thinking about going back to Iraq with Blackwater Security, $200k for a year
05-26-2006, 03:58 PM
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Here's my two cents, take it for what it's worth coming from a guy on the ground over here. I've been in this theater for a little under two years now. In that time I've known several guys that work for BW, helped a few of them out with various things when they needed it. The job will vary with location for sure, Iraq is a LOT different than Afghanistan.
It is all contract work, with no garuntee's. They way it "used" to work was you get paid $XXX per day that you're on a mission, and $XX for the days you aren't.
The reason they are under a microscope right now is simple, they cut corners and people were killed. When the families of those people inquired about it, they were shut out and not a whole lot was done. No insurance money, no appology, nothing. After the family's started with the law suits, a few other little known facts came out. One fact was that most of the BW "missions" were being funded twice. Once to BW for the mission, the 2nd to whoever they were guarding, which had a cut for BW in it... ooops, that didn't go over well.
One incident in particular that caused some of the lawsuits was a "simple" escort mission in Iraq. 4 guys were killed on an escort mission for kitchen supplies (might have been food, can't quite remember). These guys were trained operators, ex SEALs, Rangers, etc. There were supposed to be 3 of them in each vehicle and they were supposed to get 24 hours to study maps and intel before they left. The mission went with 2 ppl per vehicle and a little less than 8 hours after they were told about it. To make this short, the first vehicle in the convoy (driven by BW employees) made a wrong turn and they ended up in an ambush. The other BW vehicle followed and within a minute all 4 men were dead.
Things like this happen a lot more than you hear about. I don't know if I would call it typical, but it's a definite possibilty. Are you willing to take that risk? And more importantly, is your family? It's easy to get blinded by the $$$, trust me on that. But honestly, you can't put a price on your life and neither can those you might leave behind. Something to think about.
It is all contract work, with no garuntee's. They way it "used" to work was you get paid $XXX per day that you're on a mission, and $XX for the days you aren't.
The reason they are under a microscope right now is simple, they cut corners and people were killed. When the families of those people inquired about it, they were shut out and not a whole lot was done. No insurance money, no appology, nothing. After the family's started with the law suits, a few other little known facts came out. One fact was that most of the BW "missions" were being funded twice. Once to BW for the mission, the 2nd to whoever they were guarding, which had a cut for BW in it... ooops, that didn't go over well.
One incident in particular that caused some of the lawsuits was a "simple" escort mission in Iraq. 4 guys were killed on an escort mission for kitchen supplies (might have been food, can't quite remember). These guys were trained operators, ex SEALs, Rangers, etc. There were supposed to be 3 of them in each vehicle and they were supposed to get 24 hours to study maps and intel before they left. The mission went with 2 ppl per vehicle and a little less than 8 hours after they were told about it. To make this short, the first vehicle in the convoy (driven by BW employees) made a wrong turn and they ended up in an ambush. The other BW vehicle followed and within a minute all 4 men were dead.
Things like this happen a lot more than you hear about. I don't know if I would call it typical, but it's a definite possibilty. Are you willing to take that risk? And more importantly, is your family? It's easy to get blinded by the $$$, trust me on that. But honestly, you can't put a price on your life and neither can those you might leave behind. Something to think about.
05-26-2006, 04:07 PM
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Toonz, do you know if BW still has the highest ratio per capita of deaths? When I worked with them, they had approx. 10,000 employees in theater, the Military had over 200,000, Military lost an average of 8 per month, and BW average was 10 per month, which also shed a spotlight on their activities there. It is crazy ****, but crossing fingers we dont do the boarder hop and head into Iran!
05-27-2006, 01:24 AM
#26
What I have seen from them is not that good. I would not take that money. Toonz and a couple other people summed it up well. From what I see everyday, I will tell everyone I know, NO. **** NO. It is not worth it. Way too much risk to be taken.
There are other jobs out there that can pay pretty well over here. I already lost a Job that was going to pay over 200K. (Stop-Loss). It was electronics based and it can be bad at times, but those are mitigated risks. I can't prevent a Mortor from landing on my ***, but I sure as hell can prevent going on fucked-up, **** poor planned missions. they have caused the deaths of too many of their own employ's by doing some really stupid ****. Stuff that would make Army people say WTF!!???
Hell, you could work as a Truck driver on a FOB starting for $125K. KBR has tons of regular jobs available. Lots of company's are over here. Some you wouldn't even think have any stake in the military market.
There are hugh risks to take in that line of work. I'll dig up the names of some other company's like BW, that are MUCH better then working for them. They also do the same type of work.
Just PM me in a couple days and I'll get what info I can for the other company's.
There are other jobs out there that can pay pretty well over here. I already lost a Job that was going to pay over 200K. (Stop-Loss). It was electronics based and it can be bad at times, but those are mitigated risks. I can't prevent a Mortor from landing on my ***, but I sure as hell can prevent going on fucked-up, **** poor planned missions. they have caused the deaths of too many of their own employ's by doing some really stupid ****. Stuff that would make Army people say WTF!!???
Hell, you could work as a Truck driver on a FOB starting for $125K. KBR has tons of regular jobs available. Lots of company's are over here. Some you wouldn't even think have any stake in the military market.
There are hugh risks to take in that line of work. I'll dig up the names of some other company's like BW, that are MUCH better then working for them. They also do the same type of work.
Just PM me in a couple days and I'll get what info I can for the other company's.
05-28-2006, 06:00 PM
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I haven't followed this post in a while, but thanks for all the responses. CAT-3 and I have the same MOS except he has about 10+years of experience on me. I will wait to hear back from them in about 2 weeks and see what they are all about. I have also heard of all the trouble with them, so I guess we will see.
05-31-2006, 03:26 PM
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I got back an email from them. Here is what they offered.
Training will be for 24 days
You will be paid 150 per day
Training consists of shooting, driving, and combatives
Blackwater will provide you with travel, lodging, and 3 meals a day
Once you have successfully completed training and have received you clearance you will immediately deploy to Iraq
Your daily pay in country is 500.00; this is approximately 15,000 a month
You are paid monthly either into your checking or saving account
The contract is for 6 months with a 10% completion bonus, and a14 day break middle of contract
After the 6 months you have the option to extend in country which brings additional bonuses and makes the first 85,000 you made, tax free
You are providing PSD in and out of the green zone
You will be housed in the green zone, in a 600 man camp outside the Palace, across from the exchange
Training will be for 24 days
You will be paid 150 per day
Training consists of shooting, driving, and combatives
Blackwater will provide you with travel, lodging, and 3 meals a day
Once you have successfully completed training and have received you clearance you will immediately deploy to Iraq
Your daily pay in country is 500.00; this is approximately 15,000 a month
You are paid monthly either into your checking or saving account
The contract is for 6 months with a 10% completion bonus, and a14 day break middle of contract
After the 6 months you have the option to extend in country which brings additional bonuses and makes the first 85,000 you made, tax free
You are providing PSD in and out of the green zone
You will be housed in the green zone, in a 600 man camp outside the Palace, across from the exchange
05-31-2006, 05:22 PM
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Again, think long and hard about it. I'd hate to have a fellow servicemember/veteran and especially Romeo resting in peace for nothing more than $. GL
Charlie
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06-02-2006, 03:42 AM
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I agree, think long and hard about it. No matter how good you are, the risks are high and you can't control them. $$ isn't everything and there are plenty of other jobs that pay just as well with a lot less risk. To me, family is worth a lot more than a paycheck. Good luck with your decision.
- Rob
- Rob
06-02-2006, 12:46 PM
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I kindly turned them down today and will have to go pursue a career elsewhere. I don't know of any other places that will pay 200K, but then again, I won't be in Iraq.
I guess I can always sell cars or something.
I guess I can always sell cars or something.
06-02-2006, 12:50 PM
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Originally Posted by Toonz
I agree, think long and hard about it. No matter how good you are, the risks are high and you can't control them. $$ isn't everything and there are plenty of other jobs that pay just as well with a lot less risk. To me, family is worth a lot more than a paycheck. Good luck with your decision.
- Rob
- Rob
06-04-2006, 04:39 AM
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Hmm so many misconceptions here i just had to chime in real quick.
First off let me say again i worked with BW for one year in iraq on there highest profile mission to date, we escorted Bremer,Negropontie (sp?), Rumsfeld and other people of that nature. At the time Bremer had a 100mil bounty on his head by a insurgency group, Eric (guy in charge of iraq missions theater wide for BW) had a 50 mil price tag, and all us lowley MP's only had a 10mil price tag
But our females had an addition 2mil, damn bitches 
Now then for the deaths that did occur in BW let me just give you two quick examples. First im sure everyone remembers the three dudes burned and hung on the bridge in Fallugah right? Those three were BW and were all ex-ranger or SF. These guys had a SET ROUTE that was preplanned and safe. It was a simply resupply mission and they even had military escort. They on their own, decided to take a short cut through a dangerous sector and were hit with an IED and killed. Their military escort WARNED them not to take the route and they still did. Escort choose not to follow.
This was the offical report that Eric had wrote up and it had at least ten sworn statements from the soldiers there collaberating it.
The next big incident was four guys getting blown up on Irish the road to BIAP. These guys were doing a PX run in an unarmorred SUV on the most dangerous route in Iraq at the time, even though BW put out NO unarmored vehicles were to go down that road. They disobed and died as a result
BW is a great job, and very safe i might add. You have the best armor, weapons and training you can get but there is one thing you dont really have LEADERSHIP! Everyone is a civillian and they have no rank structure so to say. you have a boss but thats it. So now you have civillians with booze, weapons, SUV's and free time, of course bad stuff happens. BW is trying to combat this but it's an uphill stuggle at the moment.
My friend Dickman who was with me on the Bremer mission recently got a job with BW thanks to that letter of recomendation and just completed a tour in Iraq. he worked in BIAP and never once left the wire. He worked one day on one day off and according to his calculations earned $700 an hour.
All right so let me just sum this up real quick
BW is an excellent job, the pay is great, it's reletivly safe and you are pretty much your own boss. Stupid people though make stupid mistakes in the company though and get themselves killed and bring bad press on the company.
If anyone has any questions or anything about any of this just PM me or ask here, i still talk to Eric and Dickman so i know the current situation of the company still
PS-BW does do stateside security as well. My buddy Mongo worked PSD for Russel Crowe before he came to Iraq.
First off let me say again i worked with BW for one year in iraq on there highest profile mission to date, we escorted Bremer,Negropontie (sp?), Rumsfeld and other people of that nature. At the time Bremer had a 100mil bounty on his head by a insurgency group, Eric (guy in charge of iraq missions theater wide for BW) had a 50 mil price tag, and all us lowley MP's only had a 10mil price tag
But our females had an addition 2mil, damn bitches Now then for the deaths that did occur in BW let me just give you two quick examples. First im sure everyone remembers the three dudes burned and hung on the bridge in Fallugah right? Those three were BW and were all ex-ranger or SF. These guys had a SET ROUTE that was preplanned and safe. It was a simply resupply mission and they even had military escort. They on their own, decided to take a short cut through a dangerous sector and were hit with an IED and killed. Their military escort WARNED them not to take the route and they still did. Escort choose not to follow.
This was the offical report that Eric had wrote up and it had at least ten sworn statements from the soldiers there collaberating it.
The next big incident was four guys getting blown up on Irish the road to BIAP. These guys were doing a PX run in an unarmorred SUV on the most dangerous route in Iraq at the time, even though BW put out NO unarmored vehicles were to go down that road. They disobed and died as a result
BW is a great job, and very safe i might add. You have the best armor, weapons and training you can get but there is one thing you dont really have LEADERSHIP! Everyone is a civillian and they have no rank structure so to say. you have a boss but thats it. So now you have civillians with booze, weapons, SUV's and free time, of course bad stuff happens. BW is trying to combat this but it's an uphill stuggle at the moment.
My friend Dickman who was with me on the Bremer mission recently got a job with BW thanks to that letter of recomendation and just completed a tour in Iraq. he worked in BIAP and never once left the wire. He worked one day on one day off and according to his calculations earned $700 an hour.
All right so let me just sum this up real quick
BW is an excellent job, the pay is great, it's reletivly safe and you are pretty much your own boss. Stupid people though make stupid mistakes in the company though and get themselves killed and bring bad press on the company. If anyone has any questions or anything about any of this just PM me or ask here, i still talk to Eric and Dickman so i know the current situation of the company still
PS-BW does do stateside security as well. My buddy Mongo worked PSD for Russel Crowe before he came to Iraq.
06-04-2006, 11:13 AM
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Originally Posted by paul554
Hmm so many misconceptions here i just had to chime in real quick.
First off let me say again i worked with BW for one year in iraq on there highest profile mission to date, we escorted Bremer,Negropontie (sp?), Rumsfeld and other people of that nature. At the time Bremer had a 100mil bounty on his head by a insurgency group, Eric (guy in charge of iraq missions theater wide for BW) had a 50 mil price tag, and all us lowley MP's only had a 10mil price tag But our females had an addition 2mil, damn bitches
Now then for the deaths that did occur in BW let me just give you two quick examples. First im sure everyone remembers the three dudes burned and hung on the bridge in Fallugah right? Those three were BW and were all ex-ranger or SF. These guys had a SET ROUTE that was preplanned and safe. It was a simply resupply mission and they even had military escort. They on their own, decided to take a short cut through a dangerous sector and were hit with an IED and killed. Their military escort WARNED them not to take the route and they still did. Escort choose not to follow.
This was the offical report that Eric had wrote up and it had at least ten sworn statements from the soldiers there collaberating it.
The next big incident was four guys getting blown up on Irish the road to BIAP. These guys were doing a PX run in an unarmorred SUV on the most dangerous route in Iraq at the time, even though BW put out NO unarmored vehicles were to go down that road. They disobed and died as a result
BW is a great job, and very safe i might add. You have the best armor, weapons and training you can get but there is one thing you dont really have LEADERSHIP! Everyone is a civillian and they have no rank structure so to say. you have a boss but thats it. So now you have civillians with booze, weapons, SUV's and free time, of course bad stuff happens. BW is trying to combat this but it's an uphill stuggle at the moment.
My friend Dickman who was with me on the Bremer mission recently got a job with BW thanks to that letter of recomendation and just completed a tour in Iraq. he worked in BIAP and never once left the wire. He worked one day on one day off and according to his calculations earned $700 an hour.
All right so let me just sum this up real quick BW is an excellent job, the pay is great, it's reletivly safe and you are pretty much your own boss. Stupid people though make stupid mistakes in the company though and get themselves killed and bring bad press on the company.
If anyone has any questions or anything about any of this just PM me or ask here, i still talk to Eric and Dickman so i know the current situation of the company still
PS-BW does do stateside security as well. My buddy Mongo worked PSD for Russel Crowe before he came to Iraq.
First off let me say again i worked with BW for one year in iraq on there highest profile mission to date, we escorted Bremer,Negropontie (sp?), Rumsfeld and other people of that nature. At the time Bremer had a 100mil bounty on his head by a insurgency group, Eric (guy in charge of iraq missions theater wide for BW) had a 50 mil price tag, and all us lowley MP's only had a 10mil price tag
But our females had an addition 2mil, damn bitches Now then for the deaths that did occur in BW let me just give you two quick examples. First im sure everyone remembers the three dudes burned and hung on the bridge in Fallugah right? Those three were BW and were all ex-ranger or SF. These guys had a SET ROUTE that was preplanned and safe. It was a simply resupply mission and they even had military escort. They on their own, decided to take a short cut through a dangerous sector and were hit with an IED and killed. Their military escort WARNED them not to take the route and they still did. Escort choose not to follow.
This was the offical report that Eric had wrote up and it had at least ten sworn statements from the soldiers there collaberating it.
The next big incident was four guys getting blown up on Irish the road to BIAP. These guys were doing a PX run in an unarmorred SUV on the most dangerous route in Iraq at the time, even though BW put out NO unarmored vehicles were to go down that road. They disobed and died as a result
BW is a great job, and very safe i might add. You have the best armor, weapons and training you can get but there is one thing you dont really have LEADERSHIP! Everyone is a civillian and they have no rank structure so to say. you have a boss but thats it. So now you have civillians with booze, weapons, SUV's and free time, of course bad stuff happens. BW is trying to combat this but it's an uphill stuggle at the moment.
My friend Dickman who was with me on the Bremer mission recently got a job with BW thanks to that letter of recomendation and just completed a tour in Iraq. he worked in BIAP and never once left the wire. He worked one day on one day off and according to his calculations earned $700 an hour.
All right so let me just sum this up real quick
BW is an excellent job, the pay is great, it's reletivly safe and you are pretty much your own boss. Stupid people though make stupid mistakes in the company though and get themselves killed and bring bad press on the company. If anyone has any questions or anything about any of this just PM me or ask here, i still talk to Eric and Dickman so i know the current situation of the company still
PS-BW does do stateside security as well. My buddy Mongo worked PSD for Russel Crowe before he came to Iraq.
06-05-2006, 01:43 AM
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Paul, enlightening...really. With my experience side by side with them, even the guys working for BW really didnt like it too much. They cited the lack of leadership issues, the inconsistency of mission dispersment etc.. Most were glad to not be messed up after seeing this guy or that one doing something stupid and biting it etc..most said the pay was their only draw to work for BW as well. As mentioned, theres always different views to things, you obvioulsy have had a good experience with them, mine was so-so, some others not good. Overall, looking at the loss of BW per capita compared to the Armed Forces is enough to make me think about and realize family is more important than the risk for $.
06-05-2006, 09:45 AM
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Originally Posted by CAT3
Paul, enlightening...really. With my experience side by side with them, even the guys working for BW really didnt like it too much. They cited the lack of leadership issues, the inconsistency of mission dispersment etc.. Most were glad to not be messed up after seeing this guy or that one doing something stupid and biting it etc..most said the pay was their only draw to work for BW as well. As mentioned, theres always different views to things, you obvioulsy have had a good experience with them, mine was so-so, some others not good. Overall, looking at the loss of BW per capita compared to the Armed Forces is enough to make me think about and realize family is more important than the risk for $.
