Count of Monte Carlo

I forget, have you guys tuned the tranmission as well?

Nacho SS

iTrader: (4)

About 20k.

1CL3ANSUP3RSPORT

iTrader: (23)

No,stock tune....

Nacho SS

iTrader: (4)

I was HP Tuned then I sold my set up, then I gave a diablosport a try, and sold that.

Count of Monte Carlo

So are you both also modifed with a combination or all; 3 inch down pipe, muffler and an intake system?

Nacho SS

iTrader: (4)

For now, stock DP, magnaflows and K&N.

1CL3ANSUP3RSPORT

iTrader: (23)

Stock cat back w/res delete & K&N w/tb spacer

Count of Monte Carlo

Yeah... With out a tune just the Downpipe or just the K and N will be enough to upset the shifting. I tried just one and then the other separately and I had a tie up at WOT on the 1-2 shift. Basically the engine would hit the governor then shift. If you go back to stock the shift control should return to normal.

Nacho SS

iTrader: (4)

Hey man, off topic but your ride is lookin' cleaannn in that sig pic!
Yep, just what I figured. There is this awkward momentary pause...I know its torching my tranny and its basically gonna eat it sooner rather than later. But at this point I would have to automatically step down to something not as nice car wise because of a student loan....ouch.

1CL3ANSUP3RSPORT

iTrader: (23)

Thanks Nick,when I took the pic I just had washed her!!!I think SSC drop and and powder coatr the rims a black chrome and ill be down with the exterior mods for her!!!

But back on to topic,that would suck to step down from the Monte to a bucket....Hopefully a shift kit will help me out for a while,good luck with your tranny...

nmp0098

If I'm reading this right, it seems like the root cause of a transmission dying with very few mods is actually easily explainable? It sounds like the extra power (which causes the torque converter to stall a little higher) combined with the stock shift speeds (it shifts based on mph, not RPM) and rev limiter leads to a more jarring 1->2 shift, which at first isn't as noticeable but over time takes it's toll on the transmission. Is that everyone's experience?

Nacho SS

iTrader: (4)

Its not jarring per se, its more of a lazy shift than anything.

SSGoat

iTrader: (2)

x2 as soon as i hop in "auto light control OFF, TC OFF"

im experiencing similar, from D to R or R to D i usually just tap the gas a couple of times reving it before actually going or else it will feel like its stalling..
and few times its happened were when it shifts at low speeds it will hesitate, rev up (car doesnt go any faster) and stall a bit then pull u back in ur seat to the rpm it was at..

and like nacho, when going wot from 1st to 2nd idk if its the same as nacho but mine lags like his a bit but i feel a small shake in the car, nothing noticable, but as a driver youll feel it..

1CL3ANSUP3RSPORT

iTrader: (23)

I know its off topic but whats up Alberto,where you been big dawg?Pm'd you on the grille,back to the op topic....

Nacho SS

iTrader: (4)

Yeah probably the same symptoms, I know the shake/shudder in the car you are talking about, you feel like it hits a small wall or a small hesitation.

Count of Monte Carlo

It is definately a calibration issue, and not a power issue. If it was a power issue and the transmission could not handle say another 15 horses, the car would not even make it 100 miles, as everything would be burnt. The factory tunes vehicles so tight that even changing an induction system will cause some calibration quirks. My recommendation is to de-modifiy any newer vehicle till the owner can do a proper retune of the engine and transmission controllers. If this is not done then it is obvious in our casses, unless you re "special" the transmission will be compromised with the engine after.

Characteristics of our setup: With DOD enabled, the transmission controller will release the TCC, engine speed will momentarily flare and drop as the tcc reengages. The TCC is also on partial engagment while not on a relativley heavy cruise load, so any throttle changes will cause a momentary engine speed flare, till the converter can be repressurized. The clutch in the converter is made of a special material to handle this operation. Also the shifts are naturally soft on normal use, and are actually relativley hard at WOT, the driver really cannot feel it because the torque converter, being as loose as it is, absorbs quite a bit of the shock. If you drive one of our V6 counterparts you will know this, as the V6's have a MUCH tighter converter and you can feel the shifts in that setup.

This is not a weak transmission per say but if a retune is not done after a significant modification, it will not shift correctly. Keep in mind, these irregularites may not be noticed by the seat of the pants.

Also keep in mind, if you ruthlessly beat on ANYTHING long enough it will fail. If not the transmission in our cars then its the rear ends hopping out of an old CTS-V or a Cobra Mustang with IRS. At least we dont have any wheel hop....


I still have my 3 inch catted downpipe and my K and N Filter Charger kit, one day maybe I'll get some money and buy a tuner, then reinstall those two pieces again. 65,000 miles now, I need to start gathering parts for a tune up, plugs, wires, belt, pulleys and tensioner, coolant, bar's leak, waterpump, thermostat with gasket, radiator and heater hoses, transmission filter and fluid. And maybe if I can get into the fuel tank, I'll change the fuel filter as well... if it is even replacable.

hexxLS4

iTrader: (1)

Nacho...you're not confusing this with DSP are you? Is just a normal turn or are you blazing around the turn?

1CL3ANSUP3RSPORT

iTrader: (23)

Sorry maybe a dumb question,but what is DSP?And can you explain thanks

Vectus

iTrader: (1)

OP Here with my update.

The dealership replaced mine with a new transmission, no hassles. They just did it. I was amazed. Not trading in my car, due to recent events. Any money i had for the trade in went towards a medical emergency i had. Considering that i didnt have to pay for a new tran. i'll keep the car and send the tran over to the guys at TEP. not anytime soon, but eventually.

nmp0098

DSP = differential score protection. When one wheel is slipping a lot more than the other, the differential is doing a lot of work. DSP cuts engine power to protect the differential gears from scoring. It can happen in a straight line if traction control is off, but it's more likely to happen when turning because the differential is already working and the inside tire becomes unloaded, allowing it to slip more than the outside tire when accelerating in the turn. Personally, I like to straighten the wheel before accelerating hard for that very reason.

@ Count of Monte Carlo, I like the way you spelled that out. There's manufacturing variability and our engines produce enough power stock that it doesn't take a lot more torque to push the limits of the stock transmission, but a CAI and downpipe leading to a failure at anything less than 100k always seemed odd to me. The 3800 guys know that much above 300HP you are asking for trouble if you drive it hard, but most of them have transmissions that have already seen at least 100k and generally the failures happen after 130k-ish (from what I've read anyway). There are plenty of GTPs running fine at 200k. Also, in stock form our ECM/TCM combo protects the transmission much more aggressively with torque management than the PCM in the GTP/GTs does.

Would you consider putting that post in a new thread along with some practical limits on the stock input shaft and stock chain? We could then ask the moderator for a sticky. The information on this page from TEP is also incredibly useful in answering common 4T65HD questions:

http://www.tripleedgeperformance.com...sion_Info.html

Everyone can also check out grandprixforums.net and look for Trannyman95's posts in the transmission sections for help. If we start sending him enough business, maybe he'll keep one of our transmission housings in stock so that we can do a cross mailing like the GTP/GT guys can.