Beryllium Copper Valve Seats
11-11-2009 | 01:31 PM
#23
On The Tree
Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 150
Likes: 0
From: harrisburg PA
holy cow...we've got information going every which way but loose here!
first off... BeCu is not used very much in endurance racing anymore. Newer copper and sintered iron alloys are availible today.
BeCu is about 7% softer than work hardened cast iron. This does help w/ valve dampening to some degree....at the expense of elevated seat wear.
The primary use of copper alloys...well... really shouldn't have to explain this.. Just think copper.. it is a good conductor of thermal energy.
Ti doesn't care for heat that much. and it IS softer than stainless.. and requires special care when grinding. Also... keep anything chlorinated away from your Ti valves.
If machined properly (TIR of less than .0015") and the valve train is kept under control a ti valve and BeCu seat can live a long time without service.
Also.. knowing who installed the seats, I would actually be suprised if they are CuBe. They are probably a copper / nickel alloy. Most seat companies don't deal w/ CuBe anymore unless it is requested.
first off... BeCu is not used very much in endurance racing anymore. Newer copper and sintered iron alloys are availible today.
BeCu is about 7% softer than work hardened cast iron. This does help w/ valve dampening to some degree....at the expense of elevated seat wear.
The primary use of copper alloys...well... really shouldn't have to explain this.. Just think copper.. it is a good conductor of thermal energy.
Ti doesn't care for heat that much. and it IS softer than stainless.. and requires special care when grinding. Also... keep anything chlorinated away from your Ti valves.
If machined properly (TIR of less than .0015") and the valve train is kept under control a ti valve and BeCu seat can live a long time without service.
Also.. knowing who installed the seats, I would actually be suprised if they are CuBe. They are probably a copper / nickel alloy. Most seat companies don't deal w/ CuBe anymore unless it is requested.
11-11-2009 | 03:33 PM
#24
holy cow...we've got information going every which way but loose here!
first off... BeCu is not used very much in endurance racing anymore. Newer copper and sintered iron alloys are availible today.
BeCu is about 7% softer than work hardened cast iron. This does help w/ valve dampening to some degree....at the expense of elevated seat wear.
The primary use of copper alloys...well... really shouldn't have to explain this.. Just think copper.. it is a good conductor of thermal energy.
Ti doesn't care for heat that much. and it IS softer than stainless.. and requires special care when grinding. Also... keep anything chlorinated away from your Ti valves.
If machined properly (TIR of less than .0015") and the valve train is kept under control a ti valve and BeCu seat can live a long time without service.
Also.. knowing who installed the seats, I would actually be suprised if they are CuBe. They are probably a copper / nickel alloy. Most seat companies don't deal w/ CuBe anymore unless it is requested.
first off... BeCu is not used very much in endurance racing anymore. Newer copper and sintered iron alloys are availible today.
BeCu is about 7% softer than work hardened cast iron. This does help w/ valve dampening to some degree....at the expense of elevated seat wear.
The primary use of copper alloys...well... really shouldn't have to explain this.. Just think copper.. it is a good conductor of thermal energy.
Ti doesn't care for heat that much. and it IS softer than stainless.. and requires special care when grinding. Also... keep anything chlorinated away from your Ti valves.
If machined properly (TIR of less than .0015") and the valve train is kept under control a ti valve and BeCu seat can live a long time without service.
Also.. knowing who installed the seats, I would actually be suprised if they are CuBe. They are probably a copper / nickel alloy. Most seat companies don't deal w/ CuBe anymore unless it is requested.
7% between Be-Cu and cast iron doesn't seem like a lot, what about the harder seats, like SBi and Durabond sell? They used carbide and tungsten in some of that stuff which seems to make machining seats a PITA. I've seen cases where we would cut the seat with a typical 3 angle cutter and then have to stone in the seat.
I wouldn't expect Be-Cu to be used in endurance racing, but what about drag racing? I was under the impression that it's still popular, along with several other similar alloys.
11-11-2009 | 04:26 PM
#25
holy cow...we've got information going every which way but loose here!
first off... BeCu is not used very much in endurance racing anymore. Newer copper and sintered iron alloys are availible today.
BeCu is about 7% softer than work hardened cast iron. This does help w/ valve dampening to some degree....at the expense of elevated seat wear.
The primary use of copper alloys...well... really shouldn't have to explain this.. Just think copper.. it is a good conductor of thermal energy.
Ti doesn't care for heat that much. and it IS softer than stainless.. and requires special care when grinding. Also... keep anything chlorinated away from your Ti valves.
If machined properly (TIR of less than .0015") and the valve train is kept under control a ti valve and BeCu seat can live a long time without service.
Also.. knowing who installed the seats, I would actually be suprised if they are CuBe. They are probably a copper / nickel alloy. Most seat companies don't deal w/ CuBe anymore unless it is requested.
first off... BeCu is not used very much in endurance racing anymore. Newer copper and sintered iron alloys are availible today.
BeCu is about 7% softer than work hardened cast iron. This does help w/ valve dampening to some degree....at the expense of elevated seat wear.
The primary use of copper alloys...well... really shouldn't have to explain this.. Just think copper.. it is a good conductor of thermal energy.
Ti doesn't care for heat that much. and it IS softer than stainless.. and requires special care when grinding. Also... keep anything chlorinated away from your Ti valves.
If machined properly (TIR of less than .0015") and the valve train is kept under control a ti valve and BeCu seat can live a long time without service.
Also.. knowing who installed the seats, I would actually be suprised if they are CuBe. They are probably a copper / nickel alloy. Most seat companies don't deal w/ CuBe anymore unless it is requested.
11-12-2009 | 07:57 AM
#26
On The Tree
Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 150
Likes: 0
From: harrisburg PA
Wow, surprised you posted in 'toke, haha.
7% between Be-Cu and cast iron doesn't seem like a lot, what about the harder seats, like SBi and Durabond sell? They used carbide and tungsten in some of that stuff which seems to make machining seats a PITA. I've seen cases where we would cut the seat with a typical 3 angle cutter and then have to stone in the seat.
I wouldn't expect Be-Cu to be used in endurance racing, but what about drag racing? I was under the impression that it's still popular, along with several other similar alloys.
7% between Be-Cu and cast iron doesn't seem like a lot, what about the harder seats, like SBi and Durabond sell? They used carbide and tungsten in some of that stuff which seems to make machining seats a PITA. I've seen cases where we would cut the seat with a typical 3 angle cutter and then have to stone in the seat.
I wouldn't expect Be-Cu to be used in endurance racing, but what about drag racing? I was under the impression that it's still popular, along with several other similar alloys.
Yes..the 7 and 9000 series durabond...especially work hardened are very HARD! that is fine for OE style stuff.. where we don't get allot of control on seat runout. Plus... they really suck to machine!
BeCu has been used in endurance racing AND drag racing for many years. All with decent results. Just like anything else though..it can be improved on. Most guys now are using CA-18/X-274 or other renditions of Ampco-45.
Plus... you don't have to worry about the "almost" non-existant chance of getting sick from the Be.
03-10-2010 | 01:07 AM
#27
Whats your guys feelings on Titanium valves (Xceldyne) on both intake and exhaust... stock seats for intake --del west Cu-Be for exhaust??....street driven 7k a year... no N.O.S. or power adders... thanks.
