NXRICKY

iTrader: (1)

Ok FJO has released their new widebands that are smaller and less expensive then before. The technology in building these allows them to go into a much smaller package, which does cost less then the larger boxes. These new singel units with The Digital Bus system allows you to buy one unit at a time and plug other box into it as time and budget allows. You could have 8 o2 monitoring if you want.With the air fuel gauge, still show you leanest channel.
Retail pricing on the NON data logging unit is 199.00 w/o sensor, and 248.75 with data logging. The 248.75 allow you to monitor rpm and has the analayis software package so you can review the data. These newer unit also allow the enduser to plug then into tuning software, HP etc. And it still can be mounted anywhere in/under the car if need be.
Here is the page from FJO site that talks about this new product.
WideBand Page
Download Page

Feel free to pm me or call if you have any questions. This is still new to me and learning what all it can do.
http://www.fjoracing.com/images/kwb4001_med.jpg


Ricky

Chris@NitroDaves

FJO does it again.....

-Chris

Robert56

iTrader: (2)

FJO does listen to the end users. That was a complaint in the past, wouldn't connect to all products. Kudos to FJO.
Robert

Johnny5

iTrader: (2)

So can you use that for any AFR gauge or just the FJO ones?

98redorangeta

iTrader: (10)

Would this system be good for some one who is moving it around a lot and putting it in a lot of different cars? Or would it be better suited to stay in one car?

NXRICKY

iTrader: (1)

If you are using the FJO Digital gauge, it gets wired to the digital data wire. If you want to use a non-FJO gauge then you first need to know what the input curve is (volts to AFR) and what the input impedance is. If the gauge curve operates between 0~5 volts and has a 50K ohm or higher input impedance, you will be able to program the 2nd analog output to match the gauge's curve. The KWB4001 comes with the software and cable to do this, however the KWB4000 does not so you will need to make your own cable and download the software.

Note: using a gauge that measures voltage requires that the grounds are connected to the same point otherwise the gauge may not accurately display the AFR. eg. for a linear 0~5v scale that corresponds to 10~20 AFR, a 1v change = 2AFR change. This means that if your gauge ground is off by 0.25v from the wideband ground point, you have introduced a 0.5AFR error. A 0.25v potential difference between 2 ground points on a car is not uncommon, especially when one is in the engine bay and the other is in the passenger compartment. The problem gets worse if you are trying to use a simulated narrowband range of 1~0v for 10~20 AFR. In this case a 0.20v offset results in a 1AFR error - making the reading all but useless. It is for this reason that FJO does not use a voltage (analog) gauge.

NXRICKY

iTrader: (1)

You would need 02 bungs for all the different locations you need. But yes you can move this around, and go from car to car.

Ricky

jester1

iTrader: (1)

So lets get this straight. It datalogs, and I can run two sensors to read both banks, independantly or is it an average?

SILVERZZ28

iTrader: (3)

Will this work injunction with the MaxII controller

LS1SpeedAddict

iTrader: (9)

Will this tie into my progressive nitrous mini controller in any way? Is it able to shut down my nitrous system if I become too lean?

TrickChassis

iTrader: (8)

i was looking at the retail prices and they want, $200 for the NTK SENSOR?????? cant u get them at a parts store for 60-80?

1QUIKWS6

iTrader: (61)

I'm fairly sure there are (2) different sensors available: One should be a Bosch which is normally around $70

TrickChassis

iTrader: (8)

Thats what i was thinking i knew they were not 200 i will check out bosh, thanks.

terry s

iTrader: (5)

The expensive 02 sensor is for leaded fuel.

TrickChassis

iTrader: (8)

dam so if i want to run race fuel att he track, and then pump gas for around town i need 2 expensive sensors, one for each bank?

NXRICKY

iTrader: (1)

Heres the link to the FJO page that talks about the controller.
http://www.fjoracing.com/products/WBAFR/
http://www.fjoracing.com/products/WBAFR/downloads.php

Ricky

AzzHauler

iTrader: (3)

Wtf is the reasoning behind locking one analog output to their 'legacy' output? I'm not familiar with their other products, but just looking at the voltage outputs on that scale makes me think ...durrrr... Hopefully it's a good product though, I'd like to see what users have to say in the near future.

NXRICKY

iTrader: (1)

Call them and ask, I am sure they can explain it better then I. I would think that locking one output to their product means it would work flawlessly. but that just me. You can plug it into a tuning software if you like.
Ricky

stealth71

iTrader: (15)

Does anyone know what the difference is that allows it to hook into the tuning software? What input is the tuning software looking for?

TrickChassis

iTrader: (8)

Question:




How come it seems like only the Innovate wideband sensors are very sensitive? I have never heard of watershock (condensation) or silicone-poisoning very to o2 sensors until now. My friends have the AEM
wideband, PLX, and the FJO widebands and they NEVER have to warm up their cars first then heat up the sensor so it doesn't crack from watershock. Having to buy $90.00 sensors is ridiculous. To me it sounds like these are cheap sensors that will go defective easily so Innovate makes money. o2 sensors are rugged for a reason, and condensation shouldn't affect anything or even silicon poisoning. Why does the sensor have to calibrate for air and heat? No other widebands have to do that? I was going to buy this wideband but now I am thinking twice after I read these forums how people always have erratic air/fuel readings and getting error codes on their lm-1

Answer:

The sensor is the same Bosch LSU4.2 unit used by everyone. It is a stock OEM part for Volkswagen, and others.

Quote:
I have never heard of watershock (condensation) or silicone-poisoning very to o2 sensors until now.
OEMs like VW are pretty good about placing the sensor in a spot that does not collect water. They may have blown a few sensors finding a good spot When you are welding on a bung from under a car, sometimes your options are limited.

They also know better than to let loose silicone get to the sensor. It does damage the sensors and change their output.

But .....

The analog based wideband meters (AEM, PLX, et al ) may not be able to detect a damaged sensor and just go on giving bad data. How would they know ??? Any meter that uses the standard Bosch WB controller chipset does not analyze the sensor in real-time. They just go by the factory calibration resistor that comes on the sensor.

Which gives rise to...

Quote:
Why does the sensor have to calibrate for air and heat? No other widebands have to do that?
No other widebands can do that. If you don't calibrate the system, you are relying on the calibration resistor on the sensor that was set to match the sensor output at the factory. The sensors change over time ( especially when run rich ); often as little as a 3 or 4 hours. And then, the calibration is off. But how will you know ???? It will still always be accurate right at 14.7AFR so you can't check it that way.... But now 13.0 is really 11.9 ? 12.3 is really 14.0 ? How will you check it ? In OEM applications the sensor is almost always run at 14.7AFR; so it does not drift nearly as quickly as on a tuner car running 12.0AFR or richer.

Every time you do a re-calibrate of a sensor on an LM-1, it adjusts for any changes in the sensor over time. As long as it's not damaged, it is accurate like a new sensor again. And, in the process, it can detect damaged sensors, etc.

I wonder what would happen if you put a sensor with a damaged ( but not open or shorted ) or just aged pump-cell on an AEM meter ? It can't analyze the pump resistance... so it would assume all is well and give bogus data thinking that the calibration resistor info is still valid ????

I don't really know the answer to that. Maybe I should do an experiment

But if it does, and it shows 12.5 when the real AFR is 14.1, at WOT... Bad things are going to happen. Could be game over.

I'd rather get an error code.