"MAC"

iTrader: (1)

If you take care of your transmission it should last in the 6 figure range auto or M6 doesn't matter

JC316

iTrader: (1)

Have had two 100+k M6 cars and they were both fine. Sounds to me like the dealer is trying to push the A4 cars because they are craptons easier to find. Bottom line to me, the auto might be faster, but the 6 speed is more fun.

License2Ill

iTrader: (1)

Article rings true. No bullchit. Even more so for t56s running ls1 hydros. Ive had 2 t56s with lt1 hydros and they both needed rebuilds. I redid them both successfully..and yes properly driven they can last longer. Both did make it past 100k. But the same cant be said of the ls1s "opti "..which is what the article in my opinion takes aim at. With the ls clutch hydros overheating and slave location being such a turd...im sure it leads to bad synchros all over the place.

Ive dealt w these guys in the past theyve always been truthful imo..and very knowledgeable.

I dont think its abt car sales at all. I think they may try to explain why a rebuild costs so much...and if u want less headaches and fast go auto. Or liberty dog gear the chit out of your ls1 t56 becuz that pos internal slave is going to fail at any random moment.

Ive got an ls swap coming up and the scores of internet chit pilings about the slave and master fails is undeniable. I even want to go full manual than to run that slave. Ive seen many threads where the pos tick master didmt cure chiiiiiiiiiiiiiiittttttt.......that being said I dont think I can go auto. Take the article for what its worth. The ugly TRUTH.

BALLSS

My $02 is the article's author is just stating their experience with buying/selling 16-20 year old M6 cars vs auto and finding the majority of the M6 cars have wear/problems with the T56. Not surprising as the bulk of M6 cars are not your grandmother gently driving down to the corner bakery cars. F-bodys are generally sold to "enthusiasts" who will drive them aggressively...and sometime like a stupid a hole just like any other performance orientated car.

servicing a T56 for worn parts is just like servicing a auto. They both "wear" and cost of repair are not to far apart.

back in 05 I did a 4L60-T56 swap and decided then that buying a "used" tranny from a donor car had it's risks and would most likely require minimally an inspection by qualified shop and most likely some part replacement. I decided to buy a "new" T56 from D&D and had them put in the common upgrades (steel 3-4 shift fork, billet keys) and the cost shipped to my door (MI to CA) was $2150...just a few $ more than a "built" 4L60E from a reputable shop at that time. Unfortunately now you can't even get a "new" 94-97 LT1 T56

Bottom line, and ask any car guy, a "stick" car of any year/model is more desired than a auto hands down. Any auction you find...= car with one being the stick...the stick car almost always goes for more $.

Nothing wrong with auto cars and many prefer them over sticks. Clearly it is a personal choice.

Rob WS6

iTrader: (16)

While overall the main points of the article are true, the BS about no one wanting to rebuild them is laughable. Special tools that no one has?! If a transmission guy doesn't have a snap ring pliers, then I would NOT trust him to even change my oil. The T56 was the first manual box I ever tore into and I honestly enjoyed doing it. Planning on tearing it back down next year for some updated synchros.

Macs98Z

iTrader: (16)

This article is ridiculous. A 4L60E bulletproof?

How many times have you seen automatics take a crap with the 3-4 clutch pack failure after being driven hard? IMO, the 4L60E is a fine car transmission for grandma and a go-to-work driver, but not at all a transmission I'd want behind my LS1 or LT1, let alone one that is going to be raced. Why do you think so many guys go 4L80E if they want to make bigger power and drag race reliably? The stock torque rating on the 4L60E is something pathetic like 380 lb ft. The LS1 makes ~350 lb ft. Who wants a trans that as soon as you throw an exhaust and intake on the car is already maxed out?

I can't tell you how many times I've seen or heard of 4L60Es breaking. I have had 3 of them in my family, and so far two have failed and the third one is working on it right now. I hate this transmission so much that when I was looking for a truck, I almost went with a 2500 instead of a 1500 just so I didn't have to deal with the 4L60E. Racing transmission my butt. Someone else already said it, but I think the fact that T56s came standard for Vipers, Terminators, and early C6 Z06s should tell you something about the transmissions reliability.

Thanks for the laugh, though

"MAC"

iTrader: (1)

Id take the 60E over Your T56 any day of the week and all you'll see is tail lights. Auto is for drag racing manual is for fun

Firebrian

I ran across that RPM article in 2011 when I was first in the market for an LS-1 F body. I figured I stumbled across "the truth" that nearly all 6 speeds with any mileage were junk. It initially steered me towards automatics. But, since I was after a WS6/SS/Firehawk there were more 6 speeds available than automatics. After test driving several lower mileage 6 speed cars all of them felt fine to me. It seemed odd that in 2010 RPM Motorsports only ran across a single 6 speed that was "acceptable" to them. Either their standards are incredibly tough or they don't see enough lower mileage cars. In the end, I bought a 6 speed SS with 12,400 miles on it. It was easier to find a low mileage SS/WS6 speed than it was an automatic.

Fwiw I owned a '98 Z28 automatic for 8 years...bought from the orig owner with 22K miles and sold by me with 115K miles (2/3 of those highway miles). The drive train on that car operated just as smooth on the day I sold it than it did on day 1. I didn't know those cars would last to 150K miles or more. And only sold it because I figured by 125K miles "something" was going to go wrong with the drive train. I also owned a '93 Trans Am 6 speed for several years and took it to 55,000 miles. That transmission never made a peep and was silky smooth when I sold it. I guess I'm wondering where all these clunky 6 speeds reside because I've yet to test drive or own one that felt wrong. So after owning two 6 speeds and three automatics (LT1 and LS1) I've yet to run into any engine/trans issues of any kind. There's also no way I can out shift an automatic from 1st to 3rd.

chrysler kid

iTrader: (14)

Any car bought at auction is going to have problems, automatic cars are just cheaper to find spare parts for and generally aren't as abused.

I have a buddy who paid $8k for a 2000z28 with 180k miles on it and the t56. It had dead pedal issues on the 2-3 shift but that was from hydraulics. No other issues.

My wife's ta had a botched clutch job done on it. Basically aamco screwed the original owner and re used the factory pressure plate flywheel and clutch. The whole car shook violently above 2500 rpms, they had convinced the original owner the transmission was blown and we swung in and bought an immaculate trans am with 56k miles for $7800. Has performed flawlessly since we did the clutch again correctly

Did my t56 swap in the camaro and as some one else posted it was not worth the risk of buying a used t56. I bought a built t56 from TDP and was done with it no worries.

In the future I believe the biggest problem will be finding shops who know anything about working on manual transmission cars. Literally all vehicles sold in america now are automatic except sports models.

Macs98Z

iTrader: (16)

Never said anything about one being faster than the other. I was discussing reliability when power is increased.

But yes, you would probably beat me in your auto. I've had both in my car, and much prefer my T56.

Wheelman916

What is a Tick Master?

adamantium

iTrader: (3)

My old firebird with 112k 2 owners before me shifted like butter. It felt smoother after i would power shift it lmao. Alot of people should be driving a stick, most guys ive seen with these cars can't drive. Autos are for women who can't drive.

Roidz24

Tick performance master cylinder

Sales@Tick

iTrader: (3)

lol!!

"MAC"

iTrader: (1)

T56 can hold more power when BUILT RIGHT i will say that and are more fun to drive until your stuck in bumper to bumper traffic

Macs98Z

iTrader: (16)

Sorry, but the T56 can handle more power stock too. The problem with a T56 is there's a lot more variability in driver use and abuse than with an auto. You will inevitably get a few guys saying they killed a stock T56 with bolt ons and a cam, but that is the exception rather than the rule. I would be very suspicious of the history of the trans--missing shifts, grinding gears, powershifting, etc. You can't abuse an auto like that.

A properly built 4L60E can handle some power, but there are very specific design modifications that need to be done beyond installing good parts. The stock 4L60E design is just a weak design. No way around it. Ask anyone who builds them successfully. Before I went M6, I had my 4L60E in my car built by a guy who used to work at FLT, so I've been down the built 4L60E route. I know what they're capable of, but that's in someones hands who knows what they are doing and can modify the stock design. There's a reason guys on here will recommend shops like FLT and RPM and not the transmission guy in your hometown. It takes someone with experience to build a 60E right. Now my T56 I built myself in my basement before I did my swap. I don't know of many guys that did that with their 4L60E and saw it last very long.

gnx7

iTrader: (28)

That's a stupid article.

Also a complete rebuild kit for a T56 with new synchros, bearings, carbon blocker rings, billet keys, bronze fork pads, steel 3/4 shift fork is about $650.
They are pretty reasonable to rebuild and gears are under $200/each. People just abuse them and wear out gears plus drive them well beyond when they should have been serviced/rebuilt.

A 10-15 year old trans with 100K miles+ that has been beat on will need some form of rebuild to work like new.

Look at the cost of any European performance transmission and yours head will explode.

99z28monster

iTrader: (3)

What sort of MPG are you getting on the highway at 5mpg over an auto? By the way my best average is 29mpg on an auto car.

chrysler kid

iTrader: (14)

I gained about 4mpg city once I went t56 from my stalled auto.

VincesSS

iTrader: (1)

I liked the part where they said the 4l60e is bulletproof.