Foundry location for GMPP - LSX block???
10-01-2009, 01:21 PM
#41
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He called you old also, and I think I'm older than you
Kurt
Kurt
LOL @ Ed, calling me cranky...
Ok guys, I have asked for some updates and permission to answer some of the questions here. As you know things such as suppliers or sources are off limits. I can understand the reasons.
I asked how to address a vendor change with regard to the LSX block and I got this response.
"The latest LSX block is not so much about "new" features, as it is about maintaining a constant supply of high-quality blocks. The GEN I LSX block was cast in a GM production foundry overseas. This foundry was excellent in producing aluminum LS blocks, but turned out to be not as good at producing the LSX cast iron block to the GMPP Bowtie standards. After struggling with supply interruptions for over a year, it was determined that the only way to cure the problem was to move production. As a result, the "new" LSX blocks are now poured in the same foundry that produces the Bowtie Big Blocks for GMPP, right here in the USA. The GMPP engineering standards and validation process is much more stringent than anyone else in the aftermarket. By working with our foundry close to home, we can maintain a constant dialogue, as well as more closely monitor the casting process at every step of the way. It's real simple: If you start with a less-than-perfect casting, you're not going to be able to machine a finished product to the standards that GMPP designs and our customers expect.
We are confident that these changes, although painfully slow, will guarantee that LSX Bowtie blocks are available daily on demand for years to come."
After reading that I felt as though I could not have said it any better.
The key to control the quality that we deliver to the customer.
Thanks
Robin
P.S. as soon as I get any updates on supply I will let you know. But I will call John at SDPC first.
Ok guys, I have asked for some updates and permission to answer some of the questions here. As you know things such as suppliers or sources are off limits. I can understand the reasons.
I asked how to address a vendor change with regard to the LSX block and I got this response.
"The latest LSX block is not so much about "new" features, as it is about maintaining a constant supply of high-quality blocks. The GEN I LSX block was cast in a GM production foundry overseas. This foundry was excellent in producing aluminum LS blocks, but turned out to be not as good at producing the LSX cast iron block to the GMPP Bowtie standards. After struggling with supply interruptions for over a year, it was determined that the only way to cure the problem was to move production. As a result, the "new" LSX blocks are now poured in the same foundry that produces the Bowtie Big Blocks for GMPP, right here in the USA. The GMPP engineering standards and validation process is much more stringent than anyone else in the aftermarket. By working with our foundry close to home, we can maintain a constant dialogue, as well as more closely monitor the casting process at every step of the way. It's real simple: If you start with a less-than-perfect casting, you're not going to be able to machine a finished product to the standards that GMPP designs and our customers expect.
We are confident that these changes, although painfully slow, will guarantee that LSX Bowtie blocks are available daily on demand for years to come."
After reading that I felt as though I could not have said it any better.
The key to control the quality that we deliver to the customer.
Thanks
Robin
P.S. as soon as I get any updates on supply I will let you know. But I will call John at SDPC first.
10-01-2009, 02:34 PM
#42
Everyone claims the LSX block needs a lot of work before assembly and that the cam bearings are no-good. Are the new blocks going to be machined better with good cam bearings?
10-01-2009, 02:52 PM
#43
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The cam bearings were fine. As I stated the cam bores were on the low side of the spec and when the bearings were installed some were tight
.
That spec was changed a while ago. All is good.
Many people have preferences for different parts. I like the dura bond cam bearings myself. If you don't like the bearings then have your builder change them.
If you have a specific issue with the machining please send me a PM and I will address it with the engineers at GMPP.
The blocks are machined at the same facility that machined the gen 1 LSX blocks.
Robin
.
That spec was changed a while ago. All is good.
Many people have preferences for different parts. I like the dura bond cam bearings myself. If you don't like the bearings then have your builder change them.
If you have a specific issue with the machining please send me a PM and I will address it with the engineers at GMPP.
The blocks are machined at the same facility that machined the gen 1 LSX blocks.
Robin
10-01-2009, 03:17 PM
#45
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The LSX block comes out of the box just under 4 inch bore, the mains have stock bolts in them and the deck is usually on the plus side. If you are building a stout 402 it could be honed, decked and assembled. Some people buy them for bigger CI combo type engines, then you add main studs, rough bore and a whole list of machine work that an engine builder does to tailor the engine for the intended use. This is a part with no specific intention but to be a foundation that can be made to meet many needs. We have many blocks that come closer to a certain engines needs at a higher price, you just pick whats best for you.
The cam bearings are up to the builder. The bearings that come with the block are tongue and groove type, they are very strong and will carry high loads but a pita to install with conventional cam bearing tools you will find in your local machine shop. This is compounded by the LSX tunnel being a bit on the tight side in some cases. I personally use a tubular bearing in most builds, they are just easier to work with.
Kurt
The cam bearings are up to the builder. The bearings that come with the block are tongue and groove type, they are very strong and will carry high loads but a pita to install with conventional cam bearing tools you will find in your local machine shop. This is compounded by the LSX tunnel being a bit on the tight side in some cases. I personally use a tubular bearing in most builds, they are just easier to work with.
Kurt
10-01-2009, 04:17 PM
#49
I have heard of stock GM LS blocks having issues when a machine shop installed new bearings. Just to comment on my experience with the cam bearings, my machine shop had issues with putting cam bearings into my 6.0L block. Upon pre-assembly I found the cam would not pass through even the first bearing. Come to find out they used their typical cam bearing installation tool causing the bearings to deform leaving them with a taper to the bore. They simply made a new tool, got some new bearings and I have been fine ever since. So I wouldn't say the LSX is the only one to have had issues with cam bearings.
10-01-2009, 05:30 PM
#51
Don't worry about me and my choice of machinists. My first little LS motor has been running now for two years, several thousand miles and plenty 10.30-10.50 passes N/A. And amazingly enough I assembled it just like every other engine I have built.
Keep in mind when you begin to talk down to someone or refer to them in a derogatory manner, your screen name is a representation of your employer.
And FYI, "faith on solid footing" is a contradiction of terms.
10-01-2009, 08:18 PM
#52
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Don't worry about me and my choice of machinists. My first little LS motor has been running now for two years, several thousand miles and plenty 10.30-10.50 passes N/A. And amazingly enough I assembled it just like every other engine I have built.
Keep in mind when you begin to talk down to someone or refer to them in a derogatory manner, your screen name is a representation of your employer.
And FYI, "faith on solid footing" is a contradiction of terms.
Keep in mind when you begin to talk down to someone or refer to them in a derogatory manner, your screen name is a representation of your employer.
And FYI, "faith on solid footing" is a contradiction of terms.
I have seen build where the shop has ignored the warnings from customers about the expansion characteristics of the aluminum blocks
While I have many things to say about the LSX block I could be percieved as biased. I appreciate Kurt, Erik and others candid comments about the LSX block.
Sometimes it is easy to read something into a post that isn't there. I have done this myself from time to time.
John has been around the block and I have never known him to talk down to anyone.
Hopefully we have answered your original question to your satisfaction.
Good luck with your project!
Robin
10-02-2009, 08:43 AM
#53
I was not talking down to you or your machine shop. And the contradictory term is just what i was aiming at. I have heard and seen alot of horror stories about LS engines being in the wrong hands. Trying to figure out if it was installer error, abuse, or mismachining, is kind of hard sometimes. Sometimes people do not understand that every engine is not the same. Even LS engines, like what Robin said about the alum blocks.
I meant neither you, nor anyone else to feel put down by what I said.
I meant neither you, nor anyone else to feel put down by what I said.
10-03-2009, 02:50 AM
#56
I was not talking down to you or your machine shop. And the contradictory term is just what i was aiming at. I have heard and seen alot of horror stories about LS engines being in the wrong hands. Trying to figure out if it was installer error, abuse, or mismachining, is kind of hard sometimes. Sometimes people do not understand that every engine is not the same. Even LS engines, like what Robin said about the alum blocks.
I meant neither you, nor anyone else to feel put down by what I said.
I meant neither you, nor anyone else to feel put down by what I said.
I think I am switching to Ford..
(This is aimed at no-one on here)
10-03-2009, 08:32 AM
#57
I'm a novice when it comes to engine building, but I've found that many people complain about the LSX iron block. I"m having a hard time figuring out why.
10-03-2009, 10:07 AM
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10-03-2009, 10:34 AM
#60
If you do not know how to handle and machine iron or like to complain about it, then why stay in the biz? Alot of people complain because they like to complain. About everything.
You want good news, stay off the interenet. You want to hear bad news...stay on.
You want good news, stay off the interenet. You want to hear bad news...stay on.