HELP ME BREAK 12s !!!
HELP ME BREAK 12s !!! Welp, I managed to get a 13.050 @ 103.53 with just removed torque management, removed shift delay, a SSF 3500 shiftkit, trans cooler, and some M/T ET streets. Im headed back to the track again friday. I know there is more tunning I can do, but not sure what. Any help or ideas would be great!!! I wanna break into the 12's! Laters 
Well, I wasnt stalling the car up to 3000rpm, I was stalling it up to about 2000rpm. Wasnt sure how well it would hold with the ET streets on. Didnt wanna red light, or end up creeping past the stage lights like a moron. Think I could stall it up higher with a heated up set of semi slicks like that? That should in theory break me into the 12s.
TECH Apprentice
Joined: Nov 2001
Posts: 387
Likes: 0
From: South Elgin, IL
First, I'm not sure what to say. I ran better than your time when my '02 A4 only had a lid and cat-back, full weight and on Nittos.
I don't think you'll find a whole lot more with just a tune.
I don't think you'll find a whole lot more with just a tune.
Save your stock tune, first.
There is probably some RWT/RWHP to gain by
pushing the spark advance up and perhaps
leaning the WOT mixture. Start by logging
track pulls (or highway 60-85MPH punches)
looking for KR, total advance and O2 voltages
B1S1 and B2S1 along with RPM, MAP.
If O2s run over 920mV you may want to shave
on the PE-vs-RPM table, at least above 3KRPM.
If your MAP dips below ambient by more than
about 0.2 PSI at the top end, you have inlet
tract restrictions that are worth checking out.
If (say) your pre-cranking MAP (or BARO) is
14.7PSI and you see it stay above 14.5PSI
for the whole WOT runup then intake side is
not holding you back substantially.
If the fueling has your O2s running about
900mV and you are not getting KR during the
run, you aren't trying hard enough. Copy the
high octane table to the low octane table and
subtract 4 from all the new low-octane cells.
Push up the high-octane table timing values
in cells over 0.6 g/cyl, and over 3000RPM by
a degree, run again, check KR. Lather, rinse,
repeat (subsequent times, you will want to
"blend" the "corner" to eliminate abrupt jumps).
When you find the first tenths-of-degree of KR
step back one tune (you should save each
tune in a separate file, for easy back-out).
I saw some pretty substantial increase in lb-ft
Delivered Torque off just a couple of degrees
spark advance. Not that that PID is a real
authority, but a little spark optimization (and
toys like the Predator push 6 degrees as their
"install performance" tune) can net you a nice
little pop.
There is probably some RWT/RWHP to gain by
pushing the spark advance up and perhaps
leaning the WOT mixture. Start by logging
track pulls (or highway 60-85MPH punches)
looking for KR, total advance and O2 voltages
B1S1 and B2S1 along with RPM, MAP.
If O2s run over 920mV you may want to shave
on the PE-vs-RPM table, at least above 3KRPM.
If your MAP dips below ambient by more than
about 0.2 PSI at the top end, you have inlet
tract restrictions that are worth checking out.
If (say) your pre-cranking MAP (or BARO) is
14.7PSI and you see it stay above 14.5PSI
for the whole WOT runup then intake side is
not holding you back substantially.
If the fueling has your O2s running about
900mV and you are not getting KR during the
run, you aren't trying hard enough. Copy the
high octane table to the low octane table and
subtract 4 from all the new low-octane cells.
Push up the high-octane table timing values
in cells over 0.6 g/cyl, and over 3000RPM by
a degree, run again, check KR. Lather, rinse,
repeat (subsequent times, you will want to
"blend" the "corner" to eliminate abrupt jumps).
When you find the first tenths-of-degree of KR
step back one tune (you should save each
tune in a separate file, for easy back-out).
I saw some pretty substantial increase in lb-ft
Delivered Torque off just a couple of degrees
spark advance. Not that that PID is a real
authority, but a little spark optimization (and
toys like the Predator push 6 degrees as their
"install performance" tune) can net you a nice
little pop.
All I basically have is a converter, and Im full weight aswell, and my tires arent much better than Nittos.. I also have a set of those. So Im not sure how thats a big deal. Youve got more mods than me.
Originally Posted by Windy City
First, I'm not sure what to say. I ran better than your time when my '02 A4 only had a lid and cat-back, full weight and on Nittos.
I don't think you'll find a whole lot more with just a tune.
I don't think you'll find a whole lot more with just a tune.
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Ya, Ive saved my stock tune long time ago, Ive since screwed around with tunes awhile. But thanks for all that info, gives me some direction to go into, I will forsure have some fun with that trying some stuff out at the track this weekend. 
Originally Posted by jimmyblue
Save your stock tune, first.
There is probably some RWT/RWHP to gain by
pushing the spark advance up and perhaps
leaning the WOT mixture. Start by logging
track pulls (or highway 60-85MPH punches)
looking for KR, total advance and O2 voltages
B1S1 and B2S1 along with RPM, MAP.
If O2s run over 920mV you may want to shave
on the PE-vs-RPM table, at least above 3KRPM.
If your MAP dips below ambient by more than
about 0.2 PSI at the top end, you have inlet
tract restrictions that are worth checking out.
If (say) your pre-cranking MAP (or BARO) is
14.7PSI and you see it stay above 14.5PSI
for the whole WOT runup then intake side is
not holding you back substantially.
If the fueling has your O2s running about
900mV and you are not getting KR during the
run, you aren't trying hard enough. Copy the
high octane table to the low octane table and
subtract 4 from all the new low-octane cells.
Push up the high-octane table timing values
in cells over 0.6 g/cyl, and over 3000RPM by
a degree, run again, check KR. Lather, rinse,
repeat (subsequent times, you will want to
"blend" the "corner" to eliminate abrupt jumps).
When you find the first tenths-of-degree of KR
step back one tune (you should save each
tune in a separate file, for easy back-out).
I saw some pretty substantial increase in lb-ft
Delivered Torque off just a couple of degrees
spark advance. Not that that PID is a real
authority, but a little spark optimization (and
toys like the Predator push 6 degrees as their
"install performance" tune) can net you a nice
little pop.
There is probably some RWT/RWHP to gain by
pushing the spark advance up and perhaps
leaning the WOT mixture. Start by logging
track pulls (or highway 60-85MPH punches)
looking for KR, total advance and O2 voltages
B1S1 and B2S1 along with RPM, MAP.
If O2s run over 920mV you may want to shave
on the PE-vs-RPM table, at least above 3KRPM.
If your MAP dips below ambient by more than
about 0.2 PSI at the top end, you have inlet
tract restrictions that are worth checking out.
If (say) your pre-cranking MAP (or BARO) is
14.7PSI and you see it stay above 14.5PSI
for the whole WOT runup then intake side is
not holding you back substantially.
If the fueling has your O2s running about
900mV and you are not getting KR during the
run, you aren't trying hard enough. Copy the
high octane table to the low octane table and
subtract 4 from all the new low-octane cells.
Push up the high-octane table timing values
in cells over 0.6 g/cyl, and over 3000RPM by
a degree, run again, check KR. Lather, rinse,
repeat (subsequent times, you will want to
"blend" the "corner" to eliminate abrupt jumps).
When you find the first tenths-of-degree of KR
step back one tune (you should save each
tune in a separate file, for easy back-out).
I saw some pretty substantial increase in lb-ft
Delivered Torque off just a couple of degrees
spark advance. Not that that PID is a real
authority, but a little spark optimization (and
toys like the Predator push 6 degrees as their
"install performance" tune) can net you a nice
little pop.
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Verdad Gallardo TECH Apprentice
Joined: Nov 2001
Posts: 387
Likes: 0
From: South Elgin, IL
All I basically have is a converter, and Im full weight aswell, and my tires arent much better than Nittos.. I also have a set of those. So Im not sure how thats a big deal. Youve got more mods than me.
My point is, I think you have other things to look at before you try to tweak out a few HP with tuning on a stock motor. You asked help me break 12's, well with what you have you should be WELL into the 12's. With a Yank ST-3800 I went 12.6. Added Mac's and a pulley and went 12.1 @ 109.
If O2s run over 920mV you may want to shave
on the PE-vs-RPM table, at least above 3KRPM.
on the PE-vs-RPM table, at least above 3KRPM.
Another point you didn't mention is his LTRIMS. A positive LTRIM will continue to add fuel at WOT in the assumption that if it's running lean at part throttle, it'll run lean at WOT so the PCM keeps adding the fuel. Scale your injector flow rate to lower your LTRIMS to zero or a slightly negative number. Do this before you start to tweak your PE values.