
2. Thin layer of silicone under the air box.
3. Tape on the outside of the kit.
If costs permit, I am thinking about one day having a plastic insert made which will eliminate a lot of the sealing problems.
Once I have a chance, I will be updated our site with more information and pictures. The new ram air plate design basically has vertical walls on the top portion of the plate to effectively route and trap more air into going into the main duct. It significantly helped to improve average flow rate and velocity.
Hope you guys enjoyed the tech.
Phillip Reddy
Fast Toys Performance Parts
[ January 23, 2002: Message edited by: Fast Toys Performance Parts ]</p>
01-23-2002, 02:51 PM
#14
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Re: FTRA Flow Test ----> Updated version! Ditto what PSJ said about possible heating problems. If I have to take lower plate off in summer that defeats the whole purpose. Might as well go with FRA or none of the above.
01-23-2002, 03:09 PM
#15
LS1Tech Co-Founder
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Re: FTRA Flow Test ----> Updated version! I have had FRA for YEARS.
I have totally scoped out FTRA setups. Look excellent. All the serious racers that I respect have it AND all say it's worth a tenth. I'm almost there. I just want someone to tell me how hot the car will get sitting at a light.
I have totally scoped out FTRA setups. Look excellent. All the serious racers that I respect have it AND all say it's worth a tenth. I'm almost there. I just want someone to tell me how hot the car will get sitting at a light.
01-23-2002, 03:10 PM
#16
Re: FTRA Flow Test ----> Updated version! Do the vertical fins result in any less cooling?
I have no cooling issues with the FTRA in the summer. I think it is a bigger issue for A4's because of the aftermarket tranny cooler potentially blocking off part of the radiator.
Good product. <img src="gr_stretch.gif" border="0">
I have no cooling issues with the FTRA in the summer. I think it is a bigger issue for A4's because of the aftermarket tranny cooler potentially blocking off part of the radiator.
Good product. <img src="gr_stretch.gif" border="0">
01-23-2002, 05:28 PM
#17
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Re: FTRA Flow Test ----> Updated version! PSJ: I just posted in another thread about cooling issues....take a look. As I said "most" people do not have an issue. If you have done the fan mod and 160 stat already and your car runs warm/hot now, it "may" be an issue for you. If your car runs cool now under the same driving conditions, it is probably not an issue.
Regardless the lower ram air plate is removable in a few minutes (without taking off the whole kit - yep we designed it that way) should circumstances require extra cooling.
The new plate will not impact cooling as the side plates only begin towards the bottom of the duct work. Air towards the bottom can still tumble of the side for cooling.
Regardless the lower ram air plate is removable in a few minutes (without taking off the whole kit - yep we designed it that way) should circumstances require extra cooling.
The new plate will not impact cooling as the side plates only begin towards the bottom of the duct work. Air towards the bottom can still tumble of the side for cooling.
