Shifting problem persists; unable to shift quickly.. HELP!!
10-27-2008, 09:00 AM
#1
Shifting problem persists; unable to shift quickly.. HELP!! Problem: Shifting quickly is IMPOSSIBLE in my car. If you press the clutch in and try to shift into any gear you either get a "block" for about a split second before it goes into gear. If you don't get the "block" you hear a high pitch/clunk sound coming from underneath the shifter or somewhere there. They both let you engage the gears, but its not smooth or safe sounding.
Here is the catch though, it only happens during the first time you shift into gear with the clutch down... to put it easier:
1) press clutch
2) Engage into gear quickly and get the block
3) DO NOT RELEASE CLUTCH
4) Go into any other gear and its completely smooth, no matter how many times you shift. It will be like a knife slicing through butter going into gears.
5) release clutch
6) press clutch down again and process repeats
If you shift slowly and let the gear "suck" the shifter in and just ease it into gear (2-3 seconds), the gear will engage with no apparent sound, but the block is still there, but after a bit the shifter will just slide into the gear.
Attempts to fix problem:
1) New transmission fluid
2) New GM master
3) Drill mod
4) New Hydraulic fluid
Edit: I have also done the clutch slipping tests.
Revving to 5-6k at a stop with clutch down does not move my car at all.
Hitting the throttle at around 20mph in 4th has a steady increase of rpm/mph, not a wide variation between them.
Here is the catch though, it only happens during the first time you shift into gear with the clutch down... to put it easier:
1) press clutch
2) Engage into gear quickly and get the block
3) DO NOT RELEASE CLUTCH
4) Go into any other gear and its completely smooth, no matter how many times you shift. It will be like a knife slicing through butter going into gears.
5) release clutch
6) press clutch down again and process repeats
If you shift slowly and let the gear "suck" the shifter in and just ease it into gear (2-3 seconds), the gear will engage with no apparent sound, but the block is still there, but after a bit the shifter will just slide into the gear.
Attempts to fix problem:
1) New transmission fluid
2) New GM master
3) Drill mod
4) New Hydraulic fluid
Edit: I have also done the clutch slipping tests.
Revving to 5-6k at a stop with clutch down does not move my car at all.
Hitting the throttle at around 20mph in 4th has a steady increase of rpm/mph, not a wide variation between them.
Last edited by Aetos; 10-27-2008 at 10:08 AM.
10-27-2008, 07:33 PM
#4
Can that really be normal? I can't shift quick enough to make my tires chirp or squeal with the current problem. I can try, but I never have because of the grinding noise upon quick shifting. I'm worried that I'm damaging something very expensive and hard to change.
10-27-2008, 08:48 PM
#7
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It could be just the shifter, the stock ones are known to not be very smooth. My last camaro had that issue but never figured out what it was. My camaro now shifts nice, but still has a grab feeling.
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10-27-2008, 09:26 PM
#9
Sounds like hydraulics, if there is the smallest amount of air stuck in the system, it will act like that on the quick shift, but if delayed will eventually allow normal shifting like butter.
Invest in a mityvac and see how it is after using that on the system. Other symptoms (which you may be afraid to encounter) would also be clutch sticking at high rpm, or a quick shift at WOT will act like a wall is there.
Invest in a mityvac and see how it is after using that on the system. Other symptoms (which you may be afraid to encounter) would also be clutch sticking at high rpm, or a quick shift at WOT will act like a wall is there.
10-27-2008, 09:48 PM
#10
Sounds like hydraulics, if there is the smallest amount of air stuck in the system, it will act like that on the quick shift, but if delayed will eventually allow normal shifting like butter.
Invest in a mityvac and see how it is after using that on the system. Other symptoms (which you may be afraid to encounter) would also be clutch sticking at high rpm, or a quick shift at WOT will act like a wall is there.
Invest in a mityvac and see how it is after using that on the system. Other symptoms (which you may be afraid to encounter) would also be clutch sticking at high rpm, or a quick shift at WOT will act like a wall is there.
10-28-2008, 10:47 AM
#14
Once air got introduced into my slave due to an accidental pump while bleeding. I bled the **** out of it after that and supposedly all was fine. Fast forward a few months and during a WOT run in 3rd I found it sticking. I rebled, got clean fluid out, but the "air" was still trapped. I found this out while doing 4th gear pulls on a dyno when tuning my car.
Bled again, it was still sticking. Got fed up, bought a mityvac and pulled a lot of "trapped" air within the system. Significant amount. Took it for a long drive, then did a few WOT pulls to the top of 5th. Shifted like butter at redline.
I've bench bled the master and left it hanging in the garage overnight, sure enough thanks to the angle I left the system at, air worked its way up the system back into the reservoir. Once air gets in, it is a PAIN to get out. On top of that, it will disperse itself into the fluid and lower the boiling point further creating and trapping gasses from the degraded fluid at each WOT run.
I'm saying if you've exhausted all avenues with hardware, bleeding for air etc, then last point of failure is the clutch itself.
From what it sounds like either a) hole in system, air is getting in, or b) line is touching header and boiling fluid.
Bled again, it was still sticking. Got fed up, bought a mityvac and pulled a lot of "trapped" air within the system. Significant amount. Took it for a long drive, then did a few WOT pulls to the top of 5th. Shifted like butter at redline.
I've bench bled the master and left it hanging in the garage overnight, sure enough thanks to the angle I left the system at, air worked its way up the system back into the reservoir. Once air gets in, it is a PAIN to get out. On top of that, it will disperse itself into the fluid and lower the boiling point further creating and trapping gasses from the degraded fluid at each WOT run.
I'm saying if you've exhausted all avenues with hardware, bleeding for air etc, then last point of failure is the clutch itself.
From what it sounds like either a) hole in system, air is getting in, or b) line is touching header and boiling fluid.
10-28-2008, 05:13 PM
#15
Update: Took the car to a mechanic I know so he can drive it around a bit and try to tell me the problem. He came to the conclusion thats its probably one of three things; air in the slave(yay SladeX!!), the slave itself may be going bad, or the pressure plate may be bad. He said the sound that emits during shifting is the clutch.
I just ordered a mity vac to try and bleed it out. If that doesn't work, I have a brand new slave sitting in my hatch(reluctant to drop the tranny). If that doesn't work either, I guess Im gonna be ordering the LS7 clutch.
I just ordered a mity vac to try and bleed it out. If that doesn't work, I have a brand new slave sitting in my hatch(reluctant to drop the tranny). If that doesn't work either, I guess Im gonna be ordering the LS7 clutch.
10-29-2008, 08:07 PM
#16
Teching In
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t56 sounds to me like you either have worn sencros or dameged key ways or even blocker rings . i dont think you have air in your system. only because i had almost the same problem and i bled my for hours and the same problem continued. i took mine apart and replaced the blocker rings , sencros, key ways. and had know more problems. note it is good practice if you take the tranny apart and rebuild it to give it new hydraulics....
10-29-2008, 08:52 PM
#17
sounds to me like you either have worn sencros or dameged key ways or even blocker rings . i dont think you have air in your system. only because i had almost the same problem and i bled my for hours and the same problem continued. i took mine apart and replaced the blocker rings , sencros, key ways. and had know more problems. note it is good practice if you take the tranny apart and rebuild it to give it new hydraulics....
I have 47k miles and it happens in all gears, at all speeds, even at idle... how would this be something internal unless I got like the most messed up tranny in an fbody. The mechanic himself told me its either the slave or a clutch.
10-29-2008, 09:46 PM
#18
usually , 1 gear = specific internal problem, 2 gears (related), ie 1-2 or 3-4 or 5-6 still a specific problem, but all gears usually point to clutch issues, in particular the hydraulics