humanoidZ06

I have used Eagle rods and cranks in several engines over the years with no problems. This includes strokers and power adder applications. Many of the rumors floating around about quality concerns with Eagle rods are based on cheap knock offs - not real Eagles. There are several overseas companies that produce rods that look like Eagles, and are being sold as such. If the rod doesn't have the Eagle logo on it, and if it doesn't come in an Eagle box, it is very likely that it's a cheap knock off.

humanoidZ06

Eagle rods come with 7/16" ARP capscrew bolts (190,000 psi tensile strength). The weakest link in these rods is the standard ARP bolt, so that should tell you something about how strong the rod is. There are two upgraded ARP bolts available - the ARP2000 and the L19. The ARP2000 has a 220,000 psi tensile strength, and the L19 is 260,000 psi. I've seen Eagle rods with the L19 bolts used successfully in traditional Pontiac stroker engines producing 900+ hp.

Z-Rated

Is that bolt that comes with the rod strong enough? Are the other ones overkill for a smaller hp application?

humanoidZ06

The Eagle rods with standard ARP 7/16" capscrew bolts are sufficient for most applications. I would feel comfortable using them in any of the typical heads/cam/bolt-on combinations (400-450rwhp). If you're planning to use a power adder, it's cheap insurance to upgrade the bolts.

Visceral

iTrader: (1)

Im under the impression that bolts help for RPM. Power adders are just going to create compressive force on the rod. Some power adders like Turbos are actually easier on bolts than NA.

chris

Vents

iTrader: (9)

i put them in my motor for a reason.

the only logical upgrade from these IMO are the Olivers, and at 1200 a set, i opted to settle with the eagles and be able to run pistons in my motor too

i'd even go with a set of crowers if you didnt plan on spraying that much. just cheap insurance really. but then again, i like to stretch the limits too.

humanoidZ06

The reason I suggest upgrading the bolts with power adders is because of the hp level involved. Rod bolt stress is not limited to only RPM. I've never heard of turbo motors being easier on rod bolts than N/A applications. I could see low compression and boost being easier on them at low RPM than the constant pounding of high compression....but otherwise, combustion pressure is combustion pressure.

Visceral

iTrader: (1)

I'd be interested in how you have ascertained that bolts are inportant for compressive force (cylinder pressure).

According to Kenny Duttweiler and other engine builders that I spoke to re: a 434 ci twin turbo bowtie block SBC I was building, turbo motors stess the bolts less due to the force that the piston/rod must use to push out exhaust gasses at high boost. These forces counteract the normal tensional forces of piston decel/accel at the top half of the cylinder, though I do not understand if they implied partially or completely at what RPM.
We built the engine using Oliver SuperDuty I-beam rods but stuck with the cheaper bolts. I was willing at the time to pay the $300 for the better bolts, but he felt they were only necessary in cases of over 8000 rpm. He said the bolts (within limits) were not an issue for 1700 horsepower and 35 psi boost.

Another example is the GMC Syclone I spent too much money on for a few years. The rods were standard L98 with standard GM L98 bolts. (the 4.3 was quite literally 3/4 of an L98). The crankshaft was an issue at 500+ hp but hte rods never were (the tranny shifted at 5500 rpm.)

CAT3

iTrader: (9)

If you "stretch" a rod bolt from spinning Rpms too high, and get that "loose rod" sound, is it possible to go in, replace the bolts and be good, or is there more damage than needing new bolts?
Has anyone just replaced the bolts in this situation or no?

Argon Z

tell me if im wrong but i feel that its the RPM that would kill ur rods. When the power hits the rods it is always pushing them down which i believe has little to do with the rods but when the piston is being pulled down after the compression stroke it is just the rod cap and bolts pulling the rod back down i think that that is mainly what kills rod bolts.
I hope that makes sense

humanoidZ06

I never stated that turbo motors weren't easier on rod bolts. I stated that I have never heard that. As for combustion pressure, I'm just thinking out loud. Not that I'm disputing the "experts".....it just doesn't seem totally logical to me. I experienced ARP 2000 rod bolt failure in a blown small block Ford (at relatively low RPM).

As for my statement regarding rod bolts in relation to power output, I'm basing this on my experience with traditional Pontiac engines. These engines rely heavily on torque, and in most street/strip applications the work is done by 6,000 RPM. The stock bolts are adequate for stock applications, but as hp levels rise (within the same RPM limit) rod and bolt failures become increasingly common.

I certainly wouldn't build a heads/cam/bolt-on/nitrous LS1 with standard issue Eagle bolts. The cost of the bolt upgrade is insignificant when compared to the cost of replacing the engine.

Visceral

iTrader: (1)

I havent met anyone who successfully stopped driving at that exact moment

I heard the noise, wondered what it was, and 6 seconds later, I found out, as did track officials and the crew that had to clean the track.

Vents

iTrader: (9)

really now? i honestly dont think that they ARP's would be that big of a concern. the ARP's they come with are completely sufficent for 800 RWHP IMO. yes thats it's pushin it, but it would work. but for how long on a BIG shot? we'll definately find out.

humanoidZ06

Again, it's a matter of preference. As you stated before, you like to push the limit Your probably right about the standard ARP's being capable of handling far more than the claimed 500hp limit. However, I have pushed it one time too many in my life and ended up with far too many interesting paper weights. I tend to tread more lightly now, and I build in a large safety margin.

Vents

iTrader: (9)

just a matter of opinion i guess.. ;D we'll see how she does. im sure the 250 shot will hold, but im kinda hesitant to do the 300.

JS

iTrader: (4)

According to racers,I've heard the WAV locks are not very good.Anyone wanna comment on this info.

I opted for the standard ARP bolt.I'm running the stock rods and wont ever spray and my rpm wont go over 6600rpm.