Flowtested Lingenfelter CNC heads, MMS Stage II's, sell or are these good #'s??
02-10-2003, 04:58 PM
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Flowtested Lingenfelter CNC heads, MMS Stage II's, sell or are these good #'s?? I dropped off a set of used Lingenfelter CNC heads I got, a friend of mines Morgan motorsports Stage II heads at the local race shop that does all the serious work in this city.
The Morgan motorsports heads are 4.8L castings, larger valves, handported and look very trick.
The Lingenfelter heads are ls1 casting, stock valves, CNC ported.
The guy who flowed them does all the 6-8 second blown/nitro/alcohol motors here and knew nothing of what ls1 heads should flow, i dont believe the #'s are fuged at all. They look to be honest results and he considers his flowbench to be avg to conservative compared to others.
Morgan Motorsports Stage 2 Lingenfelter CNC
Lift Intake Exhaust.......Intake Exhaust
100 71.7 49.2........61.5 51.2
200 158.6 101.7.......140.4 106.9
300 218.8 136.7.......221.3 147.3
400 266.6 163.7.......266.7 179.2
500 282.8 179.2.......268.3 194.6
600 264.0 197.7.......273.0 200.8
Ok, my lingenfelter heads seem really good to me. Im going to be running a stock bottom end, Thunder racing 226/230 (nitrous cam), headers, 300 TNT Nitrous kit (i have forged pistons/rods in the motor), ls6 intake etc.
So whats the good pro's/cons of each head? should i sell these and go with absolute speed 1x heads that they claim 285 cfm #'s out of it???
<small>[ February 10, 2003, 06:40 PM: Message edited by: C4VetteLS1 ]</small>
The Morgan motorsports heads are 4.8L castings, larger valves, handported and look very trick.
The Lingenfelter heads are ls1 casting, stock valves, CNC ported.
The guy who flowed them does all the 6-8 second blown/nitro/alcohol motors here and knew nothing of what ls1 heads should flow, i dont believe the #'s are fuged at all. They look to be honest results and he considers his flowbench to be avg to conservative compared to others.
Morgan Motorsports Stage 2 Lingenfelter CNC
Lift Intake Exhaust.......Intake Exhaust
100 71.7 49.2........61.5 51.2
200 158.6 101.7.......140.4 106.9
300 218.8 136.7.......221.3 147.3
400 266.6 163.7.......266.7 179.2
500 282.8 179.2.......268.3 194.6
600 264.0 197.7.......273.0 200.8
Ok, my lingenfelter heads seem really good to me. Im going to be running a stock bottom end, Thunder racing 226/230 (nitrous cam), headers, 300 TNT Nitrous kit (i have forged pistons/rods in the motor), ls6 intake etc.
So whats the good pro's/cons of each head? should i sell these and go with absolute speed 1x heads that they claim 285 cfm #'s out of it???
<small>[ February 10, 2003, 06:40 PM: Message edited by: C4VetteLS1 ]</small>
02-10-2003, 05:48 PM
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Re: Flowtested Lingenfelter CNC heads, MMS Stage II's, sell or are these good #'s?? Just some help for ya..
I used the MMS as the base numbers.
Intake
100 14.23% MMS Flows Better
200 11.48% MMS Flows Better
300 -1.14% LF
400 -0.04% LF
500 5.13% MMS
600 -3.41% LF
Average #'s
MMS/ LF
210.41/ 205.20/ 2.48% MMS
Exhaust
100 -4.07% LF
200 -5.11% LF
300 -7.75% LF
400 -9.47% LF
500 -8.59% LF
600 -1.57% LF
Average #'s
MMS/ LF
138.03/ 146.66/ -6.25% LF
The MMS's flow 34.40% more air on average to the intake side (IN vrs EX same head).
The LF's flow 28.53% more air on average to the intake side (IN vrs EX same head).
Personally, I would go with the MMS heads as you might see a better NA time. I don't think you'll notice much of a difference on N20 if you have a good exhaust system. My resoning:
The cam you are using already favors the exhaust side.
The LS1's seem to like more intake flow due to the restrictive intake.
The N20 is going to make it seem like the heads flow more on the intake due to the condensed 02. But the cam will help make up the lack of exhaust flow. This should even things out a little.
I could be wrong and I'm sure someone might prove me that way.. Just my $0.02
I used the MMS as the base numbers.
Intake
100 14.23% MMS Flows Better
200 11.48% MMS Flows Better
300 -1.14% LF
400 -0.04% LF
500 5.13% MMS
600 -3.41% LF
Average #'s
MMS/ LF
210.41/ 205.20/ 2.48% MMS
Exhaust
100 -4.07% LF
200 -5.11% LF
300 -7.75% LF
400 -9.47% LF
500 -8.59% LF
600 -1.57% LF
Average #'s
MMS/ LF
138.03/ 146.66/ -6.25% LF
The MMS's flow 34.40% more air on average to the intake side (IN vrs EX same head).
The LF's flow 28.53% more air on average to the intake side (IN vrs EX same head).
Personally, I would go with the MMS heads as you might see a better NA time. I don't think you'll notice much of a difference on N20 if you have a good exhaust system. My resoning:
The cam you are using already favors the exhaust side.
The LS1's seem to like more intake flow due to the restrictive intake.
The N20 is going to make it seem like the heads flow more on the intake due to the condensed 02. But the cam will help make up the lack of exhaust flow. This should even things out a little.
I could be wrong and I'm sure someone might prove me that way.. Just my $0.02
02-10-2003, 06:57 PM
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Re: Flowtested Lingenfelter CNC heads, MMS Stage II's, sell or are these good #'s?? I would feel that gains on nitrous would be pretty significant (10-15 hp) on a large shot from the added exhaust flow.
Also with a large .550-.600 camshaft, the MMS heads were very turbulent and flow dropped off a cliff after .500.
Im still not sure what to think. Im not picking one or the other, both of us that own these heads were trying to decide to keep or sell them.
[b] Also, over stock heads, would going from approx 240 cfm (stock ls1) to a 273 cfm, what would be the horsepower difference on a built motor??? im guessing every 1 CFM to be about 1.5 HP potential, so 45-60 horsepower
<small>[ February 10, 2003, 07:00 PM: Message edited by: C4VetteLS1 ]</small>
Also with a large .550-.600 camshaft, the MMS heads were very turbulent and flow dropped off a cliff after .500.
Im still not sure what to think. Im not picking one or the other, both of us that own these heads were trying to decide to keep or sell them.
[b] Also, over stock heads, would going from approx 240 cfm (stock ls1) to a 273 cfm, what would be the horsepower difference on a built motor??? im guessing every 1 CFM to be about 1.5 HP potential, so 45-60 horsepower
<small>[ February 10, 2003, 07:00 PM: Message edited by: C4VetteLS1 ]</small>
02-11-2003, 03:09 PM
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Re: Flowtested Lingenfelter CNC heads, MMS Stage II's, sell or are these good #'s?? Are the flow names and representations backwards? If not, I would use the MMS heads, I thought the GM Lingenfelter CNC heads were around 295 @ .500 lift? anyway 1 cfm = approximately .27 horse.
Joe.
Joe.
02-12-2003, 05:13 PM
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Re: Flowtested Lingenfelter CNC heads, MMS Stage II's, sell or are these good #'s?? </font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Originally posted by JPR:
<strong> Are the flow names and representations backwards? If not, I would use the MMS heads, I thought the GM Lingenfelter CNC heads were around 295 @ .500 lift? anyway 1 cfm = approximately .27 horse.
Joe. </strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Joe is that formula for power per cfm to be used collectively under curve, or for gains at max lift flow? TIA
<strong> Are the flow names and representations backwards? If not, I would use the MMS heads, I thought the GM Lingenfelter CNC heads were around 295 @ .500 lift? anyway 1 cfm = approximately .27 horse.
Joe. </strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Joe is that formula for power per cfm to be used collectively under curve, or for gains at max lift flow? TIA
02-13-2003, 01:56 AM
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Re: Flowtested Lingenfelter CNC heads, MMS Stage II's, sell or are these good #'s?? I can supply you a much better flowing exhaust port which will really help out on spray. My intake port goes:
.100 67
.200 138-142
.300 198-203
.400 249-251
.500 282-288
.550 293-296
.600 300-303
These are pretty much right on I believe, i'm at home but that's the range the intake usually goes. The exhaust port i don't have memorized like I do the intake. But we have gotten as much as 275 @.600 lift on the exhaust side and we guarantee 255 @.600. If you'd like to talk about it you can give me a call at work. (270)782-6397
Brent
.100 67
.200 138-142
.300 198-203
.400 249-251
.500 282-288
.550 293-296
.600 300-303
These are pretty much right on I believe, i'm at home but that's the range the intake usually goes. The exhaust port i don't have memorized like I do the intake. But we have gotten as much as 275 @.600 lift on the exhaust side and we guarantee 255 @.600. If you'd like to talk about it you can give me a call at work. (270)782-6397
Brent
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02-13-2003, 05:49 AM
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Re: Flowtested Lingenfelter CNC heads, MMS Stage II's, sell or are these good #'s?? </font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Originally posted by LS1derfull:
<strong> </font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Originally posted by JPR:
<strong> Are the flow names and representations backwards? If not, I would use the MMS heads, I thought the GM Lingenfelter CNC heads were around 295 @ .500 lift? anyway 1 cfm = approximately .27 horse.
Joe. </strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Joe is that formula for power per cfm to be used collectively under curve, or for gains at max lift flow? TIA </strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">t.t.t. ?
<strong> </font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Originally posted by JPR:
<strong> Are the flow names and representations backwards? If not, I would use the MMS heads, I thought the GM Lingenfelter CNC heads were around 295 @ .500 lift? anyway 1 cfm = approximately .27 horse.
Joe. </strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Joe is that formula for power per cfm to be used collectively under curve, or for gains at max lift flow? TIA </strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">t.t.t. ?
02-16-2003, 11:25 AM
#9
TECH Addict
Re: Flowtested Lingenfelter CNC heads, MMS Stage II's, sell or are these good #'s?? </font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Originally posted by LS1derfull:
<strong> </font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Originally posted by LS1derfull:
<strong> </font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Originally posted by JPR:
<strong> Are the flow names and representations backwards? If not, I would use the MMS heads, I thought the GM Lingenfelter CNC heads were around 295 @ .500 lift? anyway 1 cfm = approximately .27 horse.
Joe. </strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Joe is that formula for power per cfm to be used collectively under curve, or for gains at max lift flow? TIA </strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">t.t.t. ? </strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Joe? Can you help?
<strong> </font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Originally posted by LS1derfull:
<strong> </font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Originally posted by JPR:
<strong> Are the flow names and representations backwards? If not, I would use the MMS heads, I thought the GM Lingenfelter CNC heads were around 295 @ .500 lift? anyway 1 cfm = approximately .27 horse.
Joe. </strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Joe is that formula for power per cfm to be used collectively under curve, or for gains at max lift flow? TIA </strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">t.t.t. ? </strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Joe? Can you help?
