1badchicken

iTrader: (47)

give us some feedback of your accomplishments. Because Senior NCO's get promoted on a centralized promotion system. For me that isn't a valid argument. I've met 20 year slugs. I need motivated and dedicated soldiers. Not a slacker. It's up to me to train!!!! So if you have a NCO doing their job, we won't have this issue. That is the problem, it's not always time in grade. It's what their NCO's have them doing during their time. I remember pouring my soul into my soldiers. I made sure my platoon was always the best. We have to use the total soldier concept.

Richiec77

iTrader: (3)

Sorry. I was talking about the lower ranks. Mostly the promotions to E-5. Too many people IMO getting promoted mainly out of neccessity then out of ability. 1SGT and Plt SGT's being pressured to promote their soldiers so fast mainly out of pressure due to their peers being promoted quickly. Not all MOS's are like that. Especially Infantry from what I've seen.

Making E-7 as fast as you have is impressive. That's usually the stop gap for bad NCO's. At that rate you either have leadership abilities or you don't. If you don't, you usually don't meet the grade.

1badchicken

iTrader: (47)

I agree with you.

11 Bravo

iTrader: (3)

You can make E-6 in 3 years if you go to Ranger school. I had a PFC a couple years back who I got into PRC and Ranger after I had him about 6 months. He was a stud and passed no problem. When you graduate you are automatically a corporal and go to the next E-5 board. He did exactly that. Right after I left a little less than a year later I heard he got sent to the E-6 board. I didn't send him because I thought he needed more team leader time, but he got it.

Daredevil_TA

iTrader: (6)

army promotion system is a joke, ive seen them promote guys to E-5 just by saying the NCO Creed give me a f'n break--i think you should be tested by your MOS an not memorizing a bunch of stupid regulations an a couple paragraphs. This is why there are so many shitbag NCO's in the army today, they're good at memorizing a study guide but don't know jack **** about being a leader or how to do they're damn job-then they end up being even bigger shitbags because they think they can just walk all over they're soldiers: not show up to formation, cheat on their wives, verbally an physically abuse their soldiers, just good all around shitbags. haha sorry guys i'll get off my soapbox now-im sure you all have seen it at least once or twice

brad8266

iTrader: (23)

At my board all I did was recite the first paragraph of the NCO creed, sing the 10 mtn song, and recall a few current events about some soldier getting killed in afghanistan. Walked out with 150 points. Not one single question MOS related. That is exactly why there are tons of NCO's out there that dont really know the technical part of their job, they are never tested on it.

1badchicken

iTrader: (47)

Here is the answer on this. NCO's are trained to be leaders, Yes it is very important to be skill qualified. But most of our positions should be leader based. That is why I have soldiers to handle my technical side. If you are technically proficient and exceed the standard, go be a warrant and get out of my lane.
As for a soldier learning the creed and getting promoted, i've seen it happen but not on my watch. you just have to stand up and give that monthly counseling. don't blame the soldier blame the NCO that didn't have enough nuts to say sorry my man, you have to accomplish a through z.. I'm sorry that second platoon has a scrub who recommends anyone. But you will thank me later, and so will your soldiers. So back to my point, my soldiers wanted me to lead and not tell them how to fix things. That is why I have E-5's. I could go all day on this one.

11 Bravo

iTrader: (3)

There has been leaders like that since the begining of time in all branches, and it will be that way forever.

brad8266

iTrader: (23)

Well maybe it depends on the MOS because in my MOS you must know the tech part of you job as well as the NCO leadership. An E5-E6 in signal needs to know his or her technical job, period. How can you lead when you are constantly being corrected by your subordinates on your own MOS?

Daredevil_TA

iTrader: (6)

Exactly, IMO nothing is more embarrassing then having a subordinate telling a higher ranking NCO that he is f'd up or showing him how to do his job. I'm a mechanic in a Transportation Co. an i deal with 88 Mikes on a daily basis-Most of the time I am having to show them how to do THIER job when it comes to the simple maint. side of things. I'm not just talking about young E1's to E4's, I get just as many E5's that don't have a clue on how to grease a vehicle or even check oil!

longrange4u

iTrader: (2)

You could also go to SFAS .... you will pin SSG by the time you finnish Q course.

1badchicken

iTrader: (47)

That's bull, I've worked signal. I'm a 94W, and I've had tons of soldiers that are 25 series. What are we talking MSE, I know you have to get the trunks, nodes. blah, blah blah up. But who is doing it? The SPC are. The E-5 should be supervising safety hazards, if not overwatching to ensure the sytem in coming up. the E-6 should be getting feedback from all support personnel, setting up perimeter defense, locking down generators, basic setup procedures. The SFC should be digging down and stressing the SSG to stress the SGT to get the system up. This should be accomplished prior to even going out on real world mission. So don't give me that load of mess. NCO's are leaders, your SPC should be training PVT's and if he can't do it, it's one on one time. Oh wait that is called leadership, isn't it. Like I said if you are technically inclined go be a 918B, and answer to the MAJ.
So the bottom line is. If your NCO's are setting up the nodes or repairing equipment you are doing something very wrong. I can tell you would hate me, but in the end all soldiers loved me. And the ones that didn't were weak.

JuggernautLS7

Its hard to say, Im a PFC and ive been in only a year. A buddy of mine has been in 6 years (reserves and now active) and is only a E-4 specialist. My recruiter is a SSG and has been in 6 years and my platoon leader has been in 6 years and is a SSG. I think it all depends on time in service, MOS and your attitude. I know 11B rank up pretty fast so im sure he will be a SGT within those 5 years.

there was a SSG who was just promoted to E7 lastweek and i recall our CSM saying hes only been in 7 years... now thats pretty damn good if u ask me. I dont recall his MOS but i know it was some kind of desk/ paper pushing MOS.

sapper_daddy

iTrader: (12)

That is all fine an dandy, your approach is text book and shows your leadership style, everyones is different, but time shows soldiers if your intentions are good and in the right place. I know that when I got into Iraq the e-5s and e-6s in my platoon and especially my squad were admired by us for sure. We always took their orders and did the best we could and we were tasked to train and teach classes depending on who knew a subject best. We let our strengths plug up weaknesses and after it's all said and done the NCOs did the leg work of setting us up for success, getting the information, making sure we got fed keeping us informed and then came and worked right next to us pulling guard duty, digging the ditches, running the routes, filling in spots in the gunners hatch and generally busting their asses to exhaustion and doing their NCO jobs! When all I had to do as an E-4 was just take orders. Their life was **** and they never did any of that, I'm the NCO watch me lead and take care of you with my text book approach that shows the soldiers whos boss. The one NCO who did that was all show and when the metal hit the grinder was a *****.....be dammned if he would say that he was but when the bullets flew all he was doing was hiding behind the humvee or texting the TOC on Blueforce. I'm not synical about it but I know what real leaders are all about, they show you strength through deeds not by beating their chest, and in general they are all people that I would be proud to accociate with outside of the Army and are my best friends. Go eat a fatty cake there SGT because you are too worried about how much your soldiers "love" you, I don't think there is alot of sincerity or genunie care or empathy in a leadership style like that. You don't have to explain it to us prove it to yourself. You are a professional.

brad8266

iTrader: (23)

Ok you win, its bull, whatever. You must not have ever worked with a signal team if you really believe all that. Apparantly NCO's dont need to know their own MOS anymore, thats fine and dandy then, I guess thats why they go to BNCOC and ANCOC at the signal school, so they can not learn signal stuff.

No offense but your leadership style seems to be the type that knows how to shine boots, iron uniforms, cut grass, and preach AR's and FM's, but if I asked you to show me how to load comsec and operate an FM radio you wouldnt be able to do it because you think that only SPC's and below need to know those technical things. What you gonna do when your soldiers are shot and cant do anything, just throw your hands up and quit?

Heres an example. An E4 goes to the promotion board and does not get 1 single question MOS related, he goes in and recites a few nonsense items and passes and get promoted the next month. Now this new E5 is in charge of an extension node site and has 3 SPC and belows working for him, all of them have not had much hands on time with the equipment and really dont have a good understanding of the job. So who are they going to rely on to teach them how to properly operate the equipment?? Hmm how bout the E5 that is in charge of the team?? And now if that E5 cant explain to his soldiers how to do the job those soldiers will lose a lot of respect for him and will think hes just another chewed up NCO. If that NCO knows his stuff and can teach the soldiers everything from MOS tech stuff as well as perform basic leadership like an NCO needs to then the soldiers will know they have a competent leader that they can repsect and look up to. I have been in these situations before and have had friends that also got promoted to E5, had no idea of technical issues, and went out to the field and made themselves and the entire PLT look bad.

I will strive to remain tactically and technically proficient Isnt that from paragraph 2 of the NCo creed??

Nemo02Z

Making E-6 or more in 4 yrs is absurd there is in no way anyone can learn all the responsibilities and duties for each rank that fast, especially if you sit your *** in an office all day. Thats not to say it does not happen because it does and that is why the end result is weak leadership or likership to be PC... I was in 8 yrs and I made my SSG in 6 yrs and points were above 750.. Only a good NCO can prepare a soldier to be lead and a be a leader. Here is a cold reality, he would be setting that soldier and others up for failure by pushing someone through the ranks like that.... Its a flawed system along with the awards system...But then again soldiers learn everything that there is to know about the army before they leave basic and noone knows more than them...LOL

There are a few exceptions out there SFAS, Rangers, But that is just different..

Nemo02Z

Look dont be so hard on him...LOL You know what leadership style works for him and what works for you, caring about what you teach and what you pass down through the lower ranks is correct takes a certain amount of pride... but you know whatever helps him sleep at night is fine....

11 Bravo

iTrader: (3)

If you have a shitbag NCO, don't blame him for being a shitbag. It's not like anyone here would turn down a promotion. Blame the guy who didn't counsel him and sent him to the board. If it's a senior NCO, blame the guy who didn't give him the bad NCOER he deserved. I'll see some peice of crap and the first thing I ask myself is who is the idiot who let him get promoted.

brad8266

iTrader: (23)

Good point.

1badchicken

iTrader: (47)

Here is my point, why would you be asking me how to load COMSEC? As an E-7 you shouldn't be asking me simple stuff, You should be asking me. SFC can you figure out why I didn't get paid, because my wife and kids are starving. And I don't have any money? Sure let's go to finance. First off SGT's should be the first line of defense. This is who takes care of the soldier. As a squad leader you have to be on top of your soldiers. I mean they are yours and you have to know what you are working with. So any way to the point. If your E-5's can't load COMSEC or handle ANCD's or how to set up your equipment there is a break down in training. You see if your E-7 is digging the ditch and not making sure you have deadspace or setting up the perimeter defense, you are as good as dead. Don't you see that. Now as for E-5's doing the ground pounding, yeah of course. They should show the soldier look set it up this way. You see that is what is wrong with the NCO corp today. There is no reason to get promoted except for a Pay check. How about the respect. When is the last time you saw a soldier yell make way for a SGT. In my day, and this was at FT Gordon by BNCOC. I was a new SGT. A private looked and me and yelled make way, and I went up to the front of the line. You see you have it all wrong. Yes you have to be technically inclined. But that is what your E-5's are for.