Currdog

Someone clear this up for me. I've heard a bunch of people talk about running dual stage nitrous set ups, but I don't really understand what goes on.

Would you have lets say 100 shot wet, and a 200 shot direct port, from two different kits, flowing into your motor at the same time?
<img border="0" title="" alt="[Eek!]" src="gr_eek2.gif" />
Or, is it more like you use the first stage off the line, and arm the 2nd in 2nd or third gear?

Help me out here. I'm confused. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Confused]" src="images/icons/confused.gif" />

383LQ4SS

iTrader: (33)

On my car I just completed the second stage. Its basically two sepearate kits. In my case a total of approx 250 shot of nitrous (actual). Aprrox 140 on the first stage which is a dry NOS 5177 kit. First stage is armed with its own switch and is activated witha WOT switch. Second stage is a wet kit (although both are fed from the same Nos line) about 110 shot. Also has its own arm swith and WOT switch. The second satge also has a window switch to ensure the 2nd stage only sprays above 4900rpm. That way the engine doesnt see tooo big of a shot down in lower RPMs. Also for the second stage I have a button on the steering wheel that is normally closed and opens when I push it. This button is inline with the second stage switches. I use it for first gear only. Hold it down at the staging line, after launching and going through first gear..i let go of the button when shifting into second and then go through the rest of the gears normally. Keeps from excessive spin in first gear off the line.

rich

I have a nx 2 stage kit it uses 4 solenoids 2 fuel 2 nitrous. The fuel line tees off the fuel rail and runs to both fuel solenoids the nitrous line does the same to the nitrous solenoids. I can ajust the first stagejets from 55hp to 150 hp and the same on the second stage. I have 1 arming switch it arms both stages the wot switch turns on thr first stage and the timer the timer is set for 1 10th of a second to 1 full second then the timer turns on the second stage. I am still putting this system together but I will probally leave on 100hp and the second stage will have 75hp I have a stock motor so I am limted. The timer will be set for 8 tenths and I will see if the car will take it that soon with out spining the tires. I am also looking into a window switch for the second stage just so it don't shift with both stages on so it will save the tranny a little longer. To run these bigger set ups you need to upgrade youf fuel system.

RyanJ

those are SUPER complex. Here's what you need.

One NX wet kit with heater and purge. One NOS fan nozzle. One window switch, one WOT switch, and 2 arming switches.

Basically you just route your purge to a standard style arming switch and run the line to a fan nozzle in your airbox. Basically, instead of purging, you just spray a tad during the burnout. the main arm switch arms it all, and the second is only when BOTH armers are on. that way you get no wet without the dry. Just set your window and wire both stages to it. Should cost maybe $20 extra for the second stage. Also, all you guys are wanting to spray more on the first stage...why? why not spray lightly DRY off the line, for a) less spin and b) the dry pulls 4 degrees of timing. Then i would spray the big shot later when you are already moving...to be a little easier on parts. Thats the way Dave (Silver LS1) did it (10.57 on a stock motor) and pretty much the way Hacker Joe did it. BTW, no reason this HAS to be a NX kit, it can be any wet kit.

Another alternative would be just 2 NX kits with a power ring, or 1 tnt kit with another set of solenoids (running one nozzle off each pair). 2-stage wet/wet. same concept.

basically what im saying is i think the one up above these are VERY cool, and quite nice...but ANY two stage is not gonna be all together safe. i mean, as much as you razzle dazzle it, you NEEEEEEEED racegas, and you NEEEEED good plugs and lower timing. thats a **** load of gas for a motor (not LQ4SS's motor, but a stock motor). My car is ready for a rebuild this year or next and it'll be forged bottom and 2-stage time. Ill do it cheap though.

Also, FWIW, a BIG 200+ TNT shot on a big 422 with a nice progessive controller would waste a two stage if set up right. with traction and all. just food for thought.

383LQ4SS

iTrader: (33)

The Judge..great post. Good info for someone who wants a simpler two stage on a budget...but I like all the "razzle dazzle". My car is not a race only car and is a daily driver so i like all the bells and whistles and like to be unique. I like the idea of having the ability to select either stage independantly or together. I can select either 100 wet, 150 dry, or if needed 250 total.

A few things i didnt mention that add to the complexity of my set up are:

* a seperate tank with its own pump and regulator for the wet stage. This will be filled with race gas and will be activated when the second stage arming switch is on.

* Nitrogen push system (already installed and working) Pushes nitrous out with a seperate nitrogen tank and regulator. Mainatins perfect nitrous psi all the way through a run with no pressure drop off. No bottle heaters.

* indicator lights in the cockpit that come on when the stages are armed AND when they are spraying. First stage reads READY in green when armed. Second stage reads AIM in amber when armed. When either stage is spraying it reads FIRE!. READY, AIM, FIRE! <img border="0" alt="[guns]" title="" src="graemlins/gr_guns.gif" />

Like I said...I love all the bells and whistles. But thats just me.

Heres a link to some pics of the nitrogen setup and the indicators. nitous panel

<small>[ April 16, 2002, 02:20 AM: Message edited by: 383LQ4SS ]</small>

2K2 LS1

iTrader: (2)

I was running a dual stage nos setup on my 01. I had an a4 with mac headers, ported maf, free mods, lid and a 2stage setup. We ran a 100 dry off the line, and hit a second stage(100wet) before the 60' marker. It was also a great street setup. I manage with above mods and a stock internal, stock rearend, and stock convertor to go a 10.89@126, and several 11.1's. In my oppinion it is one of the safer setups if you run a nos fuel pump and race gas as we did.

Brad H
2002 M6 Z28
few boltons
381rwhp/396rwtq
12.2@117(on a bad clutch)
<img src="http://www.dfwstangs.net/hosting/2K2_LS1/2k2ls1_sig.jpg" alt="" />

Here's a pic of the dual setup on my car:
<img src="http://64.81.114.233/hosting/Cmarsh93z/dualstage1.jpg" alt="" />

<small>[ April 16, 2002, 08:37 AM: Message edited by: 2K2 LS1 ]</small>

Slowhawk

iTrader: (12)

These setups all look nice,but Why not use a progressive controller?Plug in a 200 shot and control the hit with the controller.I just installed the NX F.R.E.D unit on my friends car and it works the *****.

2K2 LS1

iTrader: (2)

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Originally posted by Slowhawk:
<strong>These setups all look nice,but Why not use a progressive controller?Plug in a 200 shot and control the hit with the controller.I just installed the NX F.R.E.D unit on my friends car and it works the *****.</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Well the progressive shot was not that popular a year and a half ago realy. I plan to run a progressive shot on the 02' though. Can't wait to make 405 rwhp on stock heads, and then follow it up with a progressive 150 shot. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Eek!]" src="gr_eek2.gif" />

<img src="http://www.dfwstangs.net/hosting/2K2_LS1/2K2trackbeast.JPG" alt="" />

Currdog

So, in everyone's opinion, would it be better for me to be considering a progressive controller, and keep my tnt f2 kit (running a 200 shot)? Or should I be looking at a progressive controller and a direct port setup?

This is for a MTI built 422, built with nitrous in mind....

Thanks

2K2 LS1

iTrader: (2)

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Originally posted by Currdog:
<strong>
This is for a MTI built 422, built with nitrous in mind....

Thanks</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">In that case go 400 fogger <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="gr_images/icons/wink.gif" />

Pro Stock John

iTrader: (34)

What injectors and fuel system do you have?

I helped put together HackerJoe's nitrous system back in 1999. He went 11.49 with 150 NX wet shot, and then we added the homemade second stage, which was dry.

I would do a 2 stage for streetracing. You might not need it all. But the direct port is the most efficient.

If I two staged my car I would do 75-100 dry and 150 wet. I would come out on dry like Judge suggested, and have the wet hit at the tree. We used NOS plume nozzle stuff for the 2nd dry stage. Placement will really affect how hard it hits.

I have 40 lb injectors and a 255lph intank fuel pump. I am good for 650rwhp but maybe 700rwhp for short bursts.

Currdog

PSJ,

I am running 42# injectors, and a vortech t-rex fuel pump. Why would you do a two-stage for street racing? (Not trying to be a jackass here, just trying to understand)

Thanks

Pro Stock John

iTrader: (34)

I would install a bigger intank fuel pump for either a two stage or a direct port. The inline really is marginal.

I would two stage for street racing because you might not need both stages.

chasgiv3

iTrader: (1)

Are the progressive controllers RPM dependant? I used 2 MSD RPM window switches to kick off my stages.

1st stage on at WOT and above 3400RPM all the way to 6600RPM.

2nd stage was on a WOT and above 4800RPM all the way up to 6600RPM.

My redline was 7000RPM. So I would never hit the rev limiter with the nitrous on with the switches.

I tired running a big shot out of the hole and would just smoke the tires. With the two stage I could adjust for conditions and tires.

The only bad thing about my setup was the fact that it would max out the MAF and the tuning would pour fuel into the motor leaving me running VERY fat.

Currdog

PSJ,
Gotcha. Somehow I managed to end up doing more street racing than track racing (almost nil at the track)

Your saying theres no reason to use it in every race, since the majority will go down to just the 422+ a 100 or 150 shot.

Save the second stage for the big guns...

Makes sense, the progressive controller wouldn't allow me a similar level of control?

Pro Stock John

iTrader: (34)

I like Chas' example with the two window switches, you would have a lot of control off the rpm at which the stages are activated or activatable.

Back in my M6 I hit the rev limiter on spray twice and each time I got very scared.