What intake manifold would you run on this setup?
06-11-2019, 09:15 AM
#1
What intake manifold would you run on this setup? Im looking for suggestions on an Intake manifold as well as info on t/b.
Car is a 2000 trans am, Stock heads, Long tubes, ws6store hlhc Nothing too crazy at all.
Im trying to find an upgrade path that I can peice together over time. One item on that list is intake manifold. I see alot of flow number charts and "should I get this if I have this" threads, Is XXX intake manifold better than XXX, mostly comparisons of LS6 to FAST. Ive read about buying 1 intake manifold, like a fast 92, and calling it done, rather than a ls6 and then a fast 92. Then there are hybrid ported manifolds, etc...My car may never have head work done for all I know right now the only big change in my current setup to come is a yank ss3600 ( I hope)
Right now I have a stock throttle body. So Im thinking I should go for a fast 92, but I want to run my stock t/b. Is this pointless or do I need a bigger t/b too?
Other upgrade is going to be converter, which may make sense to do before the intake manifold? All 3 at once (t/b, intake manifold, stall) would be ideal but then after a tune Im looking at close to $2500, about $1500 more than I want to spend for all 3 lol. For all I know Id need injectors too for the new manifold/tb too.
What path would you guys who are more knowledgeable take? Budget in mind but you want to go faster? I know there are a lot of tricks to this hobby as well as upgrades that can be done for cheaper than going online and buying a brand new part. Im looking for used parts but can not seem to find anything on here or c-list. Ive heard just bolting a ls6 manifold on is kind of a waste of time anymore for 10hp gain, but if thats the option...ill consider it.
Car is a 2000 trans am, Stock heads, Long tubes, ws6store hlhc Nothing too crazy at all.
Im trying to find an upgrade path that I can peice together over time. One item on that list is intake manifold. I see alot of flow number charts and "should I get this if I have this" threads, Is XXX intake manifold better than XXX, mostly comparisons of LS6 to FAST. Ive read about buying 1 intake manifold, like a fast 92, and calling it done, rather than a ls6 and then a fast 92. Then there are hybrid ported manifolds, etc...My car may never have head work done for all I know right now the only big change in my current setup to come is a yank ss3600 ( I hope)
Right now I have a stock throttle body. So Im thinking I should go for a fast 92, but I want to run my stock t/b. Is this pointless or do I need a bigger t/b too?
Other upgrade is going to be converter, which may make sense to do before the intake manifold? All 3 at once (t/b, intake manifold, stall) would be ideal but then after a tune Im looking at close to $2500, about $1500 more than I want to spend for all 3 lol. For all I know Id need injectors too for the new manifold/tb too.
What path would you guys who are more knowledgeable take? Budget in mind but you want to go faster? I know there are a lot of tricks to this hobby as well as upgrades that can be done for cheaper than going online and buying a brand new part. Im looking for used parts but can not seem to find anything on here or c-list. Ive heard just bolting a ls6 manifold on is kind of a waste of time anymore for 10hp gain, but if thats the option...ill consider it.
Last edited by trilkb; 06-11-2019 at 09:20 AM.
06-11-2019, 09:26 AM
#2
I would make the convertor my #1 priority if I was you. I have the SS3600 and love it.
As for intakes,I'm assuming you have the LS1 currently. Going to an LS6 likely wouldn't gain you enough to make it worthwhile. The size of the throttle body is the main reason to upgrade imo. I would get either the fast 92 or the dorman LS2 myself. Afaik they both will use your stock rails and injectors so much easier to swap in than a 102 or other options.
As for intakes,I'm assuming you have the LS1 currently. Going to an LS6 likely wouldn't gain you enough to make it worthwhile. The size of the throttle body is the main reason to upgrade imo. I would get either the fast 92 or the dorman LS2 myself. Afaik they both will use your stock rails and injectors so much easier to swap in than a 102 or other options.
06-11-2019, 09:48 AM
#5
I would make the convertor my #1 priority if I was you. I have the SS3600 and love it.
As for intakes,I'm assuming you have the LS1 currently. Going to an LS6 likely wouldn't gain you enough to make it worthwhile. The size of the throttle body is the main reason to upgrade imo. I would get either the fast 92 or the dorman LS2 myself. Afaik they both will use your stock rails and injectors so much easier to swap in than a 102 or other options.
As for intakes,I'm assuming you have the LS1 currently. Going to an LS6 likely wouldn't gain you enough to make it worthwhile. The size of the throttle body is the main reason to upgrade imo. I would get either the fast 92 or the dorman LS2 myself. Afaik they both will use your stock rails and injectors so much easier to swap in than a 102 or other options.
Other 2 responses...not looking for that.
The only other thing in my head is I can get a LS6, since I probably need to do intake manifold gaskets and sell my ls1 manifold and hopefully only have 100-150 into the ls6 manifold. But that brings me back to the T/B problem. What are budget T/B options?
Last edited by trilkb; 06-11-2019 at 09:58 AM.
06-11-2019, 04:57 PM
#6
Trilkb,
Here's my opinion on your inquiries.
1) The new torque converter will have the most impact so I would do that first.
2) Your 2000 TA has #26 injectors which with a good stock fuel & filter can be stretched to support up to 450 whp. Used to do that the all the time back in 1999-2003. My 99 TA made 418 whp on #26 injectors with no issues for 15 years
. If your tune and fuel pump are good the car should be OK on injectors.
3) Mike Morris often has used #36 pound injectors for sale for $75 to $100 in the LS1Tech market place if you want bigger injectors for a tight budget.
4) Pretty much any intake other than the LS4 is light years better than the bottom of the barrel LS1 intake. So any new intake will be better than the LS1
$350 to $400 for a used LS6
$700 to $750 for a used LS6 with the 90mm snout mod
$550 to $650 for a used 90/92 Fast
$375 to $425 for a Dorman LS2, plu TB bracket etc
102 Fast $700 to $900 plus fuel rails
My flow testing had the 90mm LS6 and 90mm Fast basically equal. The $350 90mm snout is a great mid if you already have an LS6 intake. Otherwise, the 90/92 mm Fast is a better deal.
For your set up I think a 90/92 Fast would be ideal with a 92mm TB. The Dorman LS2 is good but the Fast 90 is better based my flow testing.
5) The 78mm stock TB is definitely a choke point. Porting my stock LS1 TB was worth 3 whp on the dyno even with the suck-tacular LS1 intake. WARR Performance can provide a quality inexpensive 92mm or 102mm throttle body for less than $150. You can move the sensors from your stock TB to the WARR TB. There are cheaper TB's some for as little a $65 on ebay but a lit of them are leaky junk.
Best wishes with your project.
Here's my opinion on your inquiries.
1) The new torque converter will have the most impact so I would do that first.
2) Your 2000 TA has #26 injectors which with a good stock fuel & filter can be stretched to support up to 450 whp. Used to do that the all the time back in 1999-2003. My 99 TA made 418 whp on #26 injectors with no issues for 15 years
. If your tune and fuel pump are good the car should be OK on injectors.3) Mike Morris often has used #36 pound injectors for sale for $75 to $100 in the LS1Tech market place if you want bigger injectors for a tight budget.
4) Pretty much any intake other than the LS4 is light years better than the bottom of the barrel LS1 intake. So any new intake will be better than the LS1
$350 to $400 for a used LS6
$700 to $750 for a used LS6 with the 90mm snout mod
$550 to $650 for a used 90/92 Fast
$375 to $425 for a Dorman LS2, plu TB bracket etc
102 Fast $700 to $900 plus fuel rails
My flow testing had the 90mm LS6 and 90mm Fast basically equal. The $350 90mm snout is a great mid if you already have an LS6 intake. Otherwise, the 90/92 mm Fast is a better deal.
For your set up I think a 90/92 Fast would be ideal with a 92mm TB. The Dorman LS2 is good but the Fast 90 is better based my flow testing.
5) The 78mm stock TB is definitely a choke point. Porting my stock LS1 TB was worth 3 whp on the dyno even with the suck-tacular LS1 intake. WARR Performance can provide a quality inexpensive 92mm or 102mm throttle body for less than $150. You can move the sensors from your stock TB to the WARR TB. There are cheaper TB's some for as little a $65 on ebay but a lit of them are leaky junk.
Best wishes with your project.
06-11-2019, 05:45 PM
#7
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Do a belt driven intake -- procharger!
Kidding. Fast 92 best bet imo
Kidding. Fast 92 best bet imo
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06-11-2019, 06:12 PM
#8
Thanks for the WARR performance recommendation. Its sites like that I don't know about.
I will go for a yank ss3600 first because I also agree it's best bang for buck. I went 12.72 at 111 on an almost stock converter, hoping a yank will get me under 12.5
I will go for a yank ss3600 first because I also agree it's best bang for buck. I went 12.72 at 111 on an almost stock converter, hoping a yank will get me under 12.5
06-11-2019, 07:55 PM
#9
Originally Posted by trilkb
Thanks for the WARR performance recommendation. Its sites like that I don't know about.
I will go for a yank ss3600 first because I also agree it's best bang for buck. I went 12.72 at 111 on an almost stock converter, hoping a yank will get me under 12.5
I will go for a yank ss3600 first because I also agree it's best bang for buck. I went 12.72 at 111 on an almost stock converter, hoping a yank will get me under 12.5
I'd think you might break into the 11's with the converter, very low 12's for sure.
I think blackbird is bang on with his recommendations.
06-12-2019, 07:30 AM
#10
Damn thats crazy.
Yea I guess thats the way to go is the fast 90 or 92 or a tpis modded ls6. I really just wanted to make sure there weren't some budget intakes I was over looking. It does make me curious why a ls1 intake cant be opened up like a ls6 in terms of flow, I guess the ls6 is just physically bigger?
Yea I guess thats the way to go is the fast 90 or 92 or a tpis modded ls6. I really just wanted to make sure there weren't some budget intakes I was over looking. It does make me curious why a ls1 intake cant be opened up like a ls6 in terms of flow, I guess the ls6 is just physically bigger?
06-12-2019, 10:45 AM
#11
Damn thats crazy.
Yea I guess thats the way to go is the fast 90 or 92 or a tpis modded ls6. I really just wanted to make sure there weren't some budget intakes I was over looking. It does make me curious why a ls1 intake cant be opened up like a ls6 in terms of flow, I guess the ls6 is just physically bigger?
Yea I guess thats the way to go is the fast 90 or 92 or a tpis modded ls6. I really just wanted to make sure there weren't some budget intakes I was over looking. It does make me curious why a ls1 intake cant be opened up like a ls6 in terms of flow, I guess the ls6 is just physically bigger?
06-12-2019, 05:45 PM
#14
Damn thats crazy.
Yea I guess thats the way to go is the fast 90 or 92 or a tpis modded ls6. I really just wanted to make sure there weren't some budget intakes I was over looking. It does make me curious why a ls1 intake cant be opened up like a ls6 in terms of flow, I guess the ls6 is just physically bigger?
Yea I guess thats the way to go is the fast 90 or 92 or a tpis modded ls6. I really just wanted to make sure there weren't some budget intakes I was over looking. It does make me curious why a ls1 intake cant be opened up like a ls6 in terms of flow, I guess the ls6 is just physically bigger?
The LS1 intake has three major strikes against it.
1) Plenum volume is smaller LS1 (5.06L) than the LS6 (5.19L)
2) The rounded floor of the LS1 intake less optimized for the style manifold than the flat floor of the LS6.
3) LS1 has less runner volume (.536L) vs LS6 (.541L)
In NA applications the LS6 often has ~20-25 hp advantage over the LS1 intake with a good set ported heads and a good cam.
This give a great overview of various LS intakes on the dyno with the same engine.
LS1 intake results
Peak Power: 535 hp at 6,900 rpm
Peak Torque: 468 lb-ft at 5,100 rpm
LS6
Peak Power: 557 hp at 7,000 rpm
Peak Torque: 483 lb-ft at 5,000 rpm
Hot Rod LS intake test
06-13-2019, 01:13 PM
#15
Shoot Id be beside myself if I went from a 12.7 this year (goal began 14 years ago so I just hit it since im frugal with my money) to 11s with just one mod.
@99 Black Bird T/A Thanks, I think I know what to look for now on the used market. Just depends if any of them come up for sale.
@99 Black Bird T/A Thanks, I think I know what to look for now on the used market. Just depends if any of them come up for sale.
06-18-2019, 12:20 AM
#20
Intake wise, I would try out that new dorman ls2 repalcement for the money vs FAST. I have a tuned up ls6 top end on my 98 ta t56, i have the old 78mm FAST with stock ported tb from bo white. Had the dorman been out at the time, I'd have gone that route. A 92mm tb no brand from ebay have great reviews for around $100 shipped. Unless you find a cheap ls6 intake... They are still great performers with mild cams. I wouldn't do a 92mm or bigger unless you you have an aggressive cam and at least ported 243s. Y2k ls1 full bolt ons and tune... Just find an ls6 intake and port your tb. Even later on if you want bigger... TPIS does a service off cutting the intake snout and plastic welding a 90mm snout and you'd just need a bigger tb. Much cheaper vs fast intake, fast tb, fast fuel rails etc...
What path would you guys who are more knowledgeable take? Budget in mind but you want to go faster? I know there are a lot of tricks to this hobby as well as upgrades that can be done for cheaper than going online and buying a brand new part. Im looking for used parts but can not seem to find anything on here or c-list. Ive heard just bolting a ls6 manifold on is kind of a waste of time anymore for 10hp gain, but if thats the option...ill consider it.[/QUOTE]
What path would you guys who are more knowledgeable take? Budget in mind but you want to go faster? I know there are a lot of tricks to this hobby as well as upgrades that can be done for cheaper than going online and buying a brand new part. Im looking for used parts but can not seem to find anything on here or c-list. Ive heard just bolting a ls6 manifold on is kind of a waste of time anymore for 10hp gain, but if thats the option...ill consider it.[/QUOTE]