Nitrous guys...please read my plugs....
11-24-2008, 10:56 AM
#21
for every step colder you lower combustion temps 100* . It makes it harder to detonate but also makes it harder to combust so you need the right plug to cold or to hot will make it not run right. to cold the idle sucks to hot and youll burn the tip off. But 1 step colder from where you are would be a good start.
11-24-2008, 11:15 AM
#22
I agree, one step at a time to get it right, I just like the colder plug, but I'm used to alot mroe compresssion so it's diffreent becuase of that I am sure.
The plugs that stock to 11 to 1 guys can get away with I will hurt in a run or 2, but with the colder ones I can run all day on the same set if I want and nothing gets hurt, car runs the same with a 8 as it does with a 9, so I just run the colder one, pull them all after my first pass, or after any changes, and as long as all looks good I put them back in for the day.
When I finally start hitting the **** out of it that will change for sure though.
The plugs that stock to 11 to 1 guys can get away with I will hurt in a run or 2, but with the colder ones I can run all day on the same set if I want and nothing gets hurt, car runs the same with a 8 as it does with a 9, so I just run the colder one, pull them all after my first pass, or after any changes, and as long as all looks good I put them back in for the day.
When I finally start hitting the **** out of it that will change for sure though.
11-24-2008, 12:11 PM
#23
TECH Enthusiast
Thread Starter
Yeah ok....that makes a pretty good difference pulling 100* out of the chamber...thats definetly gotta help.
So for my plugs.....should I just go up to a TR7 or try the cold Autolites you recommended? I run it and race it on motor 98% of the time so I don't want to kill anymore power on the motor....I am already down some from the retarded timing. I also don't want to hurt the idle or driveability, its already rough enough with the MS3. I will change the plugs this week based on your recommendations.
So for my plugs.....should I just go up to a TR7 or try the cold Autolites you recommended? I run it and race it on motor 98% of the time so I don't want to kill anymore power on the motor....I am already down some from the retarded timing. I also don't want to hurt the idle or driveability, its already rough enough with the MS3. I will change the plugs this week based on your recommendations.
11-24-2008, 01:24 PM
#25
Get yourself a set of the Tr7 plug without the protruded tip (look at the plug sticky on here), and a set of the autolite ar3394... you're talking about 2.50 a piece for the plugs, not a HUGE deal.
Start with the 7's, make a run at "your" track, hard run 1st rhtu 4th, or as much room as you have, at the end of the run, click the key so the engine cuts off, DON"T TURN IT ALL THE WAY OR THE WHEEL WILL LOCK!! I have to say it, in fear that if I don't someone won't realize it. Pull over right there, and pull every plug out (hopefully you have a "return road", or parking area you can do this in) and put the autolite's in, and do the same thing again, don't drive on either plug if you can aviod it, to help make sure they are fresh. Gap them all at .035 for consistancey.
Once you're done, you will have 2 sets (bring a 3rd set of something to put back in the car after you pull the 2nd set) and take pictures of all of them and post them again, at that point you will be able to get sound advise as to where your tuneup is and what is the better way to go. This way we can see what the car does with one step colder, and 2 steps colder, so we can see what that changes, and see if it's the right direction or not.
Regardless what you ultimately decide to do, I'd go to at least one range colder then a #6 plug
#6 plugs are good for 100 to 150 on a stock motor. Put a cam in that changes the dynamic compression and you are on the edge of what is safe.
I look at it like this, every 125 hp you go up, you should be going down one range.
stock plugs are a 5, so that's good for 300
425 needs a 6
550 needs a 7
625 needs an 8
750 needs a 9
anything from 875 and up probably needs a 10
That's a little overkill, but I don't know of anyone that followed that rule and ever hurt something from a plug being too hot. You probably have a +/- of 50 hp on those #'s and you'll still be o.k., but the tune is going to become more critical.
Some people will tell you that I'm crazy with that, and I"m telling people too cold a plug, but I've followed this with my car, and after 3 years and a good 200+ passes, and haven't had a head off the car yet. That being said, if I was on the too agressive side, I highly doubt that would be the case.
Start with the 7's, make a run at "your" track, hard run 1st rhtu 4th, or as much room as you have, at the end of the run, click the key so the engine cuts off, DON"T TURN IT ALL THE WAY OR THE WHEEL WILL LOCK!! I have to say it, in fear that if I don't someone won't realize it. Pull over right there, and pull every plug out (hopefully you have a "return road", or parking area you can do this in) and put the autolite's in, and do the same thing again, don't drive on either plug if you can aviod it, to help make sure they are fresh. Gap them all at .035 for consistancey.
Once you're done, you will have 2 sets (bring a 3rd set of something to put back in the car after you pull the 2nd set) and take pictures of all of them and post them again, at that point you will be able to get sound advise as to where your tuneup is and what is the better way to go. This way we can see what the car does with one step colder, and 2 steps colder, so we can see what that changes, and see if it's the right direction or not.
Regardless what you ultimately decide to do, I'd go to at least one range colder then a #6 plug
#6 plugs are good for 100 to 150 on a stock motor. Put a cam in that changes the dynamic compression and you are on the edge of what is safe.
I look at it like this, every 125 hp you go up, you should be going down one range.
stock plugs are a 5, so that's good for 300
425 needs a 6
550 needs a 7
625 needs an 8
750 needs a 9
anything from 875 and up probably needs a 10
That's a little overkill, but I don't know of anyone that followed that rule and ever hurt something from a plug being too hot. You probably have a +/- of 50 hp on those #'s and you'll still be o.k., but the tune is going to become more critical.
Some people will tell you that I'm crazy with that, and I"m telling people too cold a plug, but I've followed this with my car, and after 3 years and a good 200+ passes, and haven't had a head off the car yet. That being said, if I was on the too agressive side, I highly doubt that would be the case.
11-24-2008, 02:01 PM
#26
TECH Enthusiast
Thread Starter
Very sound advice....Definetly worth trying... I don't have a problem buying two sets of plugs. Definetly would be something I would have to do at the strip though so I could coast to the return road and have enough room to let it cool down.....Took me over 2 hrs to get the plugs all out and back in this weekend. That #7 is a bitch. I ended up getting pissed off and pulling the coil pack rack off the valve cover to get some room to get to it. No way I could do that **** hot.....LOL.
I am gonna try the TR7s, non-protruding. Gonna try to get some in this thing before the weekend. I might dump a gallon or two of C16 in it also before doing anymore "HARD" runs(like into 5th).
Thanks for all the help bro. I have played with nitrous forever on SBCs, pontiacs and Hayabusas but pulling timing was easy on those, as was retuning them. Not the case with LS1s.
I am gonna try the TR7s, non-protruding. Gonna try to get some in this thing before the weekend. I might dump a gallon or two of C16 in it also before doing anymore "HARD" runs(like into 5th).
Thanks for all the help bro. I have played with nitrous forever on SBCs, pontiacs and Hayabusas but pulling timing was easy on those, as was retuning them. Not the case with LS1s.
11-24-2008, 02:05 PM
#27
I'd make a trip to a track, definately the safe and right thing to do.
For consistancey sake, I wouldn't put any race fuel in until we can see where the plugs are right now with a 4th gear or 1/4 mile pass... once you know that's right with the pump fuel, then adding some race fuel for any highway fun would be a good idea.
But, I'd stay away from overdrive with the nitrous, you're really asking for trouble IMO.
For consistancey sake, I wouldn't put any race fuel in until we can see where the plugs are right now with a 4th gear or 1/4 mile pass... once you know that's right with the pump fuel, then adding some race fuel for any highway fun would be a good idea.
But, I'd stay away from overdrive with the nitrous, you're really asking for trouble IMO.
Thats how we do it.
11-25-2008, 11:50 AM
#32
TECH Enthusiast
Thread Starter
11-25-2008, 01:43 PM
#33
TECH Enthusiast
Thread Starter
I just ordered the Br7ef plugs from O Reilys...... $17 and they will be here by 5pm. I tried to find out if they are projected tips or not....still don't know. I know on NGKs site they show to be a "resistor" type plug so I am not sure if that means its projected tip or if that is something different all together but......Either way, I will slap them in tonight and try them out this weekend. Hopefully that will help some. I won't be spraying into 5th anymore.
11-25-2008, 09:10 PM
#36
Yes, pretty much holds true most of the time. Those reccomendations are pretty safe, you may need a #9 but I doubt it, you might be able to get away with a #7, but why risk it.
I think if people go by that reccommendation, the liklyhood of having a problem due to the plugs being too hot/cold is pretty slim. Sure you're gonna find the guy that tells you a #6 is fine for 700 rwhp stuff..... but I will never tell someone to do something that is on the risky side of things.
11-26-2008, 02:21 PM
#37
As stated the plug is to hot.
If you do move the shot up to a 200 shot. I say put some one step colder plugs in #7 and #8 cylinders and the TR7s in the rest. Just to be on the safe side.
Looks like its running a little rich also, what was the a/f on the dyno? EDIT: Seen where you already said this. Next time pull the plugs as soon as you finish spraying, then post up pics.
If you do move the shot up to a 200 shot. I say put some one step colder plugs in #7 and #8 cylinders and the TR7s in the rest. Just to be on the safe side.
Looks like its running a little rich also, what was the a/f on the dyno? EDIT: Seen where you already said this. Next time pull the plugs as soon as you finish spraying, then post up pics.
