402 L92/L76 is on the road
12-03-2006, 05:16 PM
#41
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Kevin, what's happening at 1500RPM?
Originally Posted by WKMCD
Well, you drove it. The lack of cam effect is really interesting. The torque curve on this thing is sooo flat. There is no bump at 3000rpm and another at 4500 like the 346 had. It just progressively gets stronger. Chip and I did a 5th gear roll on from 2k. I pulled him by 10 car lengths by the time we reached 100MPH...He said he felt like he was driving a Toyota. The closest thing I can describe is it's like a big electric motor.
We still need to work on that 1500RPM thing when Phil gets back. I think your probably right about the RWHP. I'm thinking 525-540 but a really big RWT number.
It may actually see a dyno soon but probably never a track. Thanks for working with Phil on the car.
We still need to work on that 1500RPM thing when Phil gets back. I think your probably right about the RWHP. I'm thinking 525-540 but a really big RWT number.
It may actually see a dyno soon but probably never a track. Thanks for working with Phil on the car.
12-03-2006, 06:19 PM
#43
Originally Posted by BlackHawk T/A
While I agree with your points, if it were my car I would share everything because that is what the board is for. Holding back information on a public forum is just silly. Reminds me of a certain "Results with ETP Heads" post where the starter would absolutely not share cam/etc information which made it extremely hard to take anything useful from the post.
But, it isn't my car. Carry on.
But, it isn't my car. Carry on.
12-03-2006, 06:30 PM
#44
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Originally Posted by SideStep
I agree this thread is useless... self-appreciating... waste of forum band-width... Ancient Chinese secret... blah , blah, blah... Why even post this thread, bragging rights only???
The interesting thing is no one here is selling cams.... It isn't like this guy is freakin Lou at LG!!! I mean if he was offering a cam to the public that would be one thing. No one was asking for a damn cam card... just input on the suggested lift and duration and what works with these heads. It isnt like this won't be out in 6 months anyway........ I am sure once all the real parts distributors get on the stick with these news GM parts his secret will be something nobody gives a rats *** about
. Kudos to you guys for being the first...... this is why I give you a toast... no the fact that you think you have found something with this cam that others will not be able to do in 6 months. my unwarranted .02 cents.
so everyone... lets all stand up and give them a pat on the back.
sounds like a beast. 
Maybe after "somebody" gets thier lips of someone else's *** 
they will tell us more about this torque monster.
12-03-2006, 08:12 PM
#45
You guys are real pieces of work. I give out every single spec on the build here with the exception of cam specs which I was asked not to by BRE. The reason for the post was to let everyone know that the setup works and works well.
If you want a cam, do what I did. Talk to everyone you can who seems knowledgable and make a gut level decision on who you think can produce the cam that will meet your needs.
If that's not good enough - pound sand.
If you want a cam, do what I did. Talk to everyone you can who seems knowledgable and make a gut level decision on who you think can produce the cam that will meet your needs.
If that's not good enough - pound sand.
12-03-2006, 08:47 PM
#46
Guys as I said giving you cam specs or partical cams specs only does two things:
1. Gives guys free R&D to what works and what doesn't
2. Confuse 99% of you. There is a lot more in these L92 setups than is just seen in a duration number. I'm not trying to be all knowing omnipitent ***, but unless you understand cams are more than duration, lift and LSA numbers or valve events you will not come close to actually getting something usefull out of it.
Besides I doubt this whole deal will be figured out unless someone leaks it, and it's not going to be me, kevin, phil or anyone in my shop.
Bret
1. Gives guys free R&D to what works and what doesn't
2. Confuse 99% of you. There is a lot more in these L92 setups than is just seen in a duration number. I'm not trying to be all knowing omnipitent ***, but unless you understand cams are more than duration, lift and LSA numbers or valve events you will not come close to actually getting something usefull out of it.
Besides I doubt this whole deal will be figured out unless someone leaks it, and it's not going to be me, kevin, phil or anyone in my shop.
Bret
12-03-2006, 09:04 PM
#48
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I'm glad to hear the cars running great.
Its cool to hear what can be accomplished.
I don't mind the "secrets" kept as when the time comes for me to have a motor built...I'll be paying someone who knows what the hell they are doing...so I don't need to know if thats not where your at...
Just glad to hear the cars a success...
Looking forward to continued updates on your car...
Keep it coming.
Its cool to hear what can be accomplished.
I don't mind the "secrets" kept as when the time comes for me to have a motor built...I'll be paying someone who knows what the hell they are doing...so I don't need to know if thats not where your at...
Just glad to hear the cars a success...
Looking forward to continued updates on your car...
Keep it coming.
12-03-2006, 09:06 PM
#49
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I don't think WKMCD deserves the grief that he is getting for not releasing the specs, because he was asked not to by someone that helped with his build. I am sure he is thankful for all the help everyone involved with the build gave to him.
On the other hand, I think the people keeping the specs secret on thier cams should be banned from the forum seeing how it is an information SHARING site and they are not contributing in any way. I think vendors should be be included in that also, which is a huge reason I would NEVER buy even a damn lugnut from LG. Most people on this forum would do anything they could to help anyone even the newbs that ask what is the best cam as their first post but then there are the people that use this forum for free R&D and then keep and hide info from the public and that is just wrong.
On the other hand, I think the people keeping the specs secret on thier cams should be banned from the forum seeing how it is an information SHARING site and they are not contributing in any way. I think vendors should be be included in that also, which is a huge reason I would NEVER buy even a damn lugnut from LG. Most people on this forum would do anything they could to help anyone even the newbs that ask what is the best cam as their first post but then there are the people that use this forum for free R&D and then keep and hide info from the public and that is just wrong.
12-03-2006, 09:09 PM
#50
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[QUOTE=WKMCD]If you want a cam, do what I did. Talk to everyone you can who seems knowledgable and make a gut level decision on who you think can produce the cam that will meet your needs.
I agree, there is A LOT that goes in to choosing a cam, not the least of which is where YOU want to make power.
I agree, there is A LOT that goes in to choosing a cam, not the least of which is where YOU want to make power.
12-03-2006, 09:28 PM
#51
Originally Posted by Blue02Ws6
On the other hand, I think the people keeping the specs secret on thier cams should be banned from the forum seeing how it is an information SHARING site and they are not contributing in any way. I think vendors should be be included in that also, which is a huge reason I would NEVER buy even a damn lugnut from LG. Most people on this forum would do anything they could to help anyone even the newbs that ask what is the best cam as their first post but then there are the people that use this forum for free R&D and then keep and hide info from the public and that is just wrong.
On the other hand, you can buy your LS7 cam from someone else like Greg Fell did with no one to help analyze his results other than a bunch of internet experts, and make sub par numbers with BOTH cams, let alone one. Going off of what other people say is good in theory, untill you hit the track or the dyno. Sure There are a lot of variables, and sure there are a TON of internet experts who think they can have a cam ground or port a set of heads with the best of them. There is a reason We do this for a living.
Not only do you get a proven cam that has been a staple for years, you get the tech support with it. Your car isnt making power? We can sort through the combo to find where the missing link is and what we can do to make it better.
Im certainly not going to trouble shoot a customers car for free when he has a custom ground joe schmo cam. If you worked at Cingular, are you going to help a customer who calls you and says " My Verizon phone is acting up, what can I do?"
Its a free country, Bret and Kevin have a real, live, running L92 setup. That is as far as we know. It hasnt hit the rollers yet, and we have nothing to compare it to. Therefore, this cam, or combo may yeild typical AFR/402 numbers. We dont know, we cant draw conclusions based off of a 1500 pull from a stock car. Its a stroker, Big CR at that, it should pull a stock car.
Maybe there is a reason GM put these on the trucks, maybe there is a reason they have yet to put them in a full size car yet. I dont know, do you?
Louis
Last edited by Louis; 12-03-2006 at 09:34 PM.
12-03-2006, 09:29 PM
#52
You guys quit complaining.
I can appreciate the effort that went into the build and not wanting to give knowledge earned through hard work away. I've been following this build because it was something totally different. You guys wanting cam specs, I'll agree about finding the guys at the top of their game. They want paid for designing, installing, and testing several grinds to deliver the customer a proven product.
Once again, congrats and hope to see some vids of this engine in action when you guys get it all dialed in.
I can appreciate the effort that went into the build and not wanting to give knowledge earned through hard work away. I've been following this build because it was something totally different. You guys wanting cam specs, I'll agree about finding the guys at the top of their game. They want paid for designing, installing, and testing several grinds to deliver the customer a proven product.
Once again, congrats and hope to see some vids of this engine in action when you guys get it all dialed in.
Last edited by Cool_Hand_Luke; 12-03-2006 at 09:36 PM.
12-03-2006, 09:42 PM
#54
Originally Posted by Blue02Ws6
On the other hand, I think the people keeping the specs secret on thier cams should be banned from the forum seeing how it is an information SHARING site and they are not contributing in any way.
Originally Posted by Blue02WS6
then there are the people that use this forum for free R&D and then keep and hide info from the public and that is just wrong.
This place is an anomaly in the world of engines, where cam specs matter more than performance or engine output not to mention the average torque output, idle quality and drivabily.
Bret
Last edited by SStrokerAce; 12-03-2006 at 09:48 PM.
12-03-2006, 09:43 PM
#55
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Originally Posted by WKMCD
You guys are real pieces of work. I give out every single spec on the build here with the exception of cam specs which I was asked not to by BRE. The reason for the post was to let everyone know that the setup works and works well.
If you want a cam, do what I did. Talk to everyone you can who seems knowledgable and make a gut level decision on who you think can produce the cam that will meet your needs.
If that's not good enough - pound sand.
If you want a cam, do what I did. Talk to everyone you can who seems knowledgable and make a gut level decision on who you think can produce the cam that will meet your needs.
If that's not good enough - pound sand.
your right... guess i was just stirrin the pot....... I was pissed Automatica missed the first field goal.
lol Still dont understand the
12-03-2006, 09:46 PM
#56
Originally Posted by MeentSS02
This thread is continuing on a downward spiral...very sad to see.
Let's get back to the action and stop the spec argument. It has happened far too many times in the past, if you care, search, and dig up one of the old threads. The L92/L76 info is far too innovative to contaminate with some drivel about secret specs and what 1 or 2 members' opinions of holding specs are.
12-03-2006, 09:54 PM
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Originally Posted by Louis
You dont have to buy a lugnut from me. I dont have to sell you a lugnut either. This forum is about A lot of things, and sharing my cam specs at my discretion is up to me.
On the other hand, you can buy your LS7 cam from someone else like Greg Fell did with no one to help analyze his results other than a bunch of internet experts, and make sub par numbers with BOTH cams, let alone one. Going off of what other people say is good in theory, untill you hit the track or the dyno. Sure There are a lot of variables, and sure there are a TON of internet experts who think they can have a cam ground or port a set of heads with the best of them. There is a reason We do this for a living.
Not only do you get a proven cam that has been a staple for years, you get the tech support with it. Your car isnt making power? We can sort through the combo to find where the missing link is and what we can do to make it better.
Im certainly not going to trouble shoot a customers car for free when he has a custom ground joe schmo cam. If you worked at Cingular, are you going to help a customer who calls you and says " My Verizon phone is acting up, what can I do?"
Its a free country, Bret and Kevin have a real, live, running L92 setup. That is as far as we know. It hasnt hit the rollers yet, and we have nothing to compare it to. Therefore, this cam, or combo may yeild typical AFR/402 numbers. We dont know, we cant draw conclusions based off of a 1500 pull from a stock car. Its a stroker, Big CR at that, it should pull a stock car.
Maybe there is a reason GM put these on the trucks, maybe there is a reason they have yet to put them in a full size car yet. I dont know, do you?
Louis
On the other hand, you can buy your LS7 cam from someone else like Greg Fell did with no one to help analyze his results other than a bunch of internet experts, and make sub par numbers with BOTH cams, let alone one. Going off of what other people say is good in theory, untill you hit the track or the dyno. Sure There are a lot of variables, and sure there are a TON of internet experts who think they can have a cam ground or port a set of heads with the best of them. There is a reason We do this for a living.
Not only do you get a proven cam that has been a staple for years, you get the tech support with it. Your car isnt making power? We can sort through the combo to find where the missing link is and what we can do to make it better.
Im certainly not going to trouble shoot a customers car for free when he has a custom ground joe schmo cam. If you worked at Cingular, are you going to help a customer who calls you and says " My Verizon phone is acting up, what can I do?"
Its a free country, Bret and Kevin have a real, live, running L92 setup. That is as far as we know. It hasnt hit the rollers yet, and we have nothing to compare it to. Therefore, this cam, or combo may yeild typical AFR/402 numbers. We dont know, we cant draw conclusions based off of a 1500 pull from a stock car. Its a stroker, Big CR at that, it should pull a stock car.
Maybe there is a reason GM put these on the trucks, maybe there is a reason they have yet to put them in a full size car yet. I dont know, do you?
Louis
Louis... this is apples and oranges. You have a real business with many wannabe's and copycats. This is a single and first of its kind engine build. Keeping this info a
is simply being arrogant IMO. While they pat eachother on the back and congratulate for a job well done after pulling a stock car by 10 lengths, we are sitting here wondering if the cam they selected was even equivelent to a typical 402 car. I for one am anxious to see dyno and track times...... but I am sure only time will tell what this setup will do. One thing is for sure, WE ALL GREATLY APPRECIATE this thread in its wealth of information and having the first of the sort with this setup keep the heart of the engine (the camshaft) on the down low.
Meanwhile, hopefully you or TSP or another parts distributor/manufacturer will get some numbers out on these new GM products. It would be nice for those of us building L92 combos to not have to swap cams or spend our own money for the R&D to get the right setup......... I assume that is what we all pay YOUR companies to do??? By the way...... I would buy a lugnut from you....
12-03-2006, 10:02 PM
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Originally Posted by Louis
On the other hand, you can buy your LS7 cam from someone else like Greg Fell did with no one to help analyze his results other than a bunch of internet experts, and make sub par numbers with BOTH cams, let alone one. Going off of what other people say is good in theory, untill you hit the track or the dyno. Sure There are a lot of variables, and sure there are a TON of internet experts who think they can have a cam ground or port a set of heads with the best of them. There is a reason We do this for a living.
Not only do you get a proven cam that has been a staple for years, you get the tech support with it. Your car isnt making power? We can sort through the combo to find where the missing link is and what we can do to make it better.
Im certainly not going to trouble shoot a customers car for free when he has a custom ground joe schmo cam. If you worked at Cingular, are you going to help a customer who calls you and says " My Verizon phone is acting up, what can I do?"
Im certainly not going to trouble shoot a customers car for free when he has a custom ground joe schmo cam. If you worked at Cingular, are you going to help a customer who calls you and says " My Verizon phone is acting up, what can I do?"
Its a free country, Bret and Kevin have a real, live, running L92 setup. That is as far as we know. It hasnt hit the rollers yet, and we have nothing to compare it to. Therefore, this cam, or combo may yeild typical AFR/402 numbers. We dont know, we cant draw conclusions based off of a 1500 pull from a stock car. Its a stroker, Big CR at that, it should pull a stock car.
Maybe there is a reason GM put these on the trucks, maybe there is a reason they have yet to put them in a full size car yet. I dont know, do you?
Louis
Maybe there is a reason GM put these on the trucks, maybe there is a reason they have yet to put them in a full size car yet. I dont know, do you?
Louis