NEW LSX Intake Mainfold better then FAST
01-11-2008, 12:04 PM
#41
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I think some people are missing a few points, they tested it on a GTO and it made 32 more HP than the LS6 but at what rpm did it make 32 more hp?
Where is there more info on dyno graphs or flow numbers?
If it is making 32 more HP at peak it obviously is flowing better than the LS6, and outflowing it enough to make an additional 32 HP oven in the higher rpm range.
They say it is designed to be most effective from idle to 6200 rpm, but that doesn't mean that it is going to fall on it's face at 6500 rpm like people keep saying.
It is doing much better than the LS6 does and by 32 hp, if it was as poor flowing in the upper range it wouldn't be making 32 HP more than the LS6 manifold, it would make a bunch of torque and then start falling on its face, which it isn't.
Does swapping from a LS6 to a FAST gain you 32 HP?
Like one person said before whats better, 10 more hp from 6200-6500 or more power from idle to 6k?
Plus having great numbers down low will be awesome for the nitrous guys who leave at lower rpm and use the big increase in torque down low to launch the cars hard.
I don't know, I haven't used both on my car, but who can say this manifold won't make good numbers with a bigger cam? It hasn't even come out yet and a lot of people seem to know everything about it.
Some people fail to understand you don't have to run a big cam and rev the motor to 7,000 to make power, if that is your goal, high rpm power why run a fast, why not run a single plane or sheetmetal tunnel ram?
Like the guy said it does have a longer runner, but it is also completely unobstructed without extra bracing and has a completely flat floor, which is also going to increase airflow at any rpm.
It is supposedly also designed by Formula 1 guys, which know more about high rpm power than anyone else considering the old Formula one stuff was revving to 16,000 to 17,000 rpm.
Longer runners are going to make power at a lower range, but with less obstructions inside the manifold there isn't going to be as much of a loss at higher rpm either.
It is also supposed to be 650.00 which is cheaper than either of the fast manifolds and has a 90 MM TB opening to start with and will still obviously make good numbers at low rpm and up to 6,000 and hopefully more.
The new manifold is also one piece, not saying there are issues but you're not going to have to worry about leaks having two pieces.
Can you port it like a FAST, no you can't, but then again how many have a fast manifold ported?
Some do, some don't but then your $850.00 manifold has now cost you well over $1,000.00, which obviously isn't cheap.
I think another point people are missing is they are having to run these bigger cams to make higher peak HP, if you can make close to the same power or even a little less at much less rpm it is a way better combo because, you don't have to rev the motor as high which is easier on the internals and less engine wear.
It will also have more power under the curve which will result in better acceleration. If you can make close to the same power or even a little less peak HP but do it at a lower rpm range and it's going to have way more torque.
I know I would feel pretty bad getting my *** spanked by a guy with a $650.00 manifold and exhaust when I have a big cam and gears and high stall and he walks away from my *** at the stop light
I would personally rather make 450 hp at 5,800 than 480 at 6,800.
You also have to factor in other variables, the higher stall torque converter you'll need to run is also going to be less efficient than a lower stall torque converter. Some might care and some might not, but gas is pretty expensive these days and also higher stalls create a lot more heat and you have more issues with a transmission if you run an auto.
When it says that it made 30 more torque at 4,000 rpm, you have to figure that is is also making more than the FAST or LS6 manifold below that as well.
With a stick car it is nice because you don't have to rev the motor as high when you leave which is easier on the POS rear end these things come with, it will also pull harder on the bottom end, so now leaving at 3,000 rpm will work a lot better without the motor falling on it's face or having to rev it to 5-6k and side step the clutch which a 10 bolt isn't going to take anyways.
Keeping the peak torque at a lower rpm will make it way more streetable as well as require less stall and gear to effectively use the combination.
Another thing is cams will have different effects in different type of manifolds, so hopefully even with a bigger cam it'll peak HP down a few hundred rpm without losing much peak power.
Will it work as good as it says? I sure hope it does because 850.00 is way to much for a manifold and those after market intakes are already way over priced to begin with.
I hope they make more stuff that makes more and more power in the lower rpm range.
Will it happen maybe, maybe not, but hopefully this thing works good and brings something new and if it makes more power than the 78mm FAST in the upper rpm, and more torque than the FAST 90mm in the lower rpm, I know which one I'll be buying.
EL cheapo
Where is there more info on dyno graphs or flow numbers?
If it is making 32 more HP at peak it obviously is flowing better than the LS6, and outflowing it enough to make an additional 32 HP oven in the higher rpm range.
They say it is designed to be most effective from idle to 6200 rpm, but that doesn't mean that it is going to fall on it's face at 6500 rpm like people keep saying.
It is doing much better than the LS6 does and by 32 hp, if it was as poor flowing in the upper range it wouldn't be making 32 HP more than the LS6 manifold, it would make a bunch of torque and then start falling on its face, which it isn't.
Does swapping from a LS6 to a FAST gain you 32 HP?
Like one person said before whats better, 10 more hp from 6200-6500 or more power from idle to 6k?
Plus having great numbers down low will be awesome for the nitrous guys who leave at lower rpm and use the big increase in torque down low to launch the cars hard.
I don't know, I haven't used both on my car, but who can say this manifold won't make good numbers with a bigger cam? It hasn't even come out yet and a lot of people seem to know everything about it.
Some people fail to understand you don't have to run a big cam and rev the motor to 7,000 to make power, if that is your goal, high rpm power why run a fast, why not run a single plane or sheetmetal tunnel ram?
Like the guy said it does have a longer runner, but it is also completely unobstructed without extra bracing and has a completely flat floor, which is also going to increase airflow at any rpm.
It is supposedly also designed by Formula 1 guys, which know more about high rpm power than anyone else considering the old Formula one stuff was revving to 16,000 to 17,000 rpm.
Longer runners are going to make power at a lower range, but with less obstructions inside the manifold there isn't going to be as much of a loss at higher rpm either.
It is also supposed to be 650.00 which is cheaper than either of the fast manifolds and has a 90 MM TB opening to start with and will still obviously make good numbers at low rpm and up to 6,000 and hopefully more.
The new manifold is also one piece, not saying there are issues but you're not going to have to worry about leaks having two pieces.
Can you port it like a FAST, no you can't, but then again how many have a fast manifold ported?
Some do, some don't but then your $850.00 manifold has now cost you well over $1,000.00, which obviously isn't cheap.
I think another point people are missing is they are having to run these bigger cams to make higher peak HP, if you can make close to the same power or even a little less at much less rpm it is a way better combo because, you don't have to rev the motor as high which is easier on the internals and less engine wear.
It will also have more power under the curve which will result in better acceleration. If you can make close to the same power or even a little less peak HP but do it at a lower rpm range and it's going to have way more torque.
I know I would feel pretty bad getting my *** spanked by a guy with a $650.00 manifold and exhaust when I have a big cam and gears and high stall and he walks away from my *** at the stop light
I would personally rather make 450 hp at 5,800 than 480 at 6,800.
You also have to factor in other variables, the higher stall torque converter you'll need to run is also going to be less efficient than a lower stall torque converter. Some might care and some might not, but gas is pretty expensive these days and also higher stalls create a lot more heat and you have more issues with a transmission if you run an auto.
When it says that it made 30 more torque at 4,000 rpm, you have to figure that is is also making more than the FAST or LS6 manifold below that as well.
With a stick car it is nice because you don't have to rev the motor as high when you leave which is easier on the POS rear end these things come with, it will also pull harder on the bottom end, so now leaving at 3,000 rpm will work a lot better without the motor falling on it's face or having to rev it to 5-6k and side step the clutch which a 10 bolt isn't going to take anyways.
Keeping the peak torque at a lower rpm will make it way more streetable as well as require less stall and gear to effectively use the combination.
Another thing is cams will have different effects in different type of manifolds, so hopefully even with a bigger cam it'll peak HP down a few hundred rpm without losing much peak power.
Will it work as good as it says? I sure hope it does because 850.00 is way to much for a manifold and those after market intakes are already way over priced to begin with.
I hope they make more stuff that makes more and more power in the lower rpm range.
Will it happen maybe, maybe not, but hopefully this thing works good and brings something new and if it makes more power than the 78mm FAST in the upper rpm, and more torque than the FAST 90mm in the lower rpm, I know which one I'll be buying.
EL cheapo
01-11-2008, 01:09 PM
#44
I found more info, it was tested on a 2004 GTO with 1 3/4 headers with 2 1/2" exhaust, cold air, mafless tune and a 84mm TB, which it will take a 90 mm.
Here is the post, still pretty promising, the largest gain in hp was 32 and took place at 4,250, while the highest torque gain was 31 ft at 4,000.
It looks like the torque peaks at 4,500 so I imagine the power falls of at 6,000 do to a small cam, hopefully there will be more testing with bigger cams to see what it can do in the upper ranges.
http://www.ls1.com/forums/showthread.php?p=1235691
Here is the post, still pretty promising, the largest gain in hp was 32 and took place at 4,250, while the highest torque gain was 31 ft at 4,000.
It looks like the torque peaks at 4,500 so I imagine the power falls of at 6,000 do to a small cam, hopefully there will be more testing with bigger cams to see what it can do in the upper ranges.
http://www.ls1.com/forums/showthread.php?p=1235691
02-07-2008, 10:32 PM
#47
The Weiand's power line in that graph stayed above the LS6 the ENTIRE WAY up to about 6500 where it was stopped. Only then did it start to come back down near the LS6 but still stayed above it. Those who can logically process information I think can decipher what this intake can do for you...
02-08-2008, 02:47 AM
#48
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It will be interesting to see what this intake does. Unfortuantly, numbers are always bias when coming from the promoting company. I do imagine this intake being an improvement over the ls6, based on the fact that holley's aluminum intake was on par with the ls6 at best. Regardless, as anxious as I am in seeing how this intake performs, it is not worth writing a 5 kazillian word post based of off such little information....
I will say that I hope it does out perform the current market-it would be good for me and most of the market in respects to complimenting the street and the track performance. But only time will tell.
I will say that I hope it does out perform the current market-it would be good for me and most of the market in respects to complimenting the street and the track performance. But only time will tell.
02-08-2008, 06:25 AM
#49
Looks promising for those of us with cars set up fpr road course driving. Now, if we could just get Weiand/Holley to provide better information regarding availability. I've seen the March 08' stuff, but, haven't found further updates other than the initial SEMA stuff.
02-08-2008, 02:34 PM
#50
I think some people are missing a few points, they tested it on a GTO and it made 32 more HP than the LS6 but at what rpm did it make 32 more hp?
Where is there more info on dyno graphs or flow numbers?
If it is making 32 more HP at peak it obviously is flowing better than the LS6, and outflowing it enough to make an additional 32 HP oven in the higher rpm range.
They say it is designed to be most effective from idle to 6200 rpm, but that doesn't mean that it is going to fall on it's face at 6500 rpm like people keep saying.
It is doing much better than the LS6 does and by 32 hp, if it was as poor flowing in the upper range it wouldn't be making 32 HP more than the LS6 manifold, it would make a bunch of torque and then start falling on its face, which it isn't.
Does swapping from a LS6 to a FAST gain you 32 HP?
Like one person said before whats better, 10 more hp from 6200-6500 or more power from idle to 6k?
Plus having great numbers down low will be awesome for the nitrous guys who leave at lower rpm and use the big increase in torque down low to launch the cars hard.
I don't know, I haven't used both on my car, but who can say this manifold won't make good numbers with a bigger cam? It hasn't even come out yet and a lot of people seem to know everything about it.
Some people fail to understand you don't have to run a big cam and rev the motor to 7,000 to make power, if that is your goal, high rpm power why run a fast, why not run a single plane or sheetmetal tunnel ram?
Like the guy said it does have a longer runner, but it is also completely unobstructed without extra bracing and has a completely flat floor, which is also going to increase airflow at any rpm.
It is supposedly also designed by Formula 1 guys, which know more about high rpm power than anyone else considering the old Formula one stuff was revving to 16,000 to 17,000 rpm.
Longer runners are going to make power at a lower range, but with less obstructions inside the manifold there isn't going to be as much of a loss at higher rpm either.
It is also supposed to be 650.00 which is cheaper than either of the fast manifolds and has a 90 MM TB opening to start with and will still obviously make good numbers at low rpm and up to 6,000 and hopefully more.
The new manifold is also one piece, not saying there are issues but you're not going to have to worry about leaks having two pieces.
Can you port it like a FAST, no you can't, but then again how many have a fast manifold ported?
Some do, some don't but then your $850.00 manifold has now cost you well over $1,000.00, which obviously isn't cheap.
I think another point people are missing is they are having to run these bigger cams to make higher peak HP, if you can make close to the same power or even a little less at much less rpm it is a way better combo because, you don't have to rev the motor as high which is easier on the internals and less engine wear.
It will also have more power under the curve which will result in better acceleration. If you can make close to the same power or even a little less peak HP but do it at a lower rpm range and it's going to have way more torque.
I know I would feel pretty bad getting my *** spanked by a guy with a $650.00 manifold and exhaust when I have a big cam and gears and high stall and he walks away from my *** at the stop light
I would personally rather make 450 hp at 5,800 than 480 at 6,800.
You also have to factor in other variables, the higher stall torque converter you'll need to run is also going to be less efficient than a lower stall torque converter. Some might care and some might not, but gas is pretty expensive these days and also higher stalls create a lot more heat and you have more issues with a transmission if you run an auto.
When it says that it made 30 more torque at 4,000 rpm, you have to figure that is is also making more than the FAST or LS6 manifold below that as well.
With a stick car it is nice because you don't have to rev the motor as high when you leave which is easier on the POS rear end these things come with, it will also pull harder on the bottom end, so now leaving at 3,000 rpm will work a lot better without the motor falling on it's face or having to rev it to 5-6k and side step the clutch which a 10 bolt isn't going to take anyways.
Keeping the peak torque at a lower rpm will make it way more streetable as well as require less stall and gear to effectively use the combination.
Another thing is cams will have different effects in different type of manifolds, so hopefully even with a bigger cam it'll peak HP down a few hundred rpm without losing much peak power.
Will it work as good as it says? I sure hope it does because 850.00 is way to much for a manifold and those after market intakes are already way over priced to begin with.
I hope they make more stuff that makes more and more power in the lower rpm range.
Will it happen maybe, maybe not, but hopefully this thing works good and brings something new and if it makes more power than the 78mm FAST in the upper rpm, and more torque than the FAST 90mm in the lower rpm, I know which one I'll be buying.
EL cheapo
Where is there more info on dyno graphs or flow numbers?
If it is making 32 more HP at peak it obviously is flowing better than the LS6, and outflowing it enough to make an additional 32 HP oven in the higher rpm range.
They say it is designed to be most effective from idle to 6200 rpm, but that doesn't mean that it is going to fall on it's face at 6500 rpm like people keep saying.
It is doing much better than the LS6 does and by 32 hp, if it was as poor flowing in the upper range it wouldn't be making 32 HP more than the LS6 manifold, it would make a bunch of torque and then start falling on its face, which it isn't.
Does swapping from a LS6 to a FAST gain you 32 HP?
Like one person said before whats better, 10 more hp from 6200-6500 or more power from idle to 6k?
Plus having great numbers down low will be awesome for the nitrous guys who leave at lower rpm and use the big increase in torque down low to launch the cars hard.
I don't know, I haven't used both on my car, but who can say this manifold won't make good numbers with a bigger cam? It hasn't even come out yet and a lot of people seem to know everything about it.
Some people fail to understand you don't have to run a big cam and rev the motor to 7,000 to make power, if that is your goal, high rpm power why run a fast, why not run a single plane or sheetmetal tunnel ram?
Like the guy said it does have a longer runner, but it is also completely unobstructed without extra bracing and has a completely flat floor, which is also going to increase airflow at any rpm.
It is supposedly also designed by Formula 1 guys, which know more about high rpm power than anyone else considering the old Formula one stuff was revving to 16,000 to 17,000 rpm.
Longer runners are going to make power at a lower range, but with less obstructions inside the manifold there isn't going to be as much of a loss at higher rpm either.
It is also supposed to be 650.00 which is cheaper than either of the fast manifolds and has a 90 MM TB opening to start with and will still obviously make good numbers at low rpm and up to 6,000 and hopefully more.
The new manifold is also one piece, not saying there are issues but you're not going to have to worry about leaks having two pieces.
Can you port it like a FAST, no you can't, but then again how many have a fast manifold ported?
Some do, some don't but then your $850.00 manifold has now cost you well over $1,000.00, which obviously isn't cheap.
I think another point people are missing is they are having to run these bigger cams to make higher peak HP, if you can make close to the same power or even a little less at much less rpm it is a way better combo because, you don't have to rev the motor as high which is easier on the internals and less engine wear.
It will also have more power under the curve which will result in better acceleration. If you can make close to the same power or even a little less peak HP but do it at a lower rpm range and it's going to have way more torque.
I know I would feel pretty bad getting my *** spanked by a guy with a $650.00 manifold and exhaust when I have a big cam and gears and high stall and he walks away from my *** at the stop light
I would personally rather make 450 hp at 5,800 than 480 at 6,800.
You also have to factor in other variables, the higher stall torque converter you'll need to run is also going to be less efficient than a lower stall torque converter. Some might care and some might not, but gas is pretty expensive these days and also higher stalls create a lot more heat and you have more issues with a transmission if you run an auto.
When it says that it made 30 more torque at 4,000 rpm, you have to figure that is is also making more than the FAST or LS6 manifold below that as well.
With a stick car it is nice because you don't have to rev the motor as high when you leave which is easier on the POS rear end these things come with, it will also pull harder on the bottom end, so now leaving at 3,000 rpm will work a lot better without the motor falling on it's face or having to rev it to 5-6k and side step the clutch which a 10 bolt isn't going to take anyways.
Keeping the peak torque at a lower rpm will make it way more streetable as well as require less stall and gear to effectively use the combination.
Another thing is cams will have different effects in different type of manifolds, so hopefully even with a bigger cam it'll peak HP down a few hundred rpm without losing much peak power.
Will it work as good as it says? I sure hope it does because 850.00 is way to much for a manifold and those after market intakes are already way over priced to begin with.
I hope they make more stuff that makes more and more power in the lower rpm range.
Will it happen maybe, maybe not, but hopefully this thing works good and brings something new and if it makes more power than the 78mm FAST in the upper rpm, and more torque than the FAST 90mm in the lower rpm, I know which one I'll be buying.
EL cheapo
I'm looking forward to this intake coming out because like others have said it could bring the Fast's price down which is good for everyone
02-08-2008, 11:00 PM
#52
I called Holley today for more information & they told me that the availability date is now April or May. It would be nice if a manufacturer could actually meet or preceed an advertized availability date instead of pushing it further & further away.
02-15-2008, 08:21 PM
#55
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I was flipping through an April issue of one of the Vette mags and they did a quick blurb about this intake and stated the list price is $759. I might be off $20 or so, but its still more than the $650 range we hoped for. However, any competition against the FAST is good.
03-14-2008, 02:37 AM
#56
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^ damn i hope it's not really going to be that much. i need a new manifold pretty badly and i am even prepared to wait to buy one after they stop pushing the release date back. but i'm not about to spend that much on one. the $650 was right on the edge of affordability.
03-14-2008, 07:18 AM
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