The "recipe" to 500 rwhp with heads and cam.
#21
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Originally Posted by Sam-eye-Am
What are you using the throttle activated microswich in that pic for? Is it part of a nitrous kit? Do you have any nitrous numbers for your setup yet?
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2013 Corvette Grand Sport A6 LME forged 416, Greg Good ported TFS 255 LS3 heads, 222/242 .629"/.604" 121LSA Pat G blower cam, ARH 1 7/8" headers, ESC Novi 1500 Supercharger w/8 rib direct drive conversion, 747rwhp/709rwtq on 93 octane, 801rwhp/735rwtq on race fuel, 10.1 @ 147.25mph 1/4 mile, 174.7mph Half Mile.
2016 Corvette Z51 M7 Magnuson Heartbeat 2300 supercharger, TSP LT headers, Pat G tuned, 667rwhp, 662rwtq, 191mph TX Mile.
2009.5 Pontiac G8 GT 6.0L, A6, AFR 230v2 heads. 506rwhp/442rwtq. 11.413 @ 121.29mph 1/4 mile, 168.7mph TX Mile
2000 Pewter Ram Air Trans Am M6 heads/cam 508 rwhp/445 rwtq SAE, 183.092 TX Mile
2018 Cadillac Escalade 6.2L A10 Pat G tuned.
LS1,LS2,LS3,LS7,LT1 Custom Camshaft Specialist For custom camshaft help press here.
Custom LSX tuning in person or via email press here.
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2013 Corvette Grand Sport A6 LME forged 416, Greg Good ported TFS 255 LS3 heads, 222/242 .629"/.604" 121LSA Pat G blower cam, ARH 1 7/8" headers, ESC Novi 1500 Supercharger w/8 rib direct drive conversion, 747rwhp/709rwtq on 93 octane, 801rwhp/735rwtq on race fuel, 10.1 @ 147.25mph 1/4 mile, 174.7mph Half Mile.
2016 Corvette Z51 M7 Magnuson Heartbeat 2300 supercharger, TSP LT headers, Pat G tuned, 667rwhp, 662rwtq, 191mph TX Mile.
2009.5 Pontiac G8 GT 6.0L, A6, AFR 230v2 heads. 506rwhp/442rwtq. 11.413 @ 121.29mph 1/4 mile, 168.7mph TX Mile
2000 Pewter Ram Air Trans Am M6 heads/cam 508 rwhp/445 rwtq SAE, 183.092 TX Mile
2018 Cadillac Escalade 6.2L A10 Pat G tuned.
LS1,LS2,LS3,LS7,LT1 Custom Camshaft Specialist For custom camshaft help press here.
Custom LSX tuning in person or via email press here.
#22
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Nice writeup Patrick. I was looking at your sig and saw the 500 last night and was wondering when you did that.
One thing you need to add to the list if it isn't already there is a stock 10 bolt rear-end and factory wheels.
I havent seen one hi power combo yet with a 9" rear and that goes alone with reducing rotating mass.
You also went from a small cam to a big one. Maybe my lack of power is the 234 cam when all the big numbers are by cams in the 238-242 range?
One thing you need to add to the list if it isn't already there is a stock 10 bolt rear-end and factory wheels.
I havent seen one hi power combo yet with a 9" rear and that goes alone with reducing rotating mass.
You also went from a small cam to a big one. Maybe my lack of power is the 234 cam when all the big numbers are by cams in the 238-242 range?
#23
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Damn that pesky power under the curve! Patricks gone to the dark side! Lets see now I gotta get am aluminum driveshaft and an underdrive pully. You know I got my new GMHTM in the mail last nite and in one of the ads they were claiming 500 hp with this little graph about 2"s square and i didn't look at it anymore. However when Patrick posts up a 500hp thread I believe it. keep talking son wre writting this stuff down!
Last edited by NC98Z; 06-15-2007 at 01:05 PM. Reason: add
#24
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If you don't mind me asking....you said you had timing @ 28degrees for peak torque and 30degrees for peak hp. Where is it at before and after each of those? If you run EFI Live, I'd love to take a peak at your tune.
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#25
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Originally Posted by SSpdDmon
If you don't mind me asking....you said you had timing @ 28degrees for peak torque and 30degrees for peak hp. Where is it at before and after each of those? If you run EFI Live, I'd love to take a peak at your tune. ![Grin](https://ls1tech.com/forums/images/smilies/LS1Tech/gr_grin.gif)
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2013 Corvette Grand Sport A6 LME forged 416, Greg Good ported TFS 255 LS3 heads, 222/242 .629"/.604" 121LSA Pat G blower cam, ARH 1 7/8" headers, ESC Novi 1500 Supercharger w/8 rib direct drive conversion, 747rwhp/709rwtq on 93 octane, 801rwhp/735rwtq on race fuel, 10.1 @ 147.25mph 1/4 mile, 174.7mph Half Mile.
2016 Corvette Z51 M7 Magnuson Heartbeat 2300 supercharger, TSP LT headers, Pat G tuned, 667rwhp, 662rwtq, 191mph TX Mile.
2009.5 Pontiac G8 GT 6.0L, A6, AFR 230v2 heads. 506rwhp/442rwtq. 11.413 @ 121.29mph 1/4 mile, 168.7mph TX Mile
2000 Pewter Ram Air Trans Am M6 heads/cam 508 rwhp/445 rwtq SAE, 183.092 TX Mile
2018 Cadillac Escalade 6.2L A10 Pat G tuned.
LS1,LS2,LS3,LS7,LT1 Custom Camshaft Specialist For custom camshaft help press here.
Custom LSX tuning in person or via email press here.
![](https://ls1tech.com/forums/signaturepics/sigpic210_1.gif)
2013 Corvette Grand Sport A6 LME forged 416, Greg Good ported TFS 255 LS3 heads, 222/242 .629"/.604" 121LSA Pat G blower cam, ARH 1 7/8" headers, ESC Novi 1500 Supercharger w/8 rib direct drive conversion, 747rwhp/709rwtq on 93 octane, 801rwhp/735rwtq on race fuel, 10.1 @ 147.25mph 1/4 mile, 174.7mph Half Mile.
2016 Corvette Z51 M7 Magnuson Heartbeat 2300 supercharger, TSP LT headers, Pat G tuned, 667rwhp, 662rwtq, 191mph TX Mile.
2009.5 Pontiac G8 GT 6.0L, A6, AFR 230v2 heads. 506rwhp/442rwtq. 11.413 @ 121.29mph 1/4 mile, 168.7mph TX Mile
2000 Pewter Ram Air Trans Am M6 heads/cam 508 rwhp/445 rwtq SAE, 183.092 TX Mile
2018 Cadillac Escalade 6.2L A10 Pat G tuned.
LS1,LS2,LS3,LS7,LT1 Custom Camshaft Specialist For custom camshaft help press here.
Custom LSX tuning in person or via email press here.
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Originally Posted by Patrick G
With my old 223/227 110LSA cam, I ran 26 degrees of timing at peak torque and 29 degrees of timing at peak power. The new cam doesn't make as much cylinder pressure and likes a little more timing.
#27
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And so what your saying also is that Tony was able to drasticaly improve the flow in the low's by unshrouding the valves alone. He didnt touch anything else? Did you go to bigger valves? Its hard to read back while I'm writing but I'll look after I post.
As you know I'm extremely flabergasted with my results. I'll post the graph when I get it back in my thread.
I'm just looking at all you did and trying to compare it against my car and see whats up.
As you know I'm extremely flabergasted with my results. I'll post the graph when I get it back in my thread.
I'm just looking at all you did and trying to compare it against my car and see whats up.
#29
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Originally Posted by 99blancoSS
And so what your saying also is that Tony was able to drasticaly improve the flow in the low's by unshrouding the valves alone. He didnt touch anything else? Did you go to bigger valves? Its hard to read back while I'm writing but I'll look after I post.
As you know I'm extremely flabergasted with my results. I'll post the graph when I get it back in my thread.
As you know I'm extremely flabergasted with my results. I'll post the graph when I get it back in my thread.
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2013 Corvette Grand Sport A6 LME forged 416, Greg Good ported TFS 255 LS3 heads, 222/242 .629"/.604" 121LSA Pat G blower cam, ARH 1 7/8" headers, ESC Novi 1500 Supercharger w/8 rib direct drive conversion, 747rwhp/709rwtq on 93 octane, 801rwhp/735rwtq on race fuel, 10.1 @ 147.25mph 1/4 mile, 174.7mph Half Mile.
2016 Corvette Z51 M7 Magnuson Heartbeat 2300 supercharger, TSP LT headers, Pat G tuned, 667rwhp, 662rwtq, 191mph TX Mile.
2009.5 Pontiac G8 GT 6.0L, A6, AFR 230v2 heads. 506rwhp/442rwtq. 11.413 @ 121.29mph 1/4 mile, 168.7mph TX Mile
2000 Pewter Ram Air Trans Am M6 heads/cam 508 rwhp/445 rwtq SAE, 183.092 TX Mile
2018 Cadillac Escalade 6.2L A10 Pat G tuned.
LS1,LS2,LS3,LS7,LT1 Custom Camshaft Specialist For custom camshaft help press here.
Custom LSX tuning in person or via email press here.
![](https://ls1tech.com/forums/signaturepics/sigpic210_1.gif)
2013 Corvette Grand Sport A6 LME forged 416, Greg Good ported TFS 255 LS3 heads, 222/242 .629"/.604" 121LSA Pat G blower cam, ARH 1 7/8" headers, ESC Novi 1500 Supercharger w/8 rib direct drive conversion, 747rwhp/709rwtq on 93 octane, 801rwhp/735rwtq on race fuel, 10.1 @ 147.25mph 1/4 mile, 174.7mph Half Mile.
2016 Corvette Z51 M7 Magnuson Heartbeat 2300 supercharger, TSP LT headers, Pat G tuned, 667rwhp, 662rwtq, 191mph TX Mile.
2009.5 Pontiac G8 GT 6.0L, A6, AFR 230v2 heads. 506rwhp/442rwtq. 11.413 @ 121.29mph 1/4 mile, 168.7mph TX Mile
2000 Pewter Ram Air Trans Am M6 heads/cam 508 rwhp/445 rwtq SAE, 183.092 TX Mile
2018 Cadillac Escalade 6.2L A10 Pat G tuned.
LS1,LS2,LS3,LS7,LT1 Custom Camshaft Specialist For custom camshaft help press here.
Custom LSX tuning in person or via email press here.
#32
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Originally Posted by KCS
Tony,
How did you get those numbers as to where the manifolds "lop off" the airflow?
How did you get those numbers as to where the manifolds "lop off" the airflow?
An engine will still make power pulling a vacuum at WOT. My engine pulls 1.5" of Hg at WOT in the higher rpm ranges. Need to find the culprit.
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2013 Corvette Grand Sport A6 LME forged 416, Greg Good ported TFS 255 LS3 heads, 222/242 .629"/.604" 121LSA Pat G blower cam, ARH 1 7/8" headers, ESC Novi 1500 Supercharger w/8 rib direct drive conversion, 747rwhp/709rwtq on 93 octane, 801rwhp/735rwtq on race fuel, 10.1 @ 147.25mph 1/4 mile, 174.7mph Half Mile.
2016 Corvette Z51 M7 Magnuson Heartbeat 2300 supercharger, TSP LT headers, Pat G tuned, 667rwhp, 662rwtq, 191mph TX Mile.
2009.5 Pontiac G8 GT 6.0L, A6, AFR 230v2 heads. 506rwhp/442rwtq. 11.413 @ 121.29mph 1/4 mile, 168.7mph TX Mile
2000 Pewter Ram Air Trans Am M6 heads/cam 508 rwhp/445 rwtq SAE, 183.092 TX Mile
2018 Cadillac Escalade 6.2L A10 Pat G tuned.
LS1,LS2,LS3,LS7,LT1 Custom Camshaft Specialist For custom camshaft help press here.
Custom LSX tuning in person or via email press here.
![](https://ls1tech.com/forums/signaturepics/sigpic210_1.gif)
2013 Corvette Grand Sport A6 LME forged 416, Greg Good ported TFS 255 LS3 heads, 222/242 .629"/.604" 121LSA Pat G blower cam, ARH 1 7/8" headers, ESC Novi 1500 Supercharger w/8 rib direct drive conversion, 747rwhp/709rwtq on 93 octane, 801rwhp/735rwtq on race fuel, 10.1 @ 147.25mph 1/4 mile, 174.7mph Half Mile.
2016 Corvette Z51 M7 Magnuson Heartbeat 2300 supercharger, TSP LT headers, Pat G tuned, 667rwhp, 662rwtq, 191mph TX Mile.
2009.5 Pontiac G8 GT 6.0L, A6, AFR 230v2 heads. 506rwhp/442rwtq. 11.413 @ 121.29mph 1/4 mile, 168.7mph TX Mile
2000 Pewter Ram Air Trans Am M6 heads/cam 508 rwhp/445 rwtq SAE, 183.092 TX Mile
2018 Cadillac Escalade 6.2L A10 Pat G tuned.
LS1,LS2,LS3,LS7,LT1 Custom Camshaft Specialist For custom camshaft help press here.
Custom LSX tuning in person or via email press here.
#36
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Originally Posted by magius231
might be worth a sticky seeing as how many "how can I get 500rwhp" threads pop up here...
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Great write up Mr. Patrick G!
#37
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Originally Posted by a-low
Hey PatrickG how much flywheel hp are you making?
Also whats your mpg on that setup? It may not be a concern when making 500rwhp but just curious.
Also whats your mpg on that setup? It may not be a concern when making 500rwhp but just curious.
Interestingly, my fuel economy has increased since I've swapped back to the AFR 205s. I'm getting 26-27 mpg with the new heads and cam. That's a gain of at least 1 over my old 475 rwhp setup . The high airspeed of the 205s is really good for gas mileage, in fact, when CARB was doing their certification for the 205s, they found that they got a 2 mpg increase on a stock Z06.
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2013 Corvette Grand Sport A6 LME forged 416, Greg Good ported TFS 255 LS3 heads, 222/242 .629"/.604" 121LSA Pat G blower cam, ARH 1 7/8" headers, ESC Novi 1500 Supercharger w/8 rib direct drive conversion, 747rwhp/709rwtq on 93 octane, 801rwhp/735rwtq on race fuel, 10.1 @ 147.25mph 1/4 mile, 174.7mph Half Mile.
2016 Corvette Z51 M7 Magnuson Heartbeat 2300 supercharger, TSP LT headers, Pat G tuned, 667rwhp, 662rwtq, 191mph TX Mile.
2009.5 Pontiac G8 GT 6.0L, A6, AFR 230v2 heads. 506rwhp/442rwtq. 11.413 @ 121.29mph 1/4 mile, 168.7mph TX Mile
2000 Pewter Ram Air Trans Am M6 heads/cam 508 rwhp/445 rwtq SAE, 183.092 TX Mile
2018 Cadillac Escalade 6.2L A10 Pat G tuned.
LS1,LS2,LS3,LS7,LT1 Custom Camshaft Specialist For custom camshaft help press here.
Custom LSX tuning in person or via email press here.
![](https://ls1tech.com/forums/signaturepics/sigpic210_1.gif)
2013 Corvette Grand Sport A6 LME forged 416, Greg Good ported TFS 255 LS3 heads, 222/242 .629"/.604" 121LSA Pat G blower cam, ARH 1 7/8" headers, ESC Novi 1500 Supercharger w/8 rib direct drive conversion, 747rwhp/709rwtq on 93 octane, 801rwhp/735rwtq on race fuel, 10.1 @ 147.25mph 1/4 mile, 174.7mph Half Mile.
2016 Corvette Z51 M7 Magnuson Heartbeat 2300 supercharger, TSP LT headers, Pat G tuned, 667rwhp, 662rwtq, 191mph TX Mile.
2009.5 Pontiac G8 GT 6.0L, A6, AFR 230v2 heads. 506rwhp/442rwtq. 11.413 @ 121.29mph 1/4 mile, 168.7mph TX Mile
2000 Pewter Ram Air Trans Am M6 heads/cam 508 rwhp/445 rwtq SAE, 183.092 TX Mile
2018 Cadillac Escalade 6.2L A10 Pat G tuned.
LS1,LS2,LS3,LS7,LT1 Custom Camshaft Specialist For custom camshaft help press here.
Custom LSX tuning in person or via email press here.
#38
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Wow...
This thread blew up quickly....LOL
Ive been away most of the day dyno testing and just got back. I dont have much time now but wanted to compliment (and congratulate) Pat on an excellent write-up and impressive results. We had discussed this project at great length some time ago and the results certainly make a case for alot of the theory I have been preaching for some time. The obvious being that once again the AFR 205 emissions legal stock geometry head can deliver the goods (with the right supporting mods and tune) and it is simply the right choice for any N/A 346 from mild to wild.
Obviously this wasn't an out of the box 205 and I spent a fair amount of time optimizing it for the low and midlift flow Pat has already touched on. Between you and I most of the ports in Pat's head fell short of 300 CFM @ .600 lift usually peaking at that number closer to .575 and falling off slightly. Put a manifold in front of that head (not a radius plate) and install it on a running engine and all bets are off. Strong average airflow (killer low and midlifts) and a proper cross sectional area which promotes airspeed and stonger cylinder fill momentum (energy) is where its at. Dont get me wrong, you still need solid peak numbers but not at the expense of the curve.
Also, I have seen higher than 280 CFM with a few of my recent ported FAST efforts (over 300 actually with a 330 CFM port) but none the less the point Pat is making is still valid. A huge port with "OK" low/midlift flow and an intake that will knock down a sizable percentage of where that head shines will leave you with poor velocity and mediocore results because the average airflow with the intake in place may not be much more than a smaller head with better lows and mids, but the big head still has the big lazy hole to activate and get air moving thru.
Anyway...Ive got alot going on this weekend. I will try to keep an eye on this thread and post accordingly as soon as I can.
Killer results Patrick....and the way it carries power is a thing of beauty!
Regards,
Tony
PS...Chalk up another solid combination for the "blue pill" crowd
This thread blew up quickly....LOL
Ive been away most of the day dyno testing and just got back. I dont have much time now but wanted to compliment (and congratulate) Pat on an excellent write-up and impressive results. We had discussed this project at great length some time ago and the results certainly make a case for alot of the theory I have been preaching for some time. The obvious being that once again the AFR 205 emissions legal stock geometry head can deliver the goods (with the right supporting mods and tune) and it is simply the right choice for any N/A 346 from mild to wild.
Obviously this wasn't an out of the box 205 and I spent a fair amount of time optimizing it for the low and midlift flow Pat has already touched on. Between you and I most of the ports in Pat's head fell short of 300 CFM @ .600 lift usually peaking at that number closer to .575 and falling off slightly. Put a manifold in front of that head (not a radius plate) and install it on a running engine and all bets are off. Strong average airflow (killer low and midlifts) and a proper cross sectional area which promotes airspeed and stonger cylinder fill momentum (energy) is where its at. Dont get me wrong, you still need solid peak numbers but not at the expense of the curve.
Also, I have seen higher than 280 CFM with a few of my recent ported FAST efforts (over 300 actually with a 330 CFM port) but none the less the point Pat is making is still valid. A huge port with "OK" low/midlift flow and an intake that will knock down a sizable percentage of where that head shines will leave you with poor velocity and mediocore results because the average airflow with the intake in place may not be much more than a smaller head with better lows and mids, but the big head still has the big lazy hole to activate and get air moving thru.
Anyway...Ive got alot going on this weekend. I will try to keep an eye on this thread and post accordingly as soon as I can.
Killer results Patrick....and the way it carries power is a thing of beauty!
![Driving](https://ls1tech.com/forums/images/smilies/LS1Tech/gr_driving3.gif)
Regards,
Tony
PS...Chalk up another solid combination for the "blue pill" crowd
![The Jester](https://ls1tech.com/forums/images/smilies/LS1Tech/gr_jest.gif)