Red2000SS

Yes 308 is very close to the 305 rating as you stated, but your 308 dyno is RWHP (obviously), but GM rates the engines at the flywheel. GM is not claiming the standard LS1 (in an Fbody) produces 305 HP at the rear wheels - they are claiming it produces 305 HP at the flywheel. People can argue the drivetrain losses, but I think the general consensus is 12-15% for a M6, and 15-20% or so for an A4. If the LS1 in an Fbody really only had 305HP at the flywheel, we would expect it to dyno around 260RWHP plus or minus a little...

Almost everyone agrees that GM underates the HP figures for the Fbody's so they are less than the corvette, when in fact a bone stock Fbody will dyno very close if not a little more than a bone stock LS1 corvette (LS6 corvette is a different ballgame...). The corvette has probably a little more loss through its drivetrain because of the independent rear suspension, as well as bigger rims and heavy - *** run-flats.

I think most of the people on this thread are genuinely trying to offer good advice, WicketMike got this thread off to a bad start by immediately posting asking if your post was a joke - somehow implying you are and idiot. I don't think you're and idiot, nor do I think any of the other posters do.

Good luck in whatever you end up with.

bigeller

iTrader: (2)

I'll definitely be running a healthy cam. What do you guys think about the M2 with this setup. I'm also considering the G5x2. Remember I want this to be able to be a daily driver if called upon. I also plan on have the heads ported and possibly milled a tad depending on the cam and clearance issues. What kind of power and torque are we talking with the heads, Big cam, headers,LS6 intake, and the rest of the bolt ons?

Pro Stock John, since you're in the know, what piston rings do you reccommend and what are they going to cost me? $$$?

Thanks alot for the support guys. Really really I do undertand about flywheel vs rwhp! lol

SUX2BU

iTrader: (14)

it is i the all famous "SUX2BU" speaking so listen up.
actually michael sorry for the misunderstaning on the phone. i first put my low compression 6.0 in my car with the 6.0 heads and my LS1 stock cam.so it had 9.4-1 comp.all i had was a lid a cutout and hooker long tubes. and i dynoed 340-360.with the addition of the F1 cam i dynoed 372/377.then put on an LS6 intake, stock 99 LS1 heads, MMT M2 cam and now i dyno 406/417.i tried to spray it but my clutch slipped. i bougt some '02 LS1 heads (heard they flow a little better than 99 heads)that i'm going to mill .040(to make up for the dished pistons)and slap those on and tune it to try and get 420/430.oh and i picked up my 6.0 for $850 and i sold my blown up 5.7 block and heads for $550 so i spent 300 bucks on an almost new motor(when i got it it had less than 1,000 miles.)

bigeller

iTrader: (2)

Sweet! Thanks for clearing that up Jaun..

Gotta love the torque!

red90cobra

iTrader: (36)

A 6.0 motor is the way to go for more cubes, yes the weight is there but I feel like the dish piston in my 6 liter is keeping me from actually grenading my motor. I made 380/380 with the mms 229 cam and hooker lt. No tunning. I sprayed a 175 shot @ 1400 psi and made 565/657. Before that I had a custom grind cam. 226/234 52x/54x 112 lsa. All of these were with stock tunning and running the stock 6.0 heads. And also stock injectors and fuel pump. And welcome to the iron block club. And for the person that mention the serpentine belt. You have to use the brakets for the ls1. It's just too much work to relocate everything. And a truck intake will not fit no matter what. Cause it will hit the part where your wind shield wiper motor goes. And all your ls1 accessories goes on the lq4 and lq9. You use the ls1 oil pan and crank pulley and alternator along with the water pump. And everything bolts up. Minus two alternator bolts. But there's two holdin that in. Well good luck to you Micheal. Let us know how it goes. Oh and right now with some ported 5.7 heads and g5x2 with the stock ls1 intake and no tunning I made 414/409. I just don't make as much torque as juan. His car has always been a torque monster. I figure I could gain alot more with some more bolt ons and tunning.

Seifer

well, i have an idea, most cams right now like the G5X-2 cam for instance are pushing the very limits of P2V clearance.. but with dished pistons on a regular 6 liter block.. couldnt you put a cam in there with much more lift/duration?

like, say.. 234/234 610/610 111? with 5.3liter heads unmilled that would make a BAD *** COMBO. you would have compression, and dished pistons for ultra lift, ultra duration.. and more cubes to boot! and a nice strong iron block, i fail to see any downsides, other than a little more weight..

am i way off? or what.

J-Rod

The 6.0L would be a cool idea. I think I would consider a set of forged slugs for a big Nitrous load, and I would look at putting a better cam in it.

As for the last post. You bring up a good point on the dished pistons with 5.3L heads and a big stick...

BigTex

iTrader: (16)

I wish I had seen this thread earlier. I think the LQ9 is a great motor. I do agree the weight is a negative compared to your alum LS1. With a good sized cam, it will make more power than an LS1. Will it be enough to offset the weight? Who knows. If you plan on installing it as is, I say go for it. If you are going to have it bored and worked over, you should sell the LQ9 for biger $$$ and buy a cheaper LQ4 to build up. The main benefits for the LQ9 are its hypereutectic pistons and higher compression ratio, but you'd be throwing those away if you have it bored. $1000 is great price, your very lucky.

Oh yeah, the article in GM High tech stating the LQ9 heads are "preferred" is wrong. Chris Endres wrote that and made a few mistakes with the LQ4 / LQ9 head numbers. I think he calculated out CC volume from the compression ratio but screwed up because he didn't acount for the LQ4 having dished pistons. I have several sets of 6L heads, and they are all 317 castings. Even the ones I just pulled out of this 2003 Escalade are 317 castings.

I took this picture today, a 2003 EXT having a 423 stroker installled.

bigeller

iTrader: (2)

Thanks for posting this.. I've been telling some friends that has to be a misprint in GMHTP. It just purely didn't make sense. That will be a bad *** Escalade!

blownZ71

iTrader: (1)

Apparently the LQ4 is prefered to the LQ9 for its lower compression. Is that the only factor, and can the compression on the LQ9 be changed to create the same effect? I want to build a blower 6.0 and need the lower compression, I think I might be able to get a good deal on the LQ9 from a local guy who I don't think he knows what it is. Would this be effective and what changes would I have to make to the LQ9? Thanks for any response

bigeller

iTrader: (2)

That's not true. It depends on what you want to do. The LQ9 is easily worth double the money of an LQ4. It also makes more power NA with the higher compression. The only difference in the two engines are the pistons.

bigeller

iTrader: (2)

Well I said I'd post back up with the progress etc.. It'll be a while before it's tuned and dynoed..

Here are some sound clips. The car is untuned and I can't rev it as it's not broken in yet.. Right click and save as..

http://pages.sbcglobal.net/bigeller/Z28/RearDvrZ2.mov

http://pages.sbcglobal.net/bigeller/Z28/sideZ28.mov



[color=green]Mods to my 1999 Z28 are:<!--color--></font>

2002 Cadillac Escalade LQ9 6.0 10:1 engine.
Stock 6.0 D port heads
TSP 228R cam 228/228 .588/.588 111 LSA +2 ground in + 2 more by us.
Hooker Longtubes
Mufflex 3" to 4" Y no cats
4" Mufflex/spintech single out
Lingenfelter intake tapped for direct port jugo
Vig 3200
3:73s

Taspeed

iTrader: (1)

naaaahhh...spank man ain't got the clue...I did a lot of this install and this car is making an assload of power. As soon as he gets it broke in we will get the dyno #'s posted up. All in all I felt it to be a pretty decent swap, and the iron block having some structural advantages over an aluminum block hp limitation wise....but it was said before "to each his own"

LSs1Power

iTrader: (5)

Very nice... Now get us the dyno numbers and track time.

99 Black Bird T/A

iTrader: (4)

Compression is about what stock LS1 has. The bore is bigger. 6.0 heads are similar to LS6 heads and will out flow an LS1 head. So far so good.

Be sure and get an LS6 intake. Based on the flow data C. Endres posted a while back the LS6 intake outflows the truck intake.

Good basic hot rodding idea.

Don't cut corners on the head work. Get them ported and a good valve job, dual springs, quality valves, milled a little up compresson to so 10.5 to 10.8 or what the porter says will work. The heads work will be the KEY to getting the most out of that 4 inch bore.

I'd be sure and get tuning too, LS6 like different timing curve etc than LS1 heads, I don't what the 6.0 heads will like etc so getting tuning is very important.

Well I see it like this. My set isn't anything special it's a typical heads and cam deal. I got 418rwhp 404rwtq.

The 01 and up 6.0 heads will out flow a 5.3, with similar port work, good valve job, a bigger bore and more cubes, the 6.0 heads have more potential to make power than my set up does.

The intakes will be the same if you use a LS6 intake.

The 6.0 is ~366 CID compared to a 5.7's 346 CID with 20 more cubes you should be able to go a little bigger on the cam. If you get tuning you definately can go bigger cam wise. Again the nod is to the 6.0

I think about 229/229 XE-R for starters.

I think the 6.0 heads could be worth 10 to 15 rwhp over the 5.3's. I think the extra 20 CID is worth 20rwhp. A 229 cam should be worth ~5rwhp or more over the 224.

So ~35 to ~40 rwhp over my set up is ~453 to ~458rwhp for a M6. A4's usually dyno a little lower, so I'd think 435rwhp to 445rwhp with an A4 depending on converter &amp; tranny slipage, gears etc.

Everyone probably going so what lots of 346's make that or better, true but the extra 20 CID etc of the 6.0 should give it a 20 to 25 rwtq edge over a 346.

Even with the extra 75 lbs of weight costing a little less than 1/10 (100lbs = 1/10), the 6.0's torque should make up for that and a little more. I think it would be 1/10 to 2/10's faster than a simlar alum 5.7

Of course it's all speculation on my part but I think the idea of using the LQ9 is valid. That's what hotrodding is about trying new stuff and seeing how it works.

Good Luck!

I'd like to do exactly the same thing to my 91 RS Camaro

bigeller

iTrader: (2)

Thanks

-Joseph-

iTrader: (12)

I wanna see some dyno numbers too.

Stu'sWS6

iTrader: (3)

I think that the LQ9 is a viable option for someone who is reaching the limits of the LS1/LS6 aluminum block. I personally couldn't justify adding 80 lbs to the front of my car, just to do something that is "outside the norm." I think that this setup is well within "the norm" on this site. I just wouldn't even mess with it unless I was doing AT LEAST-forged pistons, arp rod bolts, new rings/bearings etc. IMO these items should be considered minimum on a reliable nitrous LS1. It will last for a while with the stock parts, but why risk it on a swap that will not net the best bang for your buck-you have no job. Shop around and find some exhaust/cam and get the car tuned and you will have a reliable, and most importantly for you, Low buck setup with around 400 rwhp. Sell the Escalade motor, or if you are in love with the heads, sell the shortblock and keep the heads. If you are worried about your current 1999 shortblock, upgrade it with the above mentioned parts. Plus if you do the cam swap, you won't need an ls6 intake right away. Just my .02

NasT

Mike i like the idea... MORE DISPLACEMENT IS GOOD... If the heads are cleaned up u will benifit more,from the cam ..Plus remember with more cubes. THE CAM can be a lil bigger for the Simple fact there wont be so much driveability issues..Also i was wondering if the Tuning of an F body would increase the horsepower .. I know that damn Caddy couldnt be set up with a performance tune from the factory.. More Cubes Likes more cam,more Cubes make more tourqe and tourqe usually wins races ..Jus get those heads treated to a nice job, and spary the HELL OUT OF HER.. I do like the idea of changing Rings..and if u do that .. how about some rod bolts..I think the g5x2 cam can be improved on, with your set up..Maybe a bit more Duration..remember u will need valve springs and retainers,with anice timming chain..Also technically wouldnt there BE MORE CLEARANCE IN the Piston to valve...If So GET A BIG FAT CAM..I like the idea.. Hope u prove all those NaySayers Wrong bud...Now Tahts Hotrodding!

nassau joe

well, i have just put a new 6.0 in my 99 vette, and am having no trouble what so ever. am running a 242/242 cam with over 600 lift, driving it in the heat of memphis and no problems. love the sound as well. for those that think this is a joke, ill be laughing when im running in the 10's, can cruise with the air on, drive to california if desired, and did i mention no worry of a dropped sleeve!!!!!!joe in memphis, and by the way, elvis aint the only thing that's rockin in memphis, just look for a nassau blue vette coming to a track near you!