Edelbrock ProFlow XT+Plate= Booom!!
11-17-2009, 12:30 PM
#61
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WTF are you talking about Shizz and Wayne... You guys are waaaaay off base here.....
I tune mine with a narrow-band o2 sensor that I plumbed into the oil pan cause there was a bung already there and I didn't want to drill my exhaust. I run TR5's in 4 cylinders cause those ones run hot and I put TR6's in the others for my 350 shot. I set up my narrow band to set off an audible alarm when the mixture reaches stoich. My narrow band will see this since it's plumbed into the oil pan and it'll see the rapid loss of oil pressure when the ringlands lift and oil begins to spray into the combustion chamber. However since i'm running octane booster (that I put into the oil) the oil in my combustion chamber is actually helping the burn and allowing me to completely get the proper mixture. This intake didn't allow time for the nawzzz to mix with the fuel..... I got around this by running an Edelbrock Twisted Pretzel intake (lightly salted version). I also ran a 4" sheetmetal tube as the intake and I put the nozzles all the way down near the front of my homemade ram air system consisting of PVC and heater ducting.
Been thru 400 lbs of nawz and never even burned a plug. Picking up .2 in the 1/4 off a 400 shot... My friends say it's the fastest they've seen.....
I read plugs after I drive it down the highway back home after racing ensuring I get the timing marks and fuel rings burned into the porcelein real good..... It works for me so you guys should educate yourselfs on nawzz....
I tune mine with a narrow-band o2 sensor that I plumbed into the oil pan cause there was a bung already there and I didn't want to drill my exhaust. I run TR5's in 4 cylinders cause those ones run hot and I put TR6's in the others for my 350 shot. I set up my narrow band to set off an audible alarm when the mixture reaches stoich. My narrow band will see this since it's plumbed into the oil pan and it'll see the rapid loss of oil pressure when the ringlands lift and oil begins to spray into the combustion chamber. However since i'm running octane booster (that I put into the oil) the oil in my combustion chamber is actually helping the burn and allowing me to completely get the proper mixture. This intake didn't allow time for the nawzzz to mix with the fuel..... I got around this by running an Edelbrock Twisted Pretzel intake (lightly salted version). I also ran a 4" sheetmetal tube as the intake and I put the nozzles all the way down near the front of my homemade ram air system consisting of PVC and heater ducting.
Been thru 400 lbs of nawz and never even burned a plug. Picking up .2 in the 1/4 off a 400 shot... My friends say it's the fastest they've seen.....
I read plugs after I drive it down the highway back home after racing ensuring I get the timing marks and fuel rings burned into the porcelein real good..... It works for me so you guys should educate yourselfs on nawzz....
11-17-2009, 02:21 PM
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Someone would be dumb not to follow the info in this thread.
1.) One guy says he tunes off a wideband.
2.) Another can look at a plug and say you need to pull two degrees and lean it out a half point.
It doesn't take a brain surgeon to see which suggestion I would choose...
1.) One guy says he tunes off a wideband.
2.) Another can look at a plug and say you need to pull two degrees and lean it out a half point.
It doesn't take a brain surgeon to see which suggestion I would choose...
Last edited by Lythropus; 11-17-2009 at 02:30 PM.
11-17-2009, 05:19 PM
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Someone would be dumb not to follow the info in this thread.
1.) One guy says he tunes off a wideband.
2.) Another can look at a plug and say you need to pull two degrees and lean it out a half point.
It doesn't take a brain surgeon to see which suggestion I would choose...
1.) One guy says he tunes off a wideband.
2.) Another can look at a plug and say you need to pull two degrees and lean it out a half point.
It doesn't take a brain surgeon to see which suggestion I would choose...
If you idle it back to the pits the read on the fuel ring will be dead. the timing marks will probably still be there but you won't be able to get a good read on the fuel ring allowing you to make timing/fuel adjustments....
Most motors get killed from being overtimed in combination with being too rich or too lean... if your timing is VERY conservative your motor can be leaner/richer and survive. It's when you get agressive with timing and you lean it to a point where it hurts something... I use a wideband as a reference and compare that with what plugs are saying in addition to what is my trap speed doing and ET.... what are the incrementals? then i'll creep up the timing depending on where timing marks are.... I use a plug reading microscope with a light on all the plugs in between runs.... My Air fuel ratios are typically at 11.5:1 target with my XFI box. My tune would be considered probably by most on the rich(er) side.... By no means lifting ringlands rich but on the richer side. When I went to 12:1 and leaned it out my car actually slowed down MPH wise... so it didn't like it. So we went back to 11.5:1 and started playing with timing 1 degree at a time.
Another thing is understanding the difference between tuning for 1/8th mile and tuning for 1/4 mile.... 1/4 mile puts the engine under load in high gear for a much longer time allowing heat to build up which can melt pistons, plugs, ringlands, etc... tunes must be more conservative for 1/4 mile vs 1/8th mile.... A car that can go 5.50 in the 1/8th on a killer 1/8th mile tuneup won't be able to keep that same tuneup in the car if he intends to run it out the backdoor.... ALOT of learning can be had by listening to how the guys are getting their setups to live under 400+ hp worth of spray....
11-17-2009, 06:25 PM
#66
WTF are you talking about Shizz and Wayne... You guys are waaaaay off base here.....
I tune mine with a narrow-band o2 sensor that I plumbed into the oil pan cause there was a bung already there and I didn't want to drill my exhaust. I run TR5's in 4 cylinders cause those ones run hot and I put TR6's in the others for my 350 shot. I set up my narrow band to set off an audible alarm when the mixture reaches stoich. My narrow band will see this since it's plumbed into the oil pan and it'll see the rapid loss of oil pressure when the ringlands lift and oil begins to spray into the combustion chamber. However since i'm running octane booster (that I put into the oil) the oil in my combustion chamber is actually helping the burn and allowing me to completely get the proper mixture. This intake didn't allow time for the nawzzz to mix with the fuel..... I got around this by running an Edelbrock Twisted Pretzel intake (lightly salted version). I also ran a 4" sheetmetal tube as the intake and I put the nozzles all the way down near the front of my homemade ram air system consisting of PVC and heater ducting.
Been thru 400 lbs of nawz and never even burned a plug. Picking up .2 in the 1/4 off a 400 shot... My friends say it's the fastest they've seen.....
I read plugs after I drive it down the highway back home after racing ensuring I get the timing marks and fuel rings burned into the porcelein real good..... It works for me so you guys should educate yourselfs on nawzz....
I tune mine with a narrow-band o2 sensor that I plumbed into the oil pan cause there was a bung already there and I didn't want to drill my exhaust. I run TR5's in 4 cylinders cause those ones run hot and I put TR6's in the others for my 350 shot. I set up my narrow band to set off an audible alarm when the mixture reaches stoich. My narrow band will see this since it's plumbed into the oil pan and it'll see the rapid loss of oil pressure when the ringlands lift and oil begins to spray into the combustion chamber. However since i'm running octane booster (that I put into the oil) the oil in my combustion chamber is actually helping the burn and allowing me to completely get the proper mixture. This intake didn't allow time for the nawzzz to mix with the fuel..... I got around this by running an Edelbrock Twisted Pretzel intake (lightly salted version). I also ran a 4" sheetmetal tube as the intake and I put the nozzles all the way down near the front of my homemade ram air system consisting of PVC and heater ducting.
Been thru 400 lbs of nawz and never even burned a plug. Picking up .2 in the 1/4 off a 400 shot... My friends say it's the fastest they've seen.....
I read plugs after I drive it down the highway back home after racing ensuring I get the timing marks and fuel rings burned into the porcelein real good..... It works for me so you guys should educate yourselfs on nawzz....
hahahahah jason you're killin me dude.
subbing this thread
Last edited by Raven02TA; 11-17-2009 at 06:33 PM.
11-18-2009, 06:09 PM
#68
Wow
Threads like this are why I stopped posting in this section a long time ago.
Shiz and Wayne, how can you continue to beat your heads against the wall trying to educate people that cant even show a hint of respect for your time and knowledge?
For the record I believe the Lokar throttle cable blew his engine not the tune up.
While that might sound really stupid I am no further away from the truth than the OP is.
Threads like this are why I stopped posting in this section a long time ago.
Shiz and Wayne, how can you continue to beat your heads against the wall trying to educate people that cant even show a hint of respect for your time and knowledge?
For the record I believe the Lokar throttle cable blew his engine not the tune up.
While that might sound really stupid I am no further away from the truth than the OP is.
11-18-2009, 08:19 PM
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Talked to a few people at Edelbrock. They said that NO nitrous testing has been done with the LS Pro Flow XT intake. They said the plate system that was advertised on the intake was strictly for their electronics and it was a dry sytem installed. Basically showing that their electronics could control a N20 setup. They also strongly advised against putting a wet plate system on this intake. Basically for the same reasons that blew my motor. I have also been in contact with alot of reputable companys that design N20 systems and Intakes. All have agreed about what happened. That the Edelbrock ProFlow XT intake should NOT be used with a wet plate/or nozzle system due to its design. It would be optimal with a fogger/direct port system. I do realize that the cause of this is using the wrong parts together, NOT THE TUNE. One other thing to add is that there is not any damage to any other cylinder, just #6. ATVracer and everyone else I appreciate the input and help. I hope that this can be a helpful thread in the future to others that try and run the same setup. Please don't.
well. if you put the new intake on, and retuned it, YOU SHOULD HAVE CHECKED THE PLUGS. if you would have checked the plugs, you would have said WHAT THE ****, and done something about the issue. what happened has nothing to do with "all of the nitrous going into one cylinder", that cyl ran LEAN. CLEARLY. gasses dont puddle up or magicly go into one cyl, and nitrous is a gas.
the reason this happend IS the tune. the wideband takes an average AFR for 4 cyls. whats more accurate, checking every cyl, or just an average of 4, and only one bank. hell, one bank could be compleatly lean, and the one with the wideband could be fine and you'd never know.
11-18-2009, 08:24 PM
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You are correct about to much fuel going.. If you read what he said in a post, all of the fuel, and nitrous from the hit didn't have enough time to mix and shot into which ever cylinder was going to fire at the time because it forced it into the cylinder hole.
I think all he is saying is there isn't enough time for everything to mix which will cause this.
I think all he is saying is there isn't enough time for everything to mix which will cause this.
do you realize how ******* stupid that sounds?
11-18-2009, 08:42 PM
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im gonna go ahead an make sure you do...
lets say, for simplicity, the engine is turing 6000 rpms. we're gonna figure out how many times 1 intake valve is open per second.
6000.
for every one rotation of the crank shaft, piston moves UP and DOWN once. to compleate a 4 stroke cycle (1 IVO event), the crank has to rotate 720*. so at 6000rpm's, the piston will compleate 3000 720* rotations in 1 minute. 3000/60 (min - sec) = 50.
so at 6000 rpm every valve opens 50 times per second. and theres 8! intake valves. rigghhtt. ALLLLLL the nitrous just decided to enter on ONE of those cyl's in what, a thousanth of a second? seems entirely feasible....
i think on that note, and the fact that the car was BACKFIRING should be a hint that it was something else.
lets say, for simplicity, the engine is turing 6000 rpms. we're gonna figure out how many times 1 intake valve is open per second.
6000.
for every one rotation of the crank shaft, piston moves UP and DOWN once. to compleate a 4 stroke cycle (1 IVO event), the crank has to rotate 720*. so at 6000rpm's, the piston will compleate 3000 720* rotations in 1 minute. 3000/60 (min - sec) = 50.
so at 6000 rpm every valve opens 50 times per second. and theres 8! intake valves. rigghhtt. ALLLLLL the nitrous just decided to enter on ONE of those cyl's in what, a thousanth of a second? seems entirely feasible....
i think on that note, and the fact that the car was BACKFIRING should be a hint that it was something else.
11-19-2009, 09:02 AM
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This is accorate. I have been down that road. I can assure you, it is in the tunup. If the jets are not plugged up with garbage. This is a hard row to hoe.
I Would like to see you spray a 150 shot on this intake. It makes sense what he is saying about it not having enough time to properly mix, it just shot into one cylinder. If you guys don't want to take someones advice then don't, test it out your self and see what happens, maybe you will figure out a way to do it, maybe you wont.
You are correct about to much fuel going.. If you read what he said in a post, all of the fuel, and nitrous from the hit didn't have enough time to mix and shot into which ever cylinder was going to fire at the time because it forced it into the cylinder hole.
I think all he is saying is there isn't enough time for everything to mix which will cause this.
You are correct about to much fuel going.. If you read what he said in a post, all of the fuel, and nitrous from the hit didn't have enough time to mix and shot into which ever cylinder was going to fire at the time because it forced it into the cylinder hole.
I think all he is saying is there isn't enough time for everything to mix which will cause this.
11-24-2009, 12:15 PM
#74
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It won't matter what you say guys..... the intake burned up the plugs, the intake caused the backfire, the intake sucked all the nitrous and fuel into one cylinder, the intake killed the dinosaurs, the intake is what told charles manson to kill all those people, the intake was in the grassy knoll and fired the shot that killed JFK......
no matter how many nitrous experts chime in about tuneups and what not it is pretty obvious that the edelbrock proflow XT intake is pretty much the cause of all that is evil....
no matter how many nitrous experts chime in about tuneups and what not it is pretty obvious that the edelbrock proflow XT intake is pretty much the cause of all that is evil....
11-24-2009, 12:21 PM
#75
It won't matter what you say guys..... the intake burned up the plugs, the intake caused the backfire, the intake sucked all the nitrous and fuel into one cylinder, the intake killed the dinosaurs, the intake is what told charles manson to kill all those people, the intake was in the grassy knoll and fired the shot that killed JFK......
no matter how many nitrous experts chime in about tuneups and what not it is pretty obvious that the edelbrock proflow XT intake is pretty much the cause of all that is evil....
no matter how many nitrous experts chime in about tuneups and what not it is pretty obvious that the edelbrock proflow XT intake is pretty much the cause of all that is evil....
12-01-2009, 12:10 AM
#79
Figured I would throw this out there. The guy that tweaked the OP's tune also tweaked mine. And this is what happened... Blame the tune. http://www.ls1truck.com/forums/pics-...ce-mexico.html