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Great numbers - interesting to see when you drive it. At 7,000 rpm what is the power difference between your old motor and this one? Did you ever take old motor out to 7,500 on dyno? Basically I see the big gains above 6,000 rpm and no drop off (looks like old motor chart about 6,500 started to taper off). Low end looks identical which is good. The major changes were more ported heads and solid roller with a similar profile (lift / duration) to your hydraulic one.
Great numbers - interesting to see when you drive it. At 7,000 rpm what is the power difference between your old motor and this one? Did you ever take old motor out to 7,500 on dyno? Basically I see the big gains above 6,000 rpm and no drop off (looks like old motor chart about 6,500 started to taper off). Low end looks identical which is good. The major changes were more ported heads and solid roller with a similar profile (lift / duration) to your hydraulic one.
Here is the overlay of my original 670 RWHP baseline to yesterday's new 691 baseline
At the 6700 RPM peak of the 670 run, I'm up 18 RWHP and 14 lbs/ft at that same RPM.
Gain all over the powerband, no loss at the bottom. Usually some low end is lost in order to gain on top.
In this case it’s not what happened. A win-win!
Gain all over the powerband, no loss at the bottom. Usually some low end is lost in order to gain on top.
In this case it’s not what happened. A win-win!
Yep, and a pretty good indication that the manifold may be holding us back,
As mush as I want the PTR intake to work for my setup, I think we will see that the switch to the Holley High ram base and custom billet top is going to open things up quite a bit.
We had indications that this would be the case on the engine dyno with the original cam, when we installed that billet top and 6550 throttle body and immediately picked up 20 horsepower.
The lid Erik is sending me has an 112mm opening for direct support for my NW112 as well, so I won't be limited to the 105mm opening of the PTR.
Updated testing later this week should be interesting.
Something is weird with your MAP and TPS values. If it is doing what the log shows, you have an extremely slow throttle opening rate and you're not getting full throttle until past 7k rpm.
You should take a look at the throttle blade with the air filter off to verify it is working properly.
In this generation ECU with DBW - 88.2% tps is 100% throttle opening. You don't hit 88.2 until ~7k rpm.
It is possible there is a bug and you're actually at WOT, but this will have other implications in your tune if the MAP and TPS readings are off while the car is running. MAP and TPS is being accessed by a lot of tables in the tune.
Something is weird with your MAP and TPS values. If it is doing what the log shows, you have an extremely slow throttle opening rate and you're not getting full throttle until past 7k rpm.
You should take a look at the throttle blade with the air filter off to verify it is working properly.
In this generation ECU with DBW - 88.2% tps is 100% throttle opening. You don't hit 88.2 until ~7k rpm.
It is possible there is a bug and you're actually at WOT, but this will have other implications in your tune if the MAP and TPS readings are off while the car is running. MAP and TPS is being accessed by a lot of tables in the tune.
John was having issues with his laptop he use's to run his HP Tuner on, so I think this log was an anomaly.
I had my laptop and HP Tuner Pro as well in the car, which was running perfectly, so we were bouncing between the two (his had the dyno s/w running on it as well) as his laptop would get to 100% cpu utilization at times.
I run a NW112 throttle body.
Here's the follow up log pull, and I slowed it down during playback
Interesting to compare against the 700whp monte carlo dyno sheet... up at high rpm the 427 is having a much easier time breathing, but at 5500 rpm you're up ~50whp.
If you can get your powerplant to breath as efficiently as his 427 above torque peak you'll be putting down ~750whp.
This is of course doing a lot of dyno bench racing which you never know how accurately they compare, but comparing curves is definitely a worthwhile exercise.
That is a ton of restriction through a 102 opening. The 102 to 112mm opening in the manifold lid will be 20% additional flow area.
I wonder if you'd gain with a 3.5" collector and exhaust.
Yes, that pull's logs came out ok.
The 112mm intake should be here by the end of the week, and with a better runner design (proper taper), we would expect to see some improvements (we will leave the speculation for later).
If it can ingest and process the air at 7500-7700, it might be interesting to say the least.
John has 3.5" collectors on his custom stepped headers on the Monte....... he keeps pushing me to do the same on the Z Maybe I'll put that on my Christmas list .
On an different note..... valve train is bad ***.....quite and stable out to 8K.
We will overlay John's 700 RWHP dyno over mine to shows the power curves....he has all of the files on his computer.
Awesome build! How do you like the Monster LT-1? What trans & diff mods have you done to handle that power?
So far, I love the clutch. It has the feel of stock (uses OEM hydraulics) and the release points are where I expect the to be.
I run a TR6060 ZR1 MH3 spec transmission with all of the goodies....... this transmission has the high torque capacity, can handle the high torque loads at low RPM, and is the close ratio gearbox.
The diff is rebuilt using OEM parts, with the Motive 3.90 gear set, OEM late model axles, and safety hoops in case one breaks.
I see you are running full exhaust. Maybe a 3.5 inch collector all the way back to the muffler connection that goes over the axles. By then the exhaust gasses should be cooler and the 3 inch over the axle is OK. I think on these cars a 3 inch is all that fits over the axles. The good thing on these cars the muffler is way in the back and usually hollow anyway.
I see you are running full exhaust. Maybe a 3.5 inch collector all the way back to the muffler connection that goes over the axles. By then the exhaust gasses should be cooler and the 3 inch over the axle is OK. I think on these cars a 3 inch is all that fits over the axles. The good thing on these cars the muffler is way in the back and usually hollow anyway.
I have the titanium Akrapovic EVO exhaust on my car which is 3" all the way back.
John's pressing me for a 3.5" collector and exhaust, but the fitment would be a bitch and the cost...who knows.
If this was an engineering exercises to see what a total maxed out configuration could do, I'd consider it. But in all honesty, at some point in time I just have to enjoy and drive the car.
On a side note....and I know this will suck for a few for a while..... I have a new secret intake inbound that I think is finally going to let the engine breathe.
WE should receive it by end of the week, but I have my parent's birthdays this weekend and was given a verbal NDA on the intake configuration until further notice as it's a prototype...so NO PICTURES will be posted of the engine bay.
I'll share the dyno numbers and the logs, but that is it (for now)....... oh, and some video sound bites as this 468 screams up into the 7500-7800 RPM range
Let's play a game........ bench racing from a computer.
Launch at modest 3400 RPM on a 315/35/17 Hoosier drag radial on a prepped track.
My TR6060 is a ZR1 spec transmission with MH3 gearing (close ratio).
I have a 3.90 rear gear.
Race weight is roughly 2900 lbs without driver.
7700 RPM shift points.
I'm going to use my UNCORRECTED chassis dyno numbers for these calculations, as I don't make SAE power at my altitude........
1st gear launch at 3400 RPM = 304 RWHP, BUT 472 ft/lbs of torque to get the car rolling...shift at 7700 RPM brings me into 2nd gear at...
2nd gear puts me at 5414 RPM = 564 RWHP and 548 ft/lbs torque...... shift again at 7700 RPM brings me into 3rd gear at......
3rd gear puts me at 5787 RPM = 592 RWHP and 538 ft/lbs torque ..... shift again at 7700 RPM (final shift in 1/4 mile pass) brings me into 4th gear at.......
4th gear puts me at 6364 RPM = 631 RWHP and 531 ft/lbs torque.......
If I have enough power to cover the last 1400 RPM and pull 4th gear thru the traps at 7700 RPM = 151 MPH
We installed the short trumpets on the intake last night to see where the power band would get moved (if any) and if they would provide any additional power. We did not touch the tune and the fuel was registering at E60 (and was running a bit leaner).
As expected, the power curve got moved a bit, but only by 100 RPM +/- 10, and we were down a few HP and 5 ft/lbs of torque (689/575). The power loss could have been the fueling difference but for all practical purposes the short runner did not provide any useful change,
First dyno chart is all three runs on the short runner/E60 combo, the last dyno chart is the comparison of the best short runner dyno (689/575) and the best long runner/E50 combo (691/580).
You can see the RPM extension of the short runner, but the same flat HP curve with no drop off.
Next up, a Holley High Ram with custom lid with a custom 112mm opening for the NW112 throttle body
pTr short runner pulls with E60 fuel pTr short runner E60 versus long runner E50.
10-25-2021, 07:43 AM
Maybe I'll put that on my Christmas list .
