I have a Yank PT4400 and TR230 cam combo on BFG KDWS's. Yes, it'll obliterate the tires if I so desire, even from a roll, but if you can moderate the throttle input and lean into the gas as you accelerate, it's still very fast with no tire spin. I believe a converter gives you more driveability in that you have more throttle control over a broader range if that makes sense. I can't mash the gas at a stoplight without putting on quite the smoke show, but I couldn't with bolt-ons before I added the converter either. A converter is the single best mod for an auto car hands down. Packaged properly with a cam, it'll put a smile on your face everytime you drive it.

 

The first cam I ever installed in my old car was a hotcam. The car was an A4 before I built the motor in my sig. Even with that little cam, the stock stall was nowhere near adequate. Definitely do a stall before a cam. That is the best advice you're gonna get. Even with the cam you said, the stock stall is not gonna be good enough. It will feel like its tiptoeing, then start pulling up top, but even then you will be so far behind anyone else on the street, you wont be catching up. The only way its ok, is if you are just putting around and dont plan on doing any racing or playing around on the street. If you drive like your 85, after you get it tuned and if it will idle ok, then you will be fine.

 

We've done cam installs on stock verter cars & you have to be very careful. The 224R is about as far as I usually like to go with the stock verter, but we've done a few 228Rs that worked ok with more tuning time. Personally I'd look to the 224R on a 114 if I'm looking to stay stock verter. We installed a 220R in my wife's 02 SS with great results. She drove it around everyday & never complained once about it

http://www.texas-speed.com/shop/item...d=164&catid=44

 

Just to add to the conv.

I have a 228 on 114 with a 3200 stall its my DD and I love it. I wish my stall was bigger sometimes. I would recommend stalling first, like I did, and then a cam. I can drive it with out spinning tires but when I want to it will roast them. On the track streets spins but if you get a nitto or bfg then ur 60 will be better.

Are you conserned about DD with a stall?

 

While your cam is bigger than what I planning, that was funny.

All the other responses have been very helpful too, especially with all of the personal experiences. Those of you saying that the stall can be put under control with street tires is actually good news to me! This thread actually may end up doing like what all the others do after all (turning me to the stall side that is). The only issue is on here I've read that stalls are supposed to be cheaper than a cam, but $700 (SS3600 probably) + $800 labor (What my local shop quoted me) doesn't sound cheaper to me .

99Hawk262: Do you run those tires at the track? I assume not...just curious.

 

you will be unhappy with that small of a cam too. i have a 230/232 and its too small and im getting a bigger one soon. at least get like a 228 something. i would do gears/stall/drag radials as my first mods along with boltons. making your car leave hard is where you will win your races unless you like the ghey roll racing. a 373 gear, 3600 stall and nitto DRs would be a good DD setup that would haul *** as well.

 

to ur message who of u are running street tires, i ran street tires for a long time! dry wet and snow tires, bfg kdws! i have good suspension and i got the car to run 11.70's with them, and that was with nitrous, with some high 1.6 sixty foots... so dont worry about killing ur tires, work on the suspension, u can have good tires and no suspension and still blow the tires off! And to ur other statement that cam will want to make power down low too not just up high... save the money and get a stall!

 

My 98 z28 a4 stock converter car ran a best of 8.3 @ 86 mph (12.82 @ 110mph) with a 1.95 60ft in the 1/8th mile with basic bolt ons (Mid lengths, true duals w/ moroso's, lid). After I put in a patriot 226 camshaft + ls6 intake tuned by Jeremy Formato the car made 393rwhp on a dyno jet. Took the car back to the track and it did 7.9 @ 93mph (never made 1/4 pass) with a 1.89 60ft in very comparable weather. It did not push through the brakes (750rpm idle) and I was overall very happy with my decision.. a lot of roll racing goes on around where I'm at, a stall isn't going to come close to what the cam did for me when you're already rolling.

The car thumped at 750rpm obviously as the patriot camshaft is on a 112lsa, but I had a top notch tuner dialing it in. I would do it again if I ever ended up with another auto car and was faced with the decision of stall or cam first, but having both with sticky tires is where you want to be.

Everyone has their preference with how they want THEIR car to work, but make your car what YOU want.

 

one thing that hasn't been mentioned much here is shift extension. it will fall less rpms with each gear change helping you stay in your power band throughout the run. a stall has more then one advantage. i did stall first before cam. no complaints.

 

1Bad00SS: Those are some pretty good results w/o a stall and damn nice dyno numbers for a 226 cam only.

And yeah I know about the higher shift extension which would help out as well...it makes me wonder if the 218/224 would help me more in a roll or if say a SS3600 would.

Someone mentioned saving money again but I don't get how ($700+$800+cooler and shift kit maybe?) = less than changing out the cam.

 

Install it yourself in your driveway with a friend. There is your money savings.

 

With the right stall you can drive it around on street tires... if you know how to feather your throttle. Or if you find something with a lot less STR.

The old Yank ST3500 had like a 1.6 STR and was designed for street tires. It was very efficient too, so it was great for street use and frum roll racing.

Either way ~ 400+rwhp makes street tires completely useless.

 

No, the video in my sig was on 17" MT ET Street radials.

In my experience, the converter did more than the cam, or so it felt that way. After adding the cam I was still running a Yank SS4000. When I upgraded to the PT4400, it felt like I gained more from that converter than I did with the cam swap, especially from a roll. Converters make roll racing a completely new experience. Stock stall has the horrible dead spots....a good converter eliminates those. Add in shift extension, and you'll wonder how you ever liked the car before you added the converter.

 

I don't really think dropping a transmission and swapping converters is a driveway installation I could, or would want to perform.

JakeFusion: I had never heard of anyone using that one...I'm going to go check it out now.

Hawk: I think you should go into business as a salesman for Yank

 

Apparently the STs are only offered in 2800 or 3000 variants but for the price those are, I can just get Circle D's 3000 for cheaper. Now Yank is a bit evil because I went to the sale section and the PTs are less than $800 right now .

 

If you do not want to opt for drag radials, then you will either need to spend money on better tires (which you will need to buy eventually) or learn how to launch with what you have. Many (myself included) have put down 60's in the 1.80 range on either Kumho Tires or Raptor Rikens. And I have a 3000 stall converter. Even on the street, now with my F13 cam, I can take off from a stop and not obliterate the tires. It is all in how you control the power out of the hole, more so then just staying with a stock converter.

If you still decide on a stock converter, I would follow Jason's (TSP) advice on the cam. That should put you around 370-380 rwhp, and if tuned properly you may be able to have the idle set just above stock, like 650-700 or so. Which is still good enough for the stock converter not to push through at idle.

 

Pulling a tranny and swapping converters is much easier than you'd think. If you have some basic tools and a little know-how, it'd definitely save you some cash. If you take your time and triple-check everything, you're looking at 5-6 hours. The last one I did took 3 hours, but I had a lift and I took my time.

As for Yank, they don't need salesmen.....their converters speak for themselves and you can't beat the 3-year full warranty!! But Vig and Circle-D are good options as well. I can only tell you about Yanks since I've never run anything else. Look into the SS3600 for a great street/strip converter.

 

Im running a 224/230 cam with the stock stall and my car hella pushes through the brakes. Im ordering my yank this week, and I cant wait to get it in. I would def get a stall its well worth the time and money.

 

I don't think they've made the ST3500 since 2004/05. The SS series is good for keeping the drive mild, but the PT series is where it's at.

 

get a cam and stall together, dont try and buck the trend. you have to remember that these cars work as a system