Yes, I know who AI is, and they do have a couple N/A 500rw cars. Barley 500rw if that. One's a SR M6 355ci car and if you 'want' to bring Rick Abrare's* race car in then so be it.

1/20 LT1's that are built for 500rw will make that, garunteed so making 600rw is beyond farfetched.

AI has good marketing, not only as a company itself but from the forums. You just said 1 of its cylinder heads with supporting mods will make 600+rw, do you have any conceptual idea on what it would take to do that? Especialy with a stock casting.

Tony.

 

It wasn't for comparison, it was for information. Don't get things twisted.

It was an example of what can be done by someone who knows what they are doing. Same as this LT1 408.

You are right about one thing. It takes someone who really knows what they are doing and thats why 1/20 of them don't achieve their goal.

 

Hey, just remember i didnt say any of this. i only showed what they say on their website.

I know jack about making power.

Im not really sure, but most of the cars in AI's LT1 Results page are basic stock motors, with a head and cam making almost 500 rwhp. like 430s 480, 470. Im sure it cant be that hard to do a whole rebuild from block up and hit 500 if just head and cam give around 450.

again i dont know anything, but just seems like it would be possible.

a small block chevy can make 500 rwhp right? what makes the LT1 so restricted? (told u i dont know much)

 

You guys are not so familiar with Mike Harris's Impala 3800lbs 10.5 at 125 running out of rpms on the stock computer, off the shelf Comp solid roller. Guess what heads are on it?

People fail to hit their goals because they dismiss anything that performs above average as freak and then copy popular mediocre builds instead. When someone breaks from the pack and copies the above average performing setups they generally get an above average results.

Don't hold that against the vendors, it is the community that is wrong in those cases.

I see absolutely nothing wrong with this vendor claiming 525rwhp from a 408, perfectly believable from what I have seen of other builds with "less".

Heck in another current thread a guy has a 470rwhp at 6100rpms 396 hydraulic roller. A solid roller, 900rpms more, aftermarket casting heads, single plane, that can all add a LOT of additional power.

Stop and look at the big picture of what SOME accomplish and the 525rwhp would be above average but well within what you should see as feasible.

 

I agree with 96, Heck Tony and I believe Outlaw Tony have both crested the 500 mark. I sponsor Tony Shepard and we have made in the 520-530 RWHP mark on a 396 so why not on a 408? People talk about power adders and so on. The only problem might be streetability on a straight n/a motor. Mine, 383 made 648 RWHP but this was with a supercharger, n/a it only made around 380..Good machine work, good flowing heads, properly sized cam, compression ect and I see those numbers with no problems..

 

Unless I missed it I did not read where he said 500rw sae was either easy or cheap. I will however point out that provided one has the budget for the labor/expertise/components that have been there, it is easy.

We are only talking about 570-600hp or less than 1.5hp/cid. In our experience, most of the guys who successfully manage 500-600rwhp NA with an LT are older, more experienced, and have more of a budget than most. Surely, most understand that many of these people don't care to participate in online discussions.

Regardless of displacement, it'll only manage whatever the top-end will support. That these guys are taking the time to put together a package for the LT crowd should be commended.

 

Absolutely right, however to claim this and then brag about it being secret is just plain nonsense. If a vendor can build a 500rwhp LT1 then by all means show some sort of data to back up the claim.

 

It's not a matter of being a secret. AI hit the nail on the head. Most of the guys with the means to build an engine like this do not post, or keep graphs and charts to show off their power.

They race the car, make money racing the car and absolutely do not give away secrets.

I presented a short block and gave an example of the power that can be seen with a proper top end on it.

There are tricks to building a short block to extract more power from it. Those are builders secrets, some will tell you what they are some will not.
Thats what separates builders: experience and success and that is why you chose one over another. SO you need to respect that a builder is sought after due to their success and that success is due to their experience and that is what you are paying for.

In the case of my builder his full race prep to a short block is worth about 30-40hp over a standard build. He claims that because that is what he sees when comparing apple to apples. No there isn't a graph or chart to show you.

Best thing you can do is a search on HKE. That might alleviate some of your doubt.

 

I will grudge race your 408 car

 

No what I need to do is see results before I plunk a dime down. This power of suggestion crap is ridiculous. You want to build an engine and publically make these claims as a vendor then let's see some results of your claims instead of telling me I need to go out of my way to research whether or not you're worth my money. You are providing a service for my money. That should not require me going out of my way trying to find out how legitimate your claims are. Your typing about "experience and success" is not enough information.
I don't get these new fangled advertising schemes...
"We can build big power, but you will have to go out of your way and obtain a secret decoder ring to find out we are telling the truth!"
Lame...

 

Maybe I'm being heard wrong here or just not being open enough. I am talking 500rw+ on a street motor, something that the average LT1 crowd would be purchasing. You sure as heck aren't going to be selling any "408's" to Jimmy CrackCorn, the senior in HS with a sweeett 95 Z28.

But, Blanco, for you to show claims of making this power and try to advertise a product, well you better have some damn results for us.

 

So now vendors should only offer what the "average" LT1 owner can buy?

If I had 400rwhp when I was a senior in HS I guarantee I would not be here now. If I had 500rwhp then I would have probably managed to kill myself within view of the driveway.

 

Did I ever say it was cheap? Not anywhere in this thread at all so I'm not sure where your going with your jimmy crack corn comment but what ever.

Getting 500+ out of a LT1 isn't cheap and isn't for the avg high school student or car enthusiast.

You have to want to get that kind of power from the platform and be able to afford the build.

It's obviously a lot easier to get that kind of power from an LS engine .. So again I say this is a special engine.

I presented a short block LT1 408 and stated what HKE has seen from it.

AI has a website showing what they do with their combinations and you doubt them as well.

We're looking for the graph but you have to understand proving something to you Tony is not his concern. HKE's reputation has never been questioned and if he says it can be done .. it can be done because he's done it. Can't stress it enough this engine is not for everyone.

It was spec'd per a customer request and I decided to share it. I'm not going to argue with nay sayers.

 

I agree that he should have a dyno chart or at least a time slip from the guy that purchased the first lt1 they made that had 525rwhp. That would increase the sale of their lt1 for sure.

While i know a lot of people in the world lie, i do think one thing to consider is that the only reason he even post this was because he had built one and it proved to run over 500 rwhp. then he got another request for the same results. he thought hey, maybe if i start spreading the word that we are able to put this much power into an lt1, we might have a few more buyers.

He had an engine that resulted the advertised power. no he has no proof for us, but after getting the end product that is why he decided to advertise it. sure he could be lying, but just remember he is a sponsor here and i thought that counted for something?

 

lol at the nay sayers.

 

David Vizard, Smokey Unick, Ron Hutter, John Lingenfelter, my brother-in-law... These are the kind of people I would put any sort of blind faith into if they were to state a claim with no hard facts. Anyone else then proof is necessary. Not saying you have not done this or you don't have proof, but who are you?

 

Well that is a question for HKE

Maybe you should do a little search and call around for yourself to find out who he is or what his reputation is. His engines sell themselves, I just provide a way to get one

 

See I am bein misinterpreted. The first half of this thread was about normal cars making big power, or at least I though so and thats why I shunned on the 408 idea.

Obviously high end engine builders dont offer run of the mill 'normal' products, I realize this. But lets not confuse how compicated making solid power in an LT1 is, hence this sweet engine thread.

Where did I doubt HKE? As you would say "dont get it twisted" bud.

Proving somethign to me? How about your potential customers? Na, dont worry about it, you do well enough with MSD spark plug wires.




How many LT1s does HKE build in a year?

 

Then it is not "our" engine. It is HKE's. Thanks for clearing that up. Still would like some factual info on it, however me having to go look for it is not in my best interest. You would think if you want to incorporate the "our" with this engine you would be more than happy to supply info instead of telling people to look it up for themselves.

 

I suggest that you do some research to satisfy yourself, or not. Its your call. Most other people who are serious about an engine call me if they do not know who HKE and are interested or pm me and ask. Then they do themselves a favor and search and see if what I said is true. Or they have already done the research to find out who HKE is and want an engine. A smart person will reserach on his own anyway.

You have already stated that you only believe a limited few "blindly" so why would In expect you to believe what I tell you about HKE? It's better for you to use your own eyes and ears so there is no doubt in your findings. I can guaranty you will have doubt in what ever I say are his qualifications so I will not bother. I don't have enough time in the day to deal with people like you and it's not fair to my customers so I do what I can do.

I have answered every pm and question. Yes we and our is the correct term for this short-block. He is the builder who builds them, you see it in my signature. I gave him the application I wanted it built for and he did what I asked him to do.

We work hand in hand to produce my engines. This is the way it works for 90% of the sponsors on this board who sell engines. Maybe you are unaware of this?

Either way best wishes, keep the rubber side down