Manual Transmission T56 | T5 | MN12 | Clutches | Hydraulics | Shifters

Can't shift for SHIT after heads/cam install!

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Old 09-10-2006, 09:46 PM
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Originally Posted by slimcracka
maybe the trans is gettin tired?
No way is it the trans. It was JUST rebuilt and I haven't been grinding gears, or powershifted it a single time since then, this was in March of this year. Anyhow, like I have said, this JUST started after the heads/cam install. Driving the car the VERY day that I tore it apart it was awesome! I do the install, drive it easy to get it tuned, and on the way home I try to hammer it and it's like I described. It has to be do to the power increase. I have contacted Byunspeed, which is where I got it from, and I am hoping between them and TEXtralia themselves, we can get this resloved. This clutch is suppose to be the ****, and if it can't perform with 445rwhp, it's not "the ****", but ****

And I was sooo happy with this clutch up until now
Old 09-10-2006, 09:51 PM
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Originally Posted by tim99ws6
Get motor mounts and a trans mount if you don't already have them Brian.

Best of luck man, I hope you get it figured out man. I wanna know what it runs at the track!
I plan on getting some mounts sometime, but I don't think it's the issue right now as much as I thought it was with the clutch acting like it is.

As soon as I get this resolved you can bet I'll be airing it out down the 1320
Old 09-10-2006, 10:31 PM
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How old is your clutch master cylinder? Maybe under extreme conditions while shifting at high RPMS fluid is bypassing the primary seal in clutch master cylinder. Also the synchros in the transmission could be going bad. Any possibility that something in the shifter could be bent. Also how old is the slave cylcinder. That is the one inside the bell housing. When they get old they can stick while shifting.
Old 09-10-2006, 10:44 PM
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Originally Posted by bigdcustoms
How old is your clutch master cylinder? Maybe under extreme conditions while shifting at high RPMS fluid is bypassing the primary seal in clutch master cylinder. Also the synchros in the transmission could be going bad. Any possibility that something in the shifter could be bent. Also how old is the slave cylcinder. That is the one inside the bell housing. When they get old they can stick while shifting.
It is the original master cylinder. The car has 43k on it.

I already commented that it couldn't be the tranny cause it is fresh and isn't displaying any problems.

There isn't anything wrong with the shifter either.

The slave cylinder was replaced with the clutch and fresh tranny.

About the MC, hmmm, wouldn't it leak though if it was doing as you described? The master and high rpms shouldn't matter as far as it performing. All it does is move the fluid to release the pressure plate from the flywheel. It shouldn't have anymore pressure on it at high rpm than it does at low-mid rpm.

And what are the odds of it going from great to **** RIGHT after I added the heads/cam???? I am talking turn the key off and it's fine, start it up a few days later and try it out and it sucks.
Old 09-10-2006, 11:37 PM
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Try power shifting. I cant really do speed shifting, it seems that moving three of my extremities at the same time is weird, and I never get nice shifts, but I am one of the best power shifters around here haha, a person commented on how it sounded like a sport bike ripping gears Friday night at the strip... I have stock motor mounts and a poly trans mount, but I'm definitely not making near the power you are, so maybe my thoughts are illrelivant. But seriously go try power shifting. As long as you have a shifter with stops on it, and your not a idiot and go 1-2-1 ( use proper hand positioning ) you really have nothing to lose.
Old 09-11-2006, 12:39 AM
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Originally Posted by Sgt. Spuds
Try power shifting. I cant really do speed shifting, it seems that moving three of my extremities at the same time is weird, and I never get nice shifts, but I am one of the best power shifters around here haha, a person commented on how it sounded like a sport bike ripping gears Friday night at the strip... I have stock motor mounts and a poly trans mount, but I'm definitely not making near the power you are, so maybe my thoughts are illrelivant. But seriously go try power shifting. As long as you have a shifter with stops on it, and your not a idiot and go 1-2-1 ( use proper hand positioning ) you really have nothing to lose.
He said he cannot even shift into 3rd without giving it a little delay..... Why would he be able to power shift it?

I bet it has something to do with your hydrolics. If the clutch isnt slipping than that shouldnt be a problem. I was having the same exact problems you are describing with my stock clutch. When I pulled everything out the throwout bearing was trashed. I replaced the slave, master, pilot bearing, and throwout bearing and that seemed to solve my problems.
Old 09-11-2006, 12:45 AM
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Originally Posted by Sgt. Spuds
Try power shifting. I cant really do speed shifting, it seems that moving three of my extremities at the same time is weird, and I never get nice shifts, but I am one of the best power shifters around here haha, a person commented on how it sounded like a sport bike ripping gears Friday night at the strip... I have stock motor mounts and a poly trans mount, but I'm definitely not making near the power you are, so maybe my thoughts are illrelivant. But seriously go try power shifting. As long as you have a shifter with stops on it, and your not a idiot and go 1-2-1 ( use proper hand positioning ) you really have nothing to lose.
Not to be rude but im sure that wont help him. Sounds more like the clutch not disengaging under heavy acceleration and or heat. Like when my stock clutch went out.
Old 09-11-2006, 01:04 AM
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when you are trying to put it into gear (3rd) when it finally lets you in do you hear/feel a chop or like a "tap against the shifter" sound.

Originally Posted by BriancWS6
As far as the "chopping" I still don't understand what your getting at, but it shifts fine at normal or even mild acceleration, but when the revs are up, forget it.
Old 09-11-2006, 04:11 AM
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Originally Posted by Sgt. Spuds
but I am one of the best power shifters around here haha
That is sooooo in your head.
Old 09-11-2006, 12:22 PM
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Sounds similar to my car. After h&c swap all of the sudden I started getting the 'pedal sticking to the floor' epidemic. Never did it before, and for a week or 2 after the swap it was ok then went to hell. Of course I have a 98 master without the drill mod, but a 02 slave and clutch. It sounds like you problems are similar but not near as bad. After wot in 1-2 gears, I can't get it to go in to 3rd+ without letting off and pumping the clutch a bit. Got all new hydraulics and clutch waiting to go in though, hope it gets straight.
Old 09-11-2006, 03:57 PM
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im thinking its the hydraulics as well, or improper installation.

im worried about that master with 43K, nonfunctioning hydraulics will just eat away at you driveline/drivetrain until everything is fucked.

you said clutch/PP/FW is new textralia is new so that rules that out
tranny rebuilt so that rules that out

slave was replaced when clutch went it, so those are good. drill mod done.

dude, if you installed everything correctly, its gotta be the MC, 43K miles is alot, i got a new MC and slave when i got my trans rebuilt. it was recommended procedure through t56reuilds.
Old 09-11-2006, 04:01 PM
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Originally Posted by Sgt. Spuds
Try power shifting. I cant really do speed shifting, it seems that moving three of my extremities at the same time is weird, and I never get nice shifts, but I am one of the best power shifters around here haha, a person commented on how it sounded like a sport bike ripping gears Friday night at the strip... I have stock motor mounts and a poly trans mount, but I'm definitely not making near the power you are, so maybe my thoughts are illrelivant. But seriously go try power shifting. As long as you have a shifter with stops on it, and your not a idiot and go 1-2-1 ( use proper hand positioning ) you really have nothing to lose.
There is no way in hell I will even remotely consider a powershift in the cars current state. If you hadn't been on here for so long I would think you were someone trying to pull a joke on me. That would completely TRASH my tranny and in a hurry. To powershift you HAVE to have everything in the entire clutch system in tip top perfect working order or you will demolish your syncros.
Old 09-11-2006, 04:04 PM
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My car did this as well. I hate the feeling of getting ready to be thrown back in your seat when all of a sudden you miss a shift and your body wants to fly through the windshield! .... I never did figure it out but my best guess would be that with all that accerleration maybe the fluid is getting pushed back against the cylinder allowing air to enter? OR....the syncros aren't designed for higher RPMS? >> I know some will arguee with this but i've seen it alot not just in my car. It's whenever you take it all the way up to redline...
Old 09-11-2006, 04:04 PM
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Originally Posted by @nthony
when you are trying to put it into gear (3rd) when it finally lets you in do you hear/feel a chop or like a "tap against the shifter" sound.
No, it's like there is someone holding the shifter and not letting me put it into gear. I keep firm pressure, not forcing it, and it goes in like normal after the delay. No grinding, nothing. And when this occurs I always notice a change in pedal feel and travel.
Old 09-11-2006, 04:07 PM
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Originally Posted by jdoyle
im thinking its the hydraulics as well, or improper installation.

im worried about that master with 43K, nonfunctioning hydraulics will just eat away at you driveline/drivetrain until everything is fucked.

you said clutch/PP/FW is new textralia is new so that rules that out
tranny rebuilt so that rules that out

slave was replaced when clutch went it, so those are good. drill mod done.

dude, if you installed everything correctly, its gotta be the MC, 43K miles is alot, i got a new MC and slave when i got my trans rebuilt. it was recommended procedure through t56reuilds.
I am starting to think this is what it is as well. Everything is installed correctly though, I am positive, I did all the installs and it was flawless for about 10k.
Old 09-11-2006, 04:14 PM
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Keep us updated as to when you find the problem, man. I would hate to get locked out all the time, still happens sometimes to me, but I got 106,xxx and no drill mod. Thought a new clutch would help, but it still does it at high RPMs on ocasion in a 2-3 throw. Good luck.
Old 09-11-2006, 08:21 PM
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Originally Posted by BriancWS6
There is no way in hell I will even remotely consider a powershift in the cars current state. If you hadn't been on here for so long I would think you were someone trying to pull a joke on me. That would completely TRASH my tranny and in a hurry. To powershift you HAVE to have everything in the entire clutch system in tip top perfect working order or you will demolish your syncros.
Personally i think there is some reason to his madness... When you power shift (if you are fast enough and don't mess up) you will hit the next gear with the input shaft turning at close to the same speed it was when you exited the last gear, this requires the synchro to do less work matching the rotation speeds of the slider and the next gear. When you lift off of the throttle, the motor rpms will drop abrubtly and quite possibly bring the input shaft speed down as well. When this happens it will slow down the slider more so than the main shaft which is still being turned at the same speed through the driveline. So to sum it up, you have the next gear spinning faster than the slider which then requires the synchro to work harder to try and match up the different rotational speeds possibly making it harder to shift. It could also be that this problem is more pronounced now than before due to the higher shifting rpms and the possible fact that you might be dropping more rpms when you lift to shift than you did in the past. I know some of you will think this sounds crazy, but that's what rev matching when you are shifting is tryting to do, you try to match the rotational speed of the shift slider to the gear you are shifting into. Now I am not saying this is for sure the problem, and I am by no means a manual trans expert, but i have dabbled with them in the past and this makes some sense to me. Of course I am currently down for most likely bent valves attributed to a blown shift at the track, so what do I know.
Old 09-11-2006, 09:55 PM
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I bet it is the master cylinder. The same thing happened to me with my Mcleod master. I put a new o ring and seal in it, and it shifts perfect now.
Old 09-12-2006, 02:56 PM
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I would replace the master cyl first. if that doesn't work, id say its the clutch.
Old 09-12-2006, 05:53 PM
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I am definately going to order the new Mcleod master cylinder. Hope to have the car back on track asap. Thanks for everyones input


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