500ci engine from ERL
08-24-2009, 11:02 AM
#21
SAM sprayed it with a 250 shot on the Dyno and made over 900 HP and torque. Here's a link to it and at the bottom you can see a video.http://www.samracing.com/500ciLS2.html
Here's a few pics of a customers 482 that's built for serious boost. It's using LSW heads (400+ CFM) and an ARE dry sump. Overkill everywhere. Notice the thick top ring land and serious ring pack with 6.600 long Carrillo rods. Sadly it is put on hold when the economy tanked and the customer would probably sell it.
[IMG]
[/IMG]
I agree the turn-key is compromised for cost and most corvette owners don't want to deal with a big cam. It cruises at 1500RPM in 6th gear at 70mph no problem. Everyone wants a pump gas sleeper, but it still sounds VERY healthy even with a small cam and heads. But, can definetly upgrade like the 482 shown.
In our C5 the Kooks 1 7/8" headers worked without any modifying. Of course the X pipe had to be reworked.
Here's a few pics of a customers 482 that's built for serious boost. It's using LSW heads (400+ CFM) and an ARE dry sump. Overkill everywhere. Notice the thick top ring land and serious ring pack with 6.600 long Carrillo rods. Sadly it is put on hold when the economy tanked and the customer would probably sell it.
[IMG]
[/IMG]I agree the turn-key is compromised for cost and most corvette owners don't want to deal with a big cam. It cruises at 1500RPM in 6th gear at 70mph no problem. Everyone wants a pump gas sleeper, but it still sounds VERY healthy even with a small cam and heads. But, can definetly upgrade like the 482 shown.
In our C5 the Kooks 1 7/8" headers worked without any modifying. Of course the X pipe had to be reworked.
Last edited by Quick Carl; 08-24-2009 at 02:29 PM.
08-24-2009, 12:09 PM
#22
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But did they spray it at the track? 10.05 that doesnt seem right for that much power unless it was a driver error
They didnt say anything about pushrods or lifters the length or wether it was a stock lifter?
What about head bolts with that 482 setup? what would you do for that?
They didnt say anything about pushrods or lifters the length or wether it was a stock lifter?
What about head bolts with that 482 setup? what would you do for that?
08-24-2009, 01:38 PM
#23
No they only sprayed it on the dyno. The 10.05 was all motor. It uses a std. lifter dia.. Morel or Isky has a tall body for the extra lobe lift. Most use a link-bar set-up to get away from the plastic tray. Pushrod length depends on the valvetrain you use.
We already have ARP head studs for the 6 bolt head bolts on this 482 . It's set-up for solid lifter.
The head studs for our std 4 bolt are in stock.
We already have ARP head studs for the 6 bolt head bolts on this 482 . It's set-up for solid lifter.
The head studs for our std 4 bolt are in stock.
08-24-2009, 02:02 PM
#24
If you can't afford the BEST heads on the market ($6,000-$8,000) and a sheet metal or ITB intake (another $4,000 or more)...the ERL block is really really a waste of money, time and effort.
Look at their 500ci with the L92 heads and LS7 intake on it. That shows you what you'll have if you can't afford the best heads and intakes....you will have a regular old 500 RWHP set-up. Thats been done since 2001 with old *** LS1/6 blocks....look at my sig. My old *** engine has worse heads and intake then there's and it makes the same power.
Just build a 416ci, use "ported" L92 heads and a ported L76 intake and you'll make "ALOT" more power than the ERL 500ci...for LESS than half the price. Like 540 RWHP with a nice smooth idle.
If you DO have the money....holy ****....get the ERL 500ci and do the top end right, and make 700+ RWHP.
.
08-24-2009, 04:32 PM
#27
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I agree with you to but isnt the 427 block around that price?
I was fixin to say that about the LSX block you can get them for about $1800 for the block Gotta have good piston,rods,crank to put in it.
Do hi comp. pistons and spray a **** load of nitro through it or put low comp. pistons an FI the motor with a good setup. But some people still dont want the extra weight with it being Iron block.
The only reason I would run the ERL is to do a sick setup that noone has done yet and maybe make some records with it. Like SAM
08-24-2009, 06:02 PM
#28
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Mine shipped on Friday. It should hopefully be in the car by this weekend. We have to fab up a custom mid-pipe because of the taller deck. Hopefully, there are no other obstacles.
If everything speced out like I wanted, we should be at:
~12:1 compression
~260/270 .700lift hydraulic roller cam
LG Motorsports ported LS7 heads
LSX-R 102mm intake manifold
Nick Williams 102mm TB
American Racing 2" headers
If everything speced out like I wanted, we should be at:
~12:1 compression
~260/270 .700lift hydraulic roller cam
LG Motorsports ported LS7 heads
LSX-R 102mm intake manifold
Nick Williams 102mm TB
American Racing 2" headers
Last edited by kumar75150; 08-24-2009 at 06:22 PM.
08-24-2009, 06:13 PM
#29
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So in reality, my bill with ERL should be near the $13,000 mark instead of $9900 before you factor in heads, intake, tb, etc.
From what Ive seen, most 427 and 454 type shortblocks are around $6000-7000 using higher end components (ERL uses Callies crank, Carillo rods, Wiseco pistons, camshaft included in price); so as the consumer, you have to decide whether the extra 7 grand or so is worth the extra cubic inches.
Last edited by kumar75150; 08-24-2009 at 06:25 PM.
08-24-2009, 06:22 PM
#30
I agree with you to but isnt the 427 block around that price?
I was fixin to say that about the LSX block you can get them for about $1800 for the block Gotta have good piston,rods,crank to put in it.
Do hi comp. pistons and spray a **** load of nitro through it or put low comp. pistons an FI the motor with a good setup. But some people still dont want the extra weight with it being Iron block.
The only reason I would run the ERL is to do a sick setup that noone has done yet and maybe make some records with it. Like SAM
I was fixin to say that about the LSX block you can get them for about $1800 for the block Gotta have good piston,rods,crank to put in it.
Do hi comp. pistons and spray a **** load of nitro through it or put low comp. pistons an FI the motor with a good setup. But some people still dont want the extra weight with it being Iron block.
The only reason I would run the ERL is to do a sick setup that noone has done yet and maybe make some records with it. Like SAM
08-24-2009, 08:47 PM
#31
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Mine shipped on Friday. It should hopefully be in the car by this weekend. We have to fab up a custom mid-pipe because of the taller deck. Hopefully, there are no other obstacles.
If everything speced out like I wanted, we should be at:
~12:1 compression
~260/270 .700lift hydraulic roller cam
LG Motorsports ported LS7 heads
LSX-R 102mm intake manifold
Nick Williams 102mm TB
American Racing 2" headers
If everything speced out like I wanted, we should be at:
~12:1 compression
~260/270 .700lift hydraulic roller cam
LG Motorsports ported LS7 heads
LSX-R 102mm intake manifold
Nick Williams 102mm TB
American Racing 2" headers
Good luck to you on your build let us know what the numbers are would be some really good info to help others
08-24-2009, 08:54 PM
#32
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you can take an L92 block, which is considerably cheaper than the LSX & LS7 blocks, to 427ci. if he didnt want the weight you can just use the LS3 block. i forget the bore & stroke needed but many people do it. i think you can even be able to use the LS2 block but idk, you might run into [re]sleeve issues.
you are saying. You can make just about the same power out of all of these some are a little higher price then others. But its up to them on what they wanna spend. The applications are perty much endless as to which way to go. If you can dream it up someone can make it happen.
08-24-2009, 09:14 PM
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My last cam was around .680 lift so I wouldnt think .700 would be a huge problem
08-24-2009, 09:31 PM
#34
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Wow I thought those were only good to .650 I have 921 on my cam only and its .581 lift. I guess thats better then having a dual spring setup got a little more forgiveness on them. Did you use hardened push rods?
08-24-2009, 10:27 PM
#35
No they only sprayed it on the dyno. The 10.05 was all motor. It uses a std. lifter dia.. Morel or Isky has a tall body for the extra lobe lift. Most use a link-bar set-up to get away from the plastic tray. Pushrod length depends on the valvetrain you use.
We already have ARP head studs for the 6 bolt head bolts on this 482 . It's set-up for solid lifter.
The head studs for our std 4 bolt are in stock.
We already have ARP head studs for the 6 bolt head bolts on this 482 . It's set-up for solid lifter.
The head studs for our std 4 bolt are in stock.
08-24-2009, 11:12 PM
#36
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I had to buy custom length pushrods from ERL.
08-25-2009, 08:02 AM
#37
I did have to buy aftermarket lifters, pushrods, and rockers from ERL.
So in reality, my bill with ERL should be near the $13,000 mark instead of $9900 before you factor in heads, intake, tb, etc.
From what Ive seen, most 427 and 454 type shortblocks are around $6000-7000 using higher end components (ERL uses Callies crank, Carillo rods, Wiseco pistons, camshaft included in price); so as the consumer, you have to decide whether the extra 7 grand or so is worth the extra cubic inches.
So in reality, my bill with ERL should be near the $13,000 mark instead of $9900 before you factor in heads, intake, tb, etc.
From what Ive seen, most 427 and 454 type shortblocks are around $6000-7000 using higher end components (ERL uses Callies crank, Carillo rods, Wiseco pistons, camshaft included in price); so as the consumer, you have to decide whether the extra 7 grand or so is worth the extra cubic inches.
IMO 7grand is totally worth it if the car can get close to 700rwhp N/Aon pump gas and you can spray 200shot on top of it
But if the car had under 640rwhp its totally NOT worth it.
Good luck Kumar and please keep us posted over 680rwhp N/A and 3100lbs is freakin awesome.
08-25-2009, 08:54 AM
#38
I agree again that the small cam L92 heads are small for the 500, but our goal was different from most. If we put that small of cam and heads on a 427 you wouldn't be near the same HP and torque. At 2800 rpm (as low as the dyno would hold it) it had near 550 Ft/lb torque so drivability was easy. Everyone has different opinions of idle as some with 244 @ 50 on a 113 in a 400" motor call it smooth (I'm with you, that's starting to sound right), but others don't want to be bothered by the engine until they mash the pedal.
Kumar75150 is going to have a build more like it with the ported LS7 heads, 102 intake and throttle body, 260-270 cam and 2" headers. It's going to be a beast to take advantage of the displacement.
The cam can be ground to your specs if you like and any LS head can be used, so you can have it as extreme as you like. We did the 500 way before anyone had attemped it and we didn't short cut on the components in the bottom end. The rods alone cost more than some complete rotating assemblies you see, but that way you don't have to worry about it. The long rod, long sleeve keeps the piston in the cylinder vs. a normal stroker engine to eliminate the piston rock, skirt, ring issues. We've been brutal to our's on the dyno in testing with days of back to back pulls, steady state loads, rich, lean, timing advanced, etc in testing and to find any issues and then put it in the car and started driving.
The best way to describe the displacement difference in driving is like a small block vs big block where the small block would require a down shift to get in it's peak but you just mash the big block and it comes alive. It didn't take long to realize there weren't any roads around here to get to stay in it and I do need my license.
It has to do with how they were installed and machined. After all the factory LS7 and any of the aftermarket aluminum blocks have pressed in liners. There are a few blocks that try coating the parent bore material, but very few. I can say that on the dry liners we have never had an issue even on the extreme road racing conditions where heat build-up can be intense. We've sleeved aluminum blocks everyday for years and I wish I could say we're perfect for all those years, but if there has ever been an issue we've taken care of it. We're constantly improving our process and all our blocks are thermal cycled to operating temps, vibratory stress relieved and pressure tested after sleeving and prior to finish machining to test them in near operating conditions.
Kumar75150 is going to have a build more like it with the ported LS7 heads, 102 intake and throttle body, 260-270 cam and 2" headers. It's going to be a beast to take advantage of the displacement.
The cam can be ground to your specs if you like and any LS head can be used, so you can have it as extreme as you like. We did the 500 way before anyone had attemped it and we didn't short cut on the components in the bottom end. The rods alone cost more than some complete rotating assemblies you see, but that way you don't have to worry about it. The long rod, long sleeve keeps the piston in the cylinder vs. a normal stroker engine to eliminate the piston rock, skirt, ring issues. We've been brutal to our's on the dyno in testing with days of back to back pulls, steady state loads, rich, lean, timing advanced, etc in testing and to find any issues and then put it in the car and started driving.
The best way to describe the displacement difference in driving is like a small block vs big block where the small block would require a down shift to get in it's peak but you just mash the big block and it comes alive. It didn't take long to realize there weren't any roads around here to get to stay in it and I do need my license.
It has to do with how they were installed and machined. After all the factory LS7 and any of the aftermarket aluminum blocks have pressed in liners. There are a few blocks that try coating the parent bore material, but very few. I can say that on the dry liners we have never had an issue even on the extreme road racing conditions where heat build-up can be intense. We've sleeved aluminum blocks everyday for years and I wish I could say we're perfect for all those years, but if there has ever been an issue we've taken care of it. We're constantly improving our process and all our blocks are thermal cycled to operating temps, vibratory stress relieved and pressure tested after sleeving and prior to finish machining to test them in near operating conditions.
09-02-2011, 11:06 AM
#39
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I agree again that the small cam L92 heads are small for the 500, but our goal was different from most. If we put that small of cam and heads on a 427 you wouldn't be near the same HP and torque. At 2800 rpm (as low as the dyno would hold it) it had near 550 Ft/lb torque so drivability was easy. Everyone has different opinions of idle as some with 244 @ 50 on a 113 in a 400" motor call it smooth (I'm with you, that's starting to sound right), but others don't want to be bothered by the engine until they mash the pedal.
Kumar75150 is going to have a build more like it with the ported LS7 heads, 102 intake and throttle body, 260-270 cam and 2" headers. It's going to be a beast to take advantage of the displacement.
The cam can be ground to your specs if you like and any LS head can be used, so you can have it as extreme as you like. We did the 500 way before anyone had attemped it and we didn't short cut on the components in the bottom end. The rods alone cost more than some complete rotating assemblies you see, but that way you don't have to worry about it. The long rod, long sleeve keeps the piston in the cylinder vs. a normal stroker engine to eliminate the piston rock, skirt, ring issues. We've been brutal to our's on the dyno in testing with days of back to back pulls, steady state loads, rich, lean, timing advanced, etc in testing and to find any issues and then put it in the car and started driving.
The best way to describe the displacement difference in driving is like a small block vs big block where the small block would require a down shift to get in it's peak but you just mash the big block and it comes alive. It didn't take long to realize there weren't any roads around here to get to stay in it and I do need my license.
It has to do with how they were installed and machined. After all the factory LS7 and any of the aftermarket aluminum blocks have pressed in liners. There are a few blocks that try coating the parent bore material, but very few. I can say that on the dry liners we have never had an issue even on the extreme road racing conditions where heat build-up can be intense. We've sleeved aluminum blocks everyday for years and I wish I could say we're perfect for all those years, but if there has ever been an issue we've taken care of it. We're constantly improving our process and all our blocks are thermal cycled to operating temps, vibratory stress relieved and pressure tested after sleeving and prior to finish machining to test them in near operating conditions.
Kumar75150 is going to have a build more like it with the ported LS7 heads, 102 intake and throttle body, 260-270 cam and 2" headers. It's going to be a beast to take advantage of the displacement.
The cam can be ground to your specs if you like and any LS head can be used, so you can have it as extreme as you like. We did the 500 way before anyone had attemped it and we didn't short cut on the components in the bottom end. The rods alone cost more than some complete rotating assemblies you see, but that way you don't have to worry about it. The long rod, long sleeve keeps the piston in the cylinder vs. a normal stroker engine to eliminate the piston rock, skirt, ring issues. We've been brutal to our's on the dyno in testing with days of back to back pulls, steady state loads, rich, lean, timing advanced, etc in testing and to find any issues and then put it in the car and started driving.
The best way to describe the displacement difference in driving is like a small block vs big block where the small block would require a down shift to get in it's peak but you just mash the big block and it comes alive. It didn't take long to realize there weren't any roads around here to get to stay in it and I do need my license.
It has to do with how they were installed and machined. After all the factory LS7 and any of the aftermarket aluminum blocks have pressed in liners. There are a few blocks that try coating the parent bore material, but very few. I can say that on the dry liners we have never had an issue even on the extreme road racing conditions where heat build-up can be intense. We've sleeved aluminum blocks everyday for years and I wish I could say we're perfect for all those years, but if there has ever been an issue we've taken care of it. We're constantly improving our process and all our blocks are thermal cycled to operating temps, vibratory stress relieved and pressure tested after sleeving and prior to finish machining to test them in near operating conditions.
I want to sell my unused 540BBC with Dart 320 AluHeads and want to change to the LS-Engines but dont know how to start.
The engine would be for an late 60´s Impala on a subframe from jake´s rod shop.
I like the super-mileage of the LS engines and I am very interested in the turbocharged way.
First I thougt I buy an LS3 or so drop out and start with it but after everything that I would change would be changed almost nothing would be left from the LS3.
Makes no sense to me to buy an engine and than buy an stroker shortblock, heads and so on.
If I start with parts I wonder where to get the entire EFI-stuff from.
I think I buy a twin turbo crate engine from a company that got a fair price...
How much could that be for a 400 to 454cid engine?