HitmanLSX

http://seattletimes.nwsource.com/htm...ssions21m.html


It passed

howierd42

According to that article our cars are exempt.

It would only apply to NEW cars bought after 2009. And it would be the dealer's problem.

HitmanLSX

hmmm just read that the new bill may be against federal law since the two options were federal OR california not pick and choose which parts... Hopefully this will completely reject the bill and they'll give up, not to mention it puts the hands of the law in california politicians who we didn't vote in

howierd42

And Oregon. This whole thing is contingent upon them adopting the same bill.

HitmanLSX

Yeah but it limits our options as well in the future. For example the new 2005 E320 CDI diesel doesn't meet california emissions and yet it gets nearly double the gas mileage of the gas E320. Dunno if the VW TDI's meet cali emissions either. which is a lot of what VW sells here because of their mileage. Dodge's high-output Cummins is another one.

HitmanLSX

Ok oregon keep your heads on straight!

Z ANGEL

They might as well start calling us lil california...

If California is so Great, why is everyone moving up here? That alone should be telling the Govt. something, if they would just open their eyes! My parents are talking about moving to another state, bieng retired, they can't afford to live here anymore

NautyAngel

Sad but true is that while we (those opposed, collectively) were sitting around saying "no, that isnt right, someone should call the reps and tell them so" someone else WAS calling their reps ... the asthma & allergy crowd who have children who suffer from these ailments and do not realize that this emissions law will not do a thing for them. How do I know? Because my children fall into this category and I read the messages and e-mails on the subject. I know this law wont do a damn thing for air quality, but most do not.

So, those are not that many people and they really could not have made a difference, you say? Guess what ... these are the same people who initiated and fueled to passage the recent Food Allergy Labeling law. Now THAT is a great law, and long overdue, but it never would have happened without these parents. They also just pushed thru new state legislature on allowing school-age children to carry their own inhalers and epi-pens as well as allowing paramedics to administer epi, which was a MAJOR thing, and the schools were against it.

What is my point? Next time someone says "If you believe (or dont) in this bill, call your rep ... call this number", don't just talk about it, DO IT!

Z ANGEL

Very Well Said!

GEARHED

iTrader: (5)

N Angel: Inslee, Murray & Cantwell are on my email cc group, so are other politicos depending on the issue. I posted the "report" to shove this thing through was baseless but guess no one cared enough to do anything about it. Same thing for the proposal for a NASCAR track north of Marysville - some went to the meetings, most whined.

What is really odd are the responses I get back and timing, sometimes immediately, sometimes *after* a bill has passed. Cantwell is an airhead who will only respond with a standard form letter that adresses the issue; Inslee has a staff that will respond unless you are very specific; Murray responds with what her ideas are and how she will vote.

This does nothing for air quality short or long term. There is no addressing how expanded building and removal of natural 'cleaning' barriers has taken its toll on the Puget Sound air quality and no movement on a rail system that would reduce major corridor polutants. Hitting up individual car owners is not a solution - providing telecommuting, massive incentives for car pooling and a rail system would at least attack a fraction of pollution in our area.

Of course I'm not sure what to expect when we can't even have our votes counted properly on a major election....

WAHUSKER

iTrader: (4)

As long as they don't try to make it retro, I think we're OK. As for diesels, they do get better mileage, but they also expel 100 times the solid pollutants, aka carsenogens.

howierd42

Every one knows that if you want to get a law passed, no matter how stupid it is, all you have to do is find some angle towards children. That's what they did here. Just like Nauty pointed out, it was the children's asthma that they used, knowing full well that it has nothing to do with that. This state is soooooo @*&$ed up!

HitmanLSX

Vote me god emperor of Earth

All auto manufacturers will be required to have at least one RWD sports coupe with V8's and manual transmissions. Idiot politicians will not be tolerated, legacy's will get a discount on college tuition but no guarantees of a degree if they're morons.

NautyAngel

Ok, I am going to start out by saying that I do not mean to be offensive to you guys or anyone else who thought this, but hope to open your eyes a bit.

The above statements are exactly the kind of lacadasical attitude that those on the other side and the politicians who get something out of the deal are hoping for and love!

"It would only apply to NEW cars bought after 2009" So, what happens if they do bring back the F-Body and you want to buy yourself a nice shiny 2010 to mod?? Then it IS your problem.

"As long as they don't try to make it retro, I think we're OK." And what happens if the DO use this base law to make it retro ? Then it is YOUR problem.

You CANNOT wait until something becomes your problem ... you need to act BEFORE it becomes your problem. It is SO easy to say "let someone else worry about it", but if you do that then you have NO ROOM to bitch when suddenly it is knocking on your doorstep. This same attitude is alot of what has gotten our government so crooked and screwed up, because it just wasnt "our problem".

To put it another way ... say your buddy sees a leak in your head gasket but says "well, it doesnt effect me, as long as he wont be asking me to fix it" and doesnt mention it to you (yeah, I know, chances are you would see it on your own, but just bear with me on this!) ... well, later on, forgetting about his attitude towards this leak, or that it even existed, said buddy now wants to buy your car. Well, if he had mentioned that leak back when, he would not be dealing with a blown head two months after buying it, now would he?

Here you have misunderstood me, and this is NOT true at all. This same community had FOUGHT for many things .... yes, saying "the children" .... and lost because it either did not benefit the reps involved or there was enought of an opposition screaming louder to make the reps believe that this would make their constituents happy, thus ensuring them another term (sounds jaded, yes, but often as not its true). Those who initiated and backed this bill never ONCE thought about "the children" ... they never "used" this "angle" ... the parents who are concerned on such subjects picked it up because they spend alot of time examining what bills are coming up, then THEY - the parents - started pushing it as a good bill.

TwoFast4Lv

iTrader: (8)

Actually Angi If you look they do use the children to shove just about every thing over here into laws we ahte. It is Incredible how they do it. They bring the children in and miss-inform the house wives who brow beat there Husbands into oblivion and make this stuff happen. Worse part is alot of the men over are so beat down by there insain wives they have no choice

I just can't wait to see how they are going to use the school closures to tax the entire state into paying for them!

NautyAngel

I know that there were people who did call and write on this side. I also know that politicians can be very lazy ... such as in this case, rather than taking the time to figure out what really made SENSE, just doing what looked easy. However, as I stated, I also know that there was a large push of people that the politicians are familiar with, having worked with them more than once in the last 6 months on other bills, who were shouting alot louder.

And yeah ... the thought that they can't even get an election done right, much less take the time to actually *research* something DOES come to mind!

Tranzor

Gotta agree with the above post... once they tighten the screws once, they'll keep tightening them until everything is taken away. If you turn up the heat slowly on the frog, he'll sit there and boil to death and not even know it... that's what government does when they want to take something away that we feel strongly about. Do it little at a time so we don't notice until it's too late.

They do the same thing with the 2nd amendment rights... but that's another can of worms all together.

NautyAngel

Ok, yes, I agree with this to some extent. This IS definitely done. I think what I was trying to get at is that was not really the case in this instance. What I saw on the other side (the allergy and asthma groups) was not the people who had initiated this bill or been a part of the original push for it, but rather some parents who make it their business to examine every new bill proposed to see if it could remotely effect their children. Having found something that to them looked promising and threw their weight behind it and used their connections to make their desires know.

Politicians are crooked, plain and simple. They may say they are not, and they may even THINK that they are not, but bottom line is that they do not look at things the same way as the rest of us. They do whatever they think it takes to get theirs.

ram-it

Gearhed,

It's great to see you posting up here after a little absence. Gotta say you should come join us for beers sometime so you can rub off on my wife!!!

GEARHED

iTrader: (5)

sorry

I keep saying I'm going to make it for a few but the car is running like crap - but thanks for asking. We are still sorting a load of horseshit since husband got back from Afghanistan.

Now, about your wife...how corrupt do you want her to be? Because it could get *very* expensive if you think about it
I need parameters before leaving the tree if ya know what I mean