Speed density my only option with my setup?
01-25-2012, 11:12 AM
#1
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Speed density my only option with my setup? My cam from what I remember is a 234/244 (112 lsa?). Now I know I've seen people with bigger cams than mine running MAF tunes but mine is only mail order tuned as of now. So no real attention has been given to get it running right with a MAF tune. I've sent it off to two mail tuners with the same result.
First I was unable to get a closed loop AFR reading because I bought new headers and need another bung welded. But I did get an AFR reading in open loop just disconnected the original o2 and stuck the wideband o2 in place of it.
Found no vacuum leaks and replaced
MAF, MAP, and TPS.
With MAF connected
During open loop
- the idle is all over the place and dies often with the AFR jumping everywhere from 14.7:1 to as high as 19.5:1
During closed loop
-can't remember if I could get it running long enough to even get it to closed loop
With MAF disconnected and running in Speed Density
During open loop
-idles heck of alot better with AFR reading fairly steady around 13.5:1.
- I can actually drive the car but runs rich.(Probably because both tuners expected me to run MAF tune so didn't do much tuning to the SD side.)
- There is a delay if I punch it. Again maybe cause there wasn't much attention paid to the SD tune side.
During closed loop
-falls flat on its face if I try to press gas pedal.
So it runs way better in open loop speed density mode. So could my cam be at least somewhat to big to where it needs more attention than just a mail order tune to get it running right with the MAF tune. Or is speed density open loop looking like my only option?
I did just purchase a C.A.T.S. tuner with Datamaster. So if there is anything I can check on there I definantly will. Also I do plan on dynotuning it. Just reading alot about tuning and debating if I want to give it a shot of course with alot of help.
Or is there something else you think I should check besides the tune? Thanks for any help.
First I was unable to get a closed loop AFR reading because I bought new headers and need another bung welded. But I did get an AFR reading in open loop just disconnected the original o2 and stuck the wideband o2 in place of it.
Found no vacuum leaks and replaced
MAF, MAP, and TPS.
With MAF connected
During open loop
- the idle is all over the place and dies often with the AFR jumping everywhere from 14.7:1 to as high as 19.5:1
During closed loop
-can't remember if I could get it running long enough to even get it to closed loop
With MAF disconnected and running in Speed Density
During open loop
-idles heck of alot better with AFR reading fairly steady around 13.5:1.
- I can actually drive the car but runs rich.(Probably because both tuners expected me to run MAF tune so didn't do much tuning to the SD side.)
- There is a delay if I punch it. Again maybe cause there wasn't much attention paid to the SD tune side.
During closed loop
-falls flat on its face if I try to press gas pedal.
So it runs way better in open loop speed density mode. So could my cam be at least somewhat to big to where it needs more attention than just a mail order tune to get it running right with the MAF tune. Or is speed density open loop looking like my only option?
I did just purchase a C.A.T.S. tuner with Datamaster. So if there is anything I can check on there I definantly will. Also I do plan on dynotuning it. Just reading alot about tuning and debating if I want to give it a shot of course with alot of help.
Or is there something else you think I should check besides the tune? Thanks for any help.
Last edited by djm_e22; 01-25-2012 at 11:27 AM.
01-25-2012, 11:25 AM
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1. do you have a aftermarket TB?
2. have you let the mail tuner try to make adjustments to his tune?
3. is there at least a 3" straight pipe before the maf?
4. is there any work done to the heads?
2. have you let the mail tuner try to make adjustments to his tune?
3. is there at least a 3" straight pipe before the maf?
4. is there any work done to the heads?
01-25-2012, 11:35 AM
#3
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2. Not yet
3. I think I just got my air filter attached directly onto my MAF sensor. Ill check.
4. LE3 heads.
Last edited by djm_e22; 01-25-2012 at 08:50 PM.
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01-25-2012, 10:39 PM
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My cam from what I remember is a 234/244 (112 lsa?). Now I know I've seen people with bigger cams than mine running MAF tunes but mine is only mail order tuned as of now. So no real attention has been given to get it running right with a MAF tune. I've sent it off to two mail tuners with the same result.
First I was unable to get a closed loop AFR reading because I bought new headers and need another bung welded. But I did get an AFR reading in open loop just disconnected the original o2 and stuck the wideband o2 in place of it.
Found no vacuum leaks and replaced
MAF, MAP, and TPS.
With MAF connected
During open loop
- the idle is all over the place and dies often with the AFR jumping everywhere from 14.7:1 to as high as 19.5:1
During closed loop
-can't remember if I could get it running long enough to even get it to closed loop
With MAF disconnected and running in Speed Density
During open loop
-idles heck of alot better with AFR reading fairly steady around 13.5:1.
- I can actually drive the car but runs rich.(Probably because both tuners expected me to run MAF tune so didn't do much tuning to the SD side.)
- There is a delay if I punch it. Again maybe cause there wasn't much attention paid to the SD tune side.
During closed loop
-falls flat on its face if I try to press gas pedal.
So it runs way better in open loop speed density mode. So could my cam be at least somewhat to big to where it needs more attention than just a mail order tune to get it running right with the MAF tune. Or is speed density open loop looking like my only option?
I did just purchase a C.A.T.S. tuner with Datamaster. So if there is anything I can check on there I definantly will. Also I do plan on dynotuning it. Just reading alot about tuning and debating if I want to give it a shot of course with alot of help.
Or is there something else you think I should check besides the tune? Thanks for any help.
First I was unable to get a closed loop AFR reading because I bought new headers and need another bung welded. But I did get an AFR reading in open loop just disconnected the original o2 and stuck the wideband o2 in place of it.
Found no vacuum leaks and replaced
MAF, MAP, and TPS.
With MAF connected
During open loop
- the idle is all over the place and dies often with the AFR jumping everywhere from 14.7:1 to as high as 19.5:1
During closed loop
-can't remember if I could get it running long enough to even get it to closed loop
With MAF disconnected and running in Speed Density
During open loop
-idles heck of alot better with AFR reading fairly steady around 13.5:1.
- I can actually drive the car but runs rich.(Probably because both tuners expected me to run MAF tune so didn't do much tuning to the SD side.)
- There is a delay if I punch it. Again maybe cause there wasn't much attention paid to the SD tune side.
During closed loop
-falls flat on its face if I try to press gas pedal.
So it runs way better in open loop speed density mode. So could my cam be at least somewhat to big to where it needs more attention than just a mail order tune to get it running right with the MAF tune. Or is speed density open loop looking like my only option?
I did just purchase a C.A.T.S. tuner with Datamaster. So if there is anything I can check on there I definantly will. Also I do plan on dynotuning it. Just reading alot about tuning and debating if I want to give it a shot of course with alot of help.
Or is there something else you think I should check besides the tune? Thanks for any help.
01-25-2012, 10:53 PM
#10
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Sounds like you need to have an experienced tuner take a look at what youve got an get the thing dyno/street tuned. Or do some data logging and post it and im sure someone will take a look at it.
01-25-2012, 10:58 PM
#11
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01-25-2012, 11:44 PM
#12
On my setup I went with a speed density open loop tune. The o2's are non functional and the MAF and knock sensors are deleted. Yes is it cold nature'd but the car runs much better that way. Does it get worse mileage? Yes but it runs a ton better. And it is much easier to change tunes not worrying about o2 readings. It's a bitch setting up the VE tables but I think it is worth the trouble. It all depends on what you want out of the car. Just my opinion!!! And mine is on a 93 octane tune.
01-26-2012, 12:12 AM
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01-26-2012, 12:59 AM
#15
With SD don't you have to adjust for different weather conditions? Must be one heck of a learning experience.
