LT1 Stroker questions
06-14-2010, 11:19 AM
#22
if you do 4" stroke you will need to run a 5.85 rod,small base cam circle if your even thinking about doing a big cam..other then that its fine..most will do a real real short fill on the block then grind..like has been said you can grind with out doing that though.
4" x 4.030 is 408ci
3.875 x 4.030 is 396
3.8 x 4.030 is 388
3.75 x 4.030 is 383 as we all know lol
4" x 4.030 is 408ci
3.875 x 4.030 is 396
3.8 x 4.030 is 388
3.75 x 4.030 is 383 as we all know lol
06-14-2010, 04:31 PM
#23
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This statement couldn't be more false. I know for a fact that at least 3 have been built with everyday GM LT1 blocks, NO filling or half fills, all with 4.00" cranks, and none of them hit water. It all depends on the machinist, how much time they want to take, and how much they pay attention to details. That's what I was told when I asked how it was done without hitting water.
P.S. Something to think about.....if 33 cubic is so much much better than a 350, how much better would 59 cubic inches be? (This will probably open a can of worms!
)
P.S. Something to think about.....if 33 cubic is so much much better than a 350, how much better would 59 cubic inches be? (This will probably open a can of worms!
)
06-14-2010, 05:22 PM
#24
theres nothing wrong with the 5.85 rod..i know a good amount of guys running them and they are low 5 sec 1/8th cars.
the 5.85 rod is also a good idea to use if your going with a 3.875 crank..remember alot of builders now go by this..pick the stroke you want to run,pick the pistons with the best ring stack for your app and then order the rod that works..
the 5.85 rod is also a good idea to use if your going with a 3.875 crank..remember alot of builders now go by this..pick the stroke you want to run,pick the pistons with the best ring stack for your app and then order the rod that works..
06-14-2010, 06:08 PM
#25
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imo the money you'll spend @ the machine shop on a 408 is not worth it over a 383, especially when most builds don't even max out a 383's potential, not to mention how short of a rod you'll have to run. I think allot of people who build 408's are impala guys who call it a 409 for the nostalgia.
So lets ask ourselves, what's the point of even stroking an engine? One is for pure trash talk or bragging rights if you ask me. Another would be to get to "x" amount of horsepower but keeping it in a lower rpm range, which in turn generally means more torque in the lower rpm's. (After all, horsepower is nothing more than a byproduct of torque.) So in turn, if a 383 will drop the rpm range down x amount over a 383, a 408 should drop it down that much more, making a more aggressive cam more streetable, all things being equal.
I guess what I am saying is, granted more money will be put into a combo based around the 408, but it is all in what the OP's end goals are and how much he wants to spend getting there. Personally, if I had the extra cash, you could bet ur sweet *** I would have one in my car!
DISCLAIMER *** I realize that I did not get very technical and there are a whole **** load of "what if's" or exceptions. My statements were fairly general and that is how they should be interpreted.
06-14-2010, 06:21 PM
#26
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I understand where you are coming from on the money position, but the "max out the 383's potential" thing has me a little confused. How many engines do you know of on these message boards are built within their full potential, let alone for a sole purpose? Very few. Even then, most of the strokers out there are barely outperforming the 350's and 355's on the track.
So lets ask ourselves, what's the point of even stroking an engine? One is for pure trash talk or bragging rights if you ask me. Another would be to get to "x" amount of horsepower but keeping it in a lower rpm range, which in turn generally means more torque in the lower rpm's. (After all, horsepower is nothing more than a byproduct of torque.) So in turn, if a 383 will drop the rpm range down x amount over a 383, a 408 should drop it down that much more, making a more aggressive cam more streetable, all things being equal.
I guess what I am saying is, granted more money will be put into a combo based around the 408, but it is all in what the OP's end goals are and how much he wants to spend getting there. Personally, if I had the extra cash, you could bet ur sweet *** I would have one in my car!
DISCLAIMER *** I realize that I did not get very technical and there are a whole **** load of "what if's" or exceptions. My statements were fairly general and that is how they should be interpreted.
So lets ask ourselves, what's the point of even stroking an engine? One is for pure trash talk or bragging rights if you ask me. Another would be to get to "x" amount of horsepower but keeping it in a lower rpm range, which in turn generally means more torque in the lower rpm's. (After all, horsepower is nothing more than a byproduct of torque.) So in turn, if a 383 will drop the rpm range down x amount over a 383, a 408 should drop it down that much more, making a more aggressive cam more streetable, all things being equal.
I guess what I am saying is, granted more money will be put into a combo based around the 408, but it is all in what the OP's end goals are and how much he wants to spend getting there. Personally, if I had the extra cash, you could bet ur sweet *** I would have one in my car!
DISCLAIMER *** I realize that I did not get very technical and there are a whole **** load of "what if's" or exceptions. My statements were fairly general and that is how they should be interpreted.
06-15-2010, 05:07 AM
#27
^ 383 is a 4.030 bore,408 is 4.030 bore so tell me how you would need a new block for one and not the other??
also they cost about the same..block needs to be clearanced for 383 just the same as it would need to be with a 408..all it is,is about another 10 mins worth of grinding on a block.
eagle makes 5.85 rods just like 5.7s and 5.0 or 6.125 or 6.20s.
pistons are nothing special either.
smaller base circle cost about 50$ exta for cam
oil pans hamburgers 1098 will clear a 4 crank with steel rods, B&B 91089 will clear a 3.875 crank with steel rods.
also they cost about the same..block needs to be clearanced for 383 just the same as it would need to be with a 408..all it is,is about another 10 mins worth of grinding on a block.
eagle makes 5.85 rods just like 5.7s and 5.0 or 6.125 or 6.20s.
pistons are nothing special either.
smaller base circle cost about 50$ exta for cam
oil pans hamburgers 1098 will clear a 4 crank with steel rods, B&B 91089 will clear a 3.875 crank with steel rods.
06-15-2010, 08:55 AM
#28
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also they cost about the same..block needs to be clearanced for 383 just the same as it would need to be with a 408..all it is,is about another 10 mins worth of grinding on a block.
pistons are nothing special either.
smaller base circle cost about 50$ exta for cam
oil pans hamburgers 1098 will clear a 4 crank with steel rods, B&B 91089 will clear a 3.875 crank with steel rods.
pistons are nothing special either.
smaller base circle cost about 50$ exta for cam
oil pans hamburgers 1098 will clear a 4 crank with steel rods, B&B 91089 will clear a 3.875 crank with steel rods.
Just a few points to remember though, time is money, and so is professionalism. Any machine shop "should" be able to do the work, but I can think of a few in my area that I wouldn't trust my pushmower with. Also, it seems as if the more personal (anything not standard, routine, or typical) a machinist has to get with your engine, the more the price jumps. Another thing is, although it has been a while since I checked pricing, I can't seem to find a set of decent forged pistons with a good ring stack (for nitrous
) as readily available or as cheap as you can get for a 383. Heck , everyone and their brother makes 383 rotating assemblies now. Not to mention (no I would not do this) if you want to go even cheaper, you can get a cast 383 crank. Good luck finding a cast 4.00" SBC 1 pc rear main seal crank.And then we haven't even discussed the top end yet, but I'm not going to get into that right now.
Last edited by stryker1320; 06-15-2010 at 09:02 AM.
06-15-2010, 08:57 AM
#29
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Almost forgot, no need for an after market oil pan with a 383 either.
Also, to the OP, it is up to your goals and wallet, but all 3 can be done (383,396,408), but how much you want to spend is up to you. For all intents and purposes, the most practical engine, if you ask me, is the 383.
Also, to the OP, it is up to your goals and wallet, but all 3 can be done (383,396,408), but how much you want to spend is up to you. For all intents and purposes, the most practical engine, if you ask me, is the 383.
Last edited by stryker1320; 06-15-2010 at 08:53 PM.
06-15-2010, 06:08 PM
#30
a 1.22-1.24 comp hight piston will work with a 3.875 crank,could take 400-500 worth of juice in that setup.
a 1.15-1.17 comp hight piston will work with a 4.00 crank and yes thats alittle low on the ring stack side for spraying over 250 shot.
both pistons though are shelf pistons..im sure if you wanted to spray more then 250 with the 408 you could have diamond cut you some customs.
as for machinest time they charge by the hr most the time..an yes always go to a good engine builder..thats why its alway good to go to your local race tracks and ask around on who people are useing.
a 1.15-1.17 comp hight piston will work with a 4.00 crank and yes thats alittle low on the ring stack side for spraying over 250 shot.
both pistons though are shelf pistons..im sure if you wanted to spray more then 250 with the 408 you could have diamond cut you some customs.
as for machinest time they charge by the hr most the time..an yes always go to a good engine builder..thats why its alway good to go to your local race tracks and ask around on who people are useing.
08-13-2010, 08:50 AM
#32
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if you do 4" stroke you will need to run a 5.85 rod,small base cam circle if your even thinking about doing a big cam..other then that its fine..most will do a real real short fill on the block then grind..like has been said you can grind with out doing that though.
4" x 4.030 is 408ci
3.875 x 4.030 is 396
3.8 x 4.030 is 388
3.75 x 4.030 is 383 as we all know lol
4" x 4.030 is 408ci
3.875 x 4.030 is 396
3.8 x 4.030 is 388
3.75 x 4.030 is 383 as we all know lol
08-13-2010, 07:43 PM
#33
08-13-2010, 08:41 PM
#34
btw check out probe industries...ie probe pistons... 1.175 compression height piston that will fit in a stock deck block with a 4" crank and 5.85 rod....pt#12347.....meant for a ford (ehh.) 347 but with a .927" pin. Relatively cheap last I looked, around $500 for the set, and they're off the shelf. And FWIW Eagle sells a Forged 4" 1 pc. rear main crank for about $700.....so throw in you're choice of rods and you've got one hell of a rotating assembly. It'll just cost a little extra $$ to get it all balanced right but it'll hold up to anything you can throw at it!
and it costs no more than your average forged 383......
and it costs no more than your average forged 383......
