Hotcam MPG results...
05-13-2007, 09:50 PM
#1
Hotcam MPG results... Okay, I installed my hotcam (which I picked up for $120) last monday. With it I threw in some LS6 springs, LS6 oil pump, comp 7.4, LS2 chain, and all new seals. Sort of a fresh-me-up plus a cheap cam for my 1998 100k engine.
Mods are: LT headers, ORY, Hooker Catback, !Air, !EGR, LS6 intake, VHP tuner, Lid, SLP ramair, and now a GM hotcam (219/228 .525/.525 112).
Still stock clutch, stock 3.42 gears.
With the A/C on full blast averaging 70mph I got 29 MPG on my most recent trip. Bam! Wasnt expecting that one at all!
I have played with the tune with my VHP tuner, but I am going nowhere without a dyno or wideband. Trying to time by ear and cut/add fuel by smell is a waste of time. So, I expect my mileage to increase or stay the same once I get it dialed in better. One strange thing though, with the A/C on at an idle the car will stall and die. It just wont happen. I've given it about 100 more RPMs via the tune and it still wont crank the A/C at an Idle. Oh well. Any thoughts on how to correct that one would be appreciated.
29 Miles per gallon is okay by me. Now i need some 4.10s so it will feel like a billion shot
Mods are: LT headers, ORY, Hooker Catback, !Air, !EGR, LS6 intake, VHP tuner, Lid, SLP ramair, and now a GM hotcam (219/228 .525/.525 112).
Still stock clutch, stock 3.42 gears.
With the A/C on full blast averaging 70mph I got 29 MPG on my most recent trip. Bam! Wasnt expecting that one at all!
I have played with the tune with my VHP tuner, but I am going nowhere without a dyno or wideband. Trying to time by ear and cut/add fuel by smell is a waste of time. So, I expect my mileage to increase or stay the same once I get it dialed in better. One strange thing though, with the A/C on at an idle the car will stall and die. It just wont happen. I've given it about 100 more RPMs via the tune and it still wont crank the A/C at an Idle. Oh well. Any thoughts on how to correct that one would be appreciated.
29 Miles per gallon is okay by me. Now i need some 4.10s so it will feel like a billion shot
05-14-2007, 12:06 PM
#2
A small note for the aspiring hotcammer to consider: If you go this route you will most likely decide to get a bigger cam in the future. Why? Because there are SO many better choices out there. Some might argue that it is infact a great cam for a cam only enthusiest, but I just want to clarify that I did it because I was already going in there, and I picked it up for $120 used. I am not terribly thrilled about the driveability. The springs are the luring factor... $55 for a complete set of LS6 springs. Will they work on a hotcam? Oh yeah! Will they work for anything bigger...?... I wouldnt trust em. SO, my point is that if you go for the hotcam kit you will most likely be changing out not only the cam, but the springs too, so you can accomodate the larger lift that comes with the healthier cams on the market today. I say go 918 and dont look back!
05-14-2007, 04:04 PM
#4
Thats a question that I cant answer. I hope that one day I can understand how DCR works and how to build camshafts in my head like predator and patric do.
But, I will say that I bet if all of the parts were GM, then it would probably work pretty well together. And when the hotcam came out wasnt the LS6 head pretty much the top dawg behind the chevy parts counter? My guess is that the exhaust valve events on the hotcam are in the 228 range because of stock exhaust configurations that they were designed around... Meaning that the intake side (LS6 heads and LS6 intake) were pretty good flowing compared to the cast exhaust stuff, so it was given a heftier exhaust side to help it out. I am probably dead wrong though.
Its pretty much a stock 98 cam with .025 more lift and 20 degrees more durration on both lobes, and then a tighter LSA.
Its strange to think that all of my parts (minus the exhaust and Lid) are GM parts. I really didnt intend for that to happen, it just kinda did. They were always the cheapest parts. I've got more in my LS6 intake then I do in my hotcam, LS6 springs, LS6 oil pump, LS2 chain...and even the comp 7.4 rods. Hell, maybe I should get a set of stock LS6 heads to complete it and move over to another project. I'm sure I would notice a nice gain going from 98 heads to stock LS6 heads. Crap, I bet I would see a massive butt-o-meter gain if I just ported out my throttle body, lol. 4.10 gears would make it feel like a monster compared to it now!
But, I will say that I bet if all of the parts were GM, then it would probably work pretty well together. And when the hotcam came out wasnt the LS6 head pretty much the top dawg behind the chevy parts counter? My guess is that the exhaust valve events on the hotcam are in the 228 range because of stock exhaust configurations that they were designed around... Meaning that the intake side (LS6 heads and LS6 intake) were pretty good flowing compared to the cast exhaust stuff, so it was given a heftier exhaust side to help it out. I am probably dead wrong though.
Its pretty much a stock 98 cam with .025 more lift and 20 degrees more durration on both lobes, and then a tighter LSA.
Its strange to think that all of my parts (minus the exhaust and Lid) are GM parts. I really didnt intend for that to happen, it just kinda did. They were always the cheapest parts. I've got more in my LS6 intake then I do in my hotcam, LS6 springs, LS6 oil pump, LS2 chain...and even the comp 7.4 rods. Hell, maybe I should get a set of stock LS6 heads to complete it and move over to another project. I'm sure I would notice a nice gain going from 98 heads to stock LS6 heads. Crap, I bet I would see a massive butt-o-meter gain if I just ported out my throttle body, lol. 4.10 gears would make it feel like a monster compared to it now!
05-14-2007, 04:14 PM
#5
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yeah, some ls6 heads would be icing on the cake. DCR isnt too complicated. You just gotta enter the cam specs in the spread sheet to find out what it is. Then you mill the heads and play with the gaskets to adjust the compression ratio and quench. That will improve torque as well as hp.
05-14-2007, 05:04 PM
#7
Thats pretty freakin awesome! I saw a post where an A4 guy with bolt-ons and a hotcam ran an 11.6 Im still not sure how I feel about it yet, but I might stay the course and say to heck with a 6.0 and start another car project, leaving this car as a hotcam car.
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05-14-2007, 05:08 PM
#8
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Sounds great!
I know it's kinda old tech, but still can make some people very happy. For price you really can get one in for not much money either.
Me looking for a smaller cam myself, I might have to do a little more reading on these things.
I know it's kinda old tech, but still can make some people very happy. For price you really can get one in for not much money either.
Me looking for a smaller cam myself, I might have to do a little more reading on these things.
05-15-2007, 01:01 AM
#9
The full blown kit is a waste of money in my opinion. You get a cam and LS6 springs. The springs are $55.... Do the math. IMO the hotcam is a "used only" purchase. Why? Because for about $70 more you can get a nastier cam with 918s and pushrods from TSP.
05-15-2007, 11:28 AM
#10
Originally Posted by dug
yeah, some ls6 heads would be icing on the cake. DCR isnt too complicated. You just gotta enter the cam specs in the spread sheet to find out what it is. Then you mill the heads and play with the gaskets to adjust the compression ratio and quench. That will improve torque as well as hp.
Andy1
05-15-2007, 11:40 AM
#11
Originally Posted by KurtRardin
Thats pretty freakin awesome! I saw a post where an A4 guy with bolt-ons and a hotcam ran an 11.6 Im still not sure how I feel about it yet, but I might stay the course and say to heck with a 6.0 and start another car project, leaving this car as a hotcam car.
and would like to see your power gains. I would like to see my power gains,my mods are in my sig!!
05-15-2007, 12:13 PM
#12
A dyno tune... probably not. Sorry to say that but I just dont see it in my future. If there was one close by then maybe. There used to be a Dynojet just over ONE FREAKIN MILE from my house. Did I ever use it? No. I was in a little place I like to call Iraq at the time. Maybe 2 months after I got this car the dyno was sold and sent packing. So I missed my opportunity, oh well. To maybe give you some help though it seems that I have seen a full bolt-on car M6 laying down numbers in the 390 range with a hotcam. I believe our enemy is the lift. Now you could probably squeeze out some more numbers with a set of 1.8 or 1.85 rockers. Thats a practice that Vinci HP really enjoys. They have told me that the driver can benefit from more throttle response having the extra lift coming from the rocker arm rather than the cam. If you look they offer a lot of cams in both a high lift and a low lift profile, that way the user can decide how they want to accomplish their desired valve events.
My tune will be strictly from my VHP tuner. If I decide to stay with this cam I feel that I can get a great street tune with a onboard wideband. They're really helpful in helping customers dial in the tune. Oh yeah, and I didnt have a single check engine light after !AIR, !EGR, !CATS, !stock cam.
But for a free cam, I say throw that motha in there. If anything you get a huge sound improvement...it sounds very nasty!
My tune will be strictly from my VHP tuner. If I decide to stay with this cam I feel that I can get a great street tune with a onboard wideband. They're really helpful in helping customers dial in the tune. Oh yeah, and I didnt have a single check engine light after !AIR, !EGR, !CATS, !stock cam.
But for a free cam, I say throw that motha in there. If anything you get a huge sound improvement...it sounds very nasty!
05-15-2007, 12:48 PM
#13
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Originally Posted by Andy1
I posted the question once before, but couldn't find anyone that had the appropriate cam specs (@.006") in order to accurately calculate DCR for the HotCam.
Andy1
Andy1
05-15-2007, 12:50 PM
#14
Originally Posted by KurtRardin
A dyno tune... probably not. Sorry to say that but I just dont see it in my future. If there was one close by then maybe. There used to be a Dynojet just over ONE FREAKIN MILE from my house. Did I ever use it? No. I was in a little place I like to call Iraq at the time. Maybe 2 months after I got this car the dyno was sold and sent packing. So I missed my opportunity, oh well. To maybe give you some help though it seems that I have seen a full bolt-on car M6 laying down numbers in the 390 range with a hotcam. I believe our enemy is the lift. Now you could probably squeeze out some more numbers with a set of 1.8 or 1.85 rockers. Thats a practice that Vinci HP really enjoys. They have told me that the driver can benefit from more throttle response having the extra lift coming from the rocker arm rather than the cam. If you look they offer a lot of cams in both a high lift and a low lift profile, that way the user can decide how they want to accomplish their desired valve events.
My tune will be strictly from my VHP tuner. If I decide to stay with this cam I feel that I can get a great street tune with a onboard wideband. They're really helpful in helping customers dial in the tune. Oh yeah, and I didnt have a single check engine light after !AIR, !EGR, !CATS, !stock cam.
But for a free cam, I say throw that motha in there. If anything you get a huge sound improvement...it sounds very nasty!
My tune will be strictly from my VHP tuner. If I decide to stay with this cam I feel that I can get a great street tune with a onboard wideband. They're really helpful in helping customers dial in the tune. Oh yeah, and I didnt have a single check engine light after !AIR, !EGR, !CATS, !stock cam.
But for a free cam, I say throw that motha in there. If anything you get a huge sound improvement...it sounds very nasty!
I know, I have been reading about that extra lift from the rockers too, maybe I can get'm for fathers day!!!!!
How about a lil xtra lift and milling the heads just a bit more? or maybe a thinner gasket? what do you kurt or anyone else think?
05-15-2007, 03:39 PM
#15
I'll say that if the heads are coming off of my car they aint goin back on. Bare minimum a set of 243 heads will go back on. I see em sell for $500 for a pair all the time. Too bad shes not a 4" bore cuz Id love to snag some L92 heads. Flow wouldnt concern me ever again!
If you're getting into milling heads then you're already outside the bolt-on crowd. Obviously better numbers follow the better overall engine setup.
If you're getting into milling heads then you're already outside the bolt-on crowd. Obviously better numbers follow the better overall engine setup.
05-15-2007, 06:58 PM
#16
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Patriot has a good deal on ported 243 that comes complete with their dual gold springs. You could sell them off to cheapen deal. Also theyll mill the heads to whatever you want. no charge.
05-15-2007, 11:31 PM
#17
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Originally Posted by Andy1
I posted the question once before, but couldn't find anyone that had the appropriate cam specs (@.006") in order to accurately calculate DCR for the HotCam.
Andy1
Andy1
0.006
0.050
Intake Duration - ID (first number)
279
219
Exhaust Duration - ED (second number)
287
228
Lobe Center Angle - LCA (also known as LSA)
112
112
Intake Centerline - ICL (LSA - degrees of advance e.g. 114+2 = 112)
112
112
Intake Valve opens - IVO
27.5
-2.5
Intake Valve closes - IVC
71.5
41.5
Exhaust Valve Opens - EVO
75.5
46
Exhaust Valve Closes - EVC
31.5
2
Exhaust Centerline - ECL
112
112
Overlap
59
-0.5
HTH
05-16-2007, 01:24 PM
#20
Originally Posted by JVetthead
Hotcam
0.006
0.050
Intake Duration - ID (first number)
279
219
Exhaust Duration - ED (second number)
287
228
Lobe Center Angle - LCA (also known as LSA)
112
112
Intake Centerline - ICL (LSA - degrees of advance e.g. 114+2 = 112)
112
112
Intake Valve opens - IVO
27.5
-2.5
Intake Valve closes - IVC
71.5
41.5
Exhaust Valve Opens - EVO
75.5
46
Exhaust Valve Closes - EVC
31.5
2
Exhaust Centerline - ECL
112
112
Overlap
59
-0.5
HTH
0.006
0.050
Intake Duration - ID (first number)
279
219
Exhaust Duration - ED (second number)
287
228
Lobe Center Angle - LCA (also known as LSA)
112
112
Intake Centerline - ICL (LSA - degrees of advance e.g. 114+2 = 112)
112
112
Intake Valve opens - IVO
27.5
-2.5
Intake Valve closes - IVC
71.5
41.5
Exhaust Valve Opens - EVO
75.5
46
Exhaust Valve Closes - EVC
31.5
2
Exhaust Centerline - ECL
112
112
Overlap
59
-0.5
HTH
I know I'm pushing it, but anyone with some spare time willing to run the DCR calc's on a stock LS1 with the Hotcam?
Andy1