RUF SS

Chris ARE 360,

I am very sorry for saying this! Also, I am not trying to upset anyone, but I only want share my experience and loss of $$$$ with ARE!!

MTI changed the valves, the seats, the springs, and retainers.
ARE use weird valves lengths and bad spring setup. The springs were hurting my heads because there were no seats for the springs too!! Now that made me really mad!!! But thank God that I did not give up in finding the problem, so I caught it in the time before it made any serous damage!

I did not want to say anything bad about ARE. But, what could you do! After I got to bad 2 TBs, I got very inpatient (one had a hole in it that they glued and I took it back, the other one was not ported right and was sticking very bad that I could not accelerate at all! I had to port TB my self to fix it!

Pro Stock John

iTrader: (34)

Looks great, but you went from older heads, older cam, and no UD pulley to brand new heads, brand new fast ramp cam, and UD pulley, so to me you are not dinging the old setup you have upgraded to brand new everything. All the speed companies have switched to the faster ram design camshafts because the valvetrain can take it in an LS1-LS6 setup.

So the car does not lope? That's awesome, what a sleeper!!!

AlonzoVersion 1.0

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Originally posted by Pro Stock John:
<strong>Looks great, but you went from older heads, older cam, and no UD pulley to brand new heads, brand new fast ramp cam, and UD pulley, so to me you are not dinging the old setup you have upgraded to brand new everything. All the speed companies have switched to the faster ram design camshafts because the valvetrain can take it in an LS1-LS6 setup.

So the car does not lope? That's awesome, what a sleeper!!!</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Thats pretty much what I was saying.Never the less the majority of the power came from the heads swap.As stated earlier people have made 400 hp with b1 cams on stcok heads so its not all the cam.

Fenris Ulf

A friend of mine made 402 rwhp with stock heads and a B1 cam well over a year ago,TrahnZam WS6 is his screen name. I highly doubt the cam was holding you back, ARE simply cant hold a candle to GTPs porting.

NoGo

iTrader: (2)

FWIW, I put out 356 RWHP with.....

ARE Stage II H/C
Lid
LS6 Intake
Ported TB

Through nearly stock exhaust... JBA shorties and a Flow Master Series 80 muffler....
So basically, a stock exhaust.

The above is with LS1 Edit tuning. Prior to tuning I was puting out 349 RWHP.

So it looks as though JMX is right on with his claim of the ARE heads/cam.

java

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Originally posted by Pro Stock John:
<strong>Looks great, but you went from older heads, older cam, and no UD pulley to brand new heads, brand new fast ramp cam, and UD pulley, so to me you are not dinging the old setup you have upgraded to brand new everything. All the speed companies have switched to the faster ram design camshafts because the valvetrain can take it in an LS1-LS6 setup.</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">good point, I was doing well with 400 / 400 two years ago with my ARE setup ... a year later everyone is 20 rwhp more ... as designs get better the horsepower improves. I am glad that these shops aren't resting on their laurels

akw408

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Originally posted by RUF SS:
<strong>Congratulations Jon!!! Now get those LT quick and I want to see what you get!! If it is worth it I might change my heads to GTP too!!

I was holding out on the ARE heads!! But I have to say they SUCK!! Sorry!
With my ARE heads and TR 227 cam I got 412 rwhp with tuning, 382, and all the good stuff!!!!!

After I took the car to MTI, they fixed the heads and changed the valves and did a flow test before and after (ARE heads flowed about 275 CFM, After MTI did what they did, they flowed about 295 CFM).

At the same time I did a cam swap with the X1. I think the X1 and the TR 227 should not far from each other. If they are maybe 4-5 more rwhp in my opinion!

The result, I got 450 rwhp!!! So, in conclusion, ARE heads suck and I am down $1000 for fixing them!!</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">What is 382? Is that the torque or ci? 412RWHP seems pretty decent to me, unless 382 is the ci.

RUF SS

akw408,

Yeah, that is a 382ci. 412 rwhp on a 382 storker was very sad!

Thanks to MTI. Now it is 450 rwhp 382 stroker!
<img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="gr_stretch.gif" />

jmX

Thanks guys for the congrats.

RufSS, congrats on your 450rwhp car <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="gr_stretch.gif" /> We'll have to run sometime once I get headers. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="gr_grin.gif" />

PSJ, I wasn't trying to say that ARE sucks. I'm just showing my results. Every year I seem to get a new heads/cam setup, and this year the bar was just raised a lot it seems. These heads and cam seem to work GREAT together. A year of LS1 R&D has gone by, and like last year, I decided to go with who I thought was best at the time. These ARE heads DO make power, as I said, my Camaro did 415rwhp with them. I just think the GTP's will make a bit more, as is to be expected with a new design.

All I did was swap the parts and show the graph. I'm not here to bash one company or another, at least in this thread. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="gr_images/icons/wink.gif" />

AlonzoVersion 1.0

Didnt Craig use to work for MTI?If so I find it funny how the 2 companys put out the best heads and of course the most expensive but you get what you pay for as shown on the graph.

RUF SS

JMX,

Sure! I had couple of races but no one came close! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="gr_grin.gif" />

I know that there are car that would kick my @ss here but I have not raced one yet!!

Do you go to hangout these days?

RyanJ

GTP's heads have been good for about a year. since Marsh ran 10.9 at 3475#'s, i believe. 42x-43xrwhp with out of the box Ed Wrong tuning I think.

jmX, what was your explination for roughly the same results on the same dyno with like 4 different cams? I remember thinking it was the heads, but I also remember you saying you had valvetrain, electical, or fuel issues at the time. How much did you gain with your 2.08 ARE heads vs. the IRS 2.02 ones you had before?

Yes, Craig worked at MTI back in the day.

HEAD summary:
ARE heads have always been OK. They have always been BETTER with THEIR cams (big ol' splits). Heads based on velocity rather than cross-section have always make more area under the curve. MTI heads have ALWAYS risen to the top (this includes there not-as-popular S1 heads). GTP's used to suck, but got a hell of a lot better (as stated above). TEA heads also make very good power. Id rate them right with or right below GTP's.