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Brand new here, and searching for help desperately.
Have an 02 Yukon xl 1500 Denali package 325k on it. Lifters were singing so I decided I would do an engine refresh. Sent it to my local machinist he did a clean and hone, not much else. I installed all new bearings, rings, and pump of course. Here's where it gets funny, on the advice of a coworker he said since its apart why not cam it? So my inner Tim The Tool Man Taylor said "more power" argghh. Anyway, I put a Truck Norris cam in it from BTR with a set of headers and valve springs, Basically the package they offer at BTR minus the Torque converter. Back story on me and machinist so you know I am at least a little competent. Had him bore a SBC for a mercruiser boat dad owns 30 over. Didn't do anything else to it other than bore and obviously all the required 30 over parts. Well that engine can rip across the lake at 5500 rpm all day long without a hicccup, so I'm capable of building an engine that runs.
The same coworker that told me to put a cam in has HP tuners, We have laid a couple different maps, on cold startup it fires right up, runs for about 3 minutes, then when switching loop it stalls, I need to feather the gas slightly upon restart and play with it for about 20-30 seconds and then it runs fine, or so I thought. I just went for a ride downtown to show off the sound, and about 7 minutes into the ride the engine started popping and sputtering. Only way I got home was to give it about 70% throttle, take off like a bat out of hell and let it idle coast for a bit until I needed some throttle. Then it would start popping and farting again, Give it a ton of throttle and take off again. Oh at stop signs it stalls, restart ok with a little gas. Pull in the driveway let it idle and sat there for about 10 minutes with no issue.
Now to tell you what I see and know. P0300 comes and goes. Oil pressure is 25 to 30 at idle 40+ when giving throttle. Engine temp 206. 14.2 volt charging. Gap .060. Egr system has been programmed out and removed [lug put in hole in intake, Evap system has been programmed out and removed. Downstream o2s have been programmed out and removed.. I don't have it running now, but can run it and pull fuel trim and o2 readings for those that are curious and might be able to help.
I don't know the first thing about Hp Tuners. Are we supposed to tell the program somehow the specs on the cam? My coworker has just been playing with fuel maps.
Any help here would be greatly appreciated, unfortunately I was in an accident and lost my small car, so I NEED to get this running, I have been borrowing cars for 3 weeks, and while It is nice to drive my brothers brand new 3500 duramax, the diesel is killing my wallet.
IMO without a wideband in the truck you are pissing into the wind. Guarantee you your idle air fuel is rich as hell after the Truck Norris install if you have done nothing to the VE table or MAF table.
Until you get your fueling in order after the cam change it's never gonna run right.
No offense intended but it sounds like your buddy with HP Tuners has no idea what he's doing with it.
I am not a tuner by any means but I do try to tune my own stuff learning as I go.
Hopefully someone will take the time to point you in the right direction better than I.
IMO without a wideband in the truck you are pissing into the wind. Guarantee you your idle air fuel is rich as hell after the Truck Norris install if you have done nothing to the VE table or MAF table.
Until you get your fueling in order after the cam change it's never gonna run right.
No offense intended but it sounds like your buddy with HP Tuners has no idea what he's doing with it.
I am not a tuner by any means but I do try to tune my own stuff learning as I go.
Hopefully someone will take the time to point you in the right direction better than I.
No offense taken, he is not a tuner, just has the software, I am open to any and all help I can get pointing me in the right direction. He is going to let me borrow his laptop and the tuner so I can play around with it. Unfortunately he has a business to run, so I can only get him every so often, we make a tweak or two then I try it and tell him what's going on, but it may be a week or two before he can come back.
So first things first, 2 wideband sensors? 1 for each bank? Can these be controlled by my current PCM? Or do I need a kit? I'm fairly certain the AFR was pegged so this makes sense as I can tell its rich.
Also if anyone is familiar with HPtuners can you tell me if there is a way to input cam specs.
It's going to be a long drawn out process if you are trying to learn this as you go... Seriously, it has taken me years to reach the level I'm at now, and I'm no where near the level of many of the guys that post here. I can only imagine that a competent tuner probably needs at least 7 to 10 years under his belt doing it daily, for me to feel confident they know what they are doing. There are so many "tuner disaster" stories.. and for good reason.
With that out of the way, I've got several tunes for built 5.3L engines that have the Truck Norris cam. I can post one up for you for REVIEW... But you cannot, and you MUST NOT try and run it on your vehicle. You can borrow aspects of the tune-such as the VE table, the MAF table, and BRAF to use as a STARTING point which you would then need to further tune yourself for your vehicle. I hope I'm being clear that you are not likely to find success just pasting someone else's tune into your computer.. It DOES NOT WORK THAT WAY. You cannot just blindly flash a tune posted from the web into your vehicle and it is going to work.. If you try that you are likely to create more problems than you have right now. The RIGHT way to do this would be to post up a copy of your current tune, and a log from the scanner with the correct channels/pids/graphs so that we can see what the engine needs and then you can make changes from that point.
Or, just pay someone at this point to tune it so that you can be driving it right away, and be done with it. Keep in mind even paying a professional you are still likely going to need to do some additional tuning after the fact because a tune just cannot be done 100% in a day, or on a dyno.. It takes multiple start ups from a cold engine up to full operating temperature both in gear, and in park, to work out the BRAF tables, and also the IAC steps vs. Effective area... Getting a tune done in a single day... welp, it's just NOT POSSIBLE do a 100% complete tune in a day..
I'll also say this-you CAN tune the majority of the VE table, and the MAF table, using just the factory narrow bands. You WILL need a wide band though (only 1) to tune for full throttle, and to check and set, and correct PE settings. What I'm telling you is that it's possible to get the vehicle into a safe driveable condition just using the narrowbands, but you must avoid any full throttle driving lest you want to destroy your engine and all the work you have done so far. Stay OFF the gas pedal until you have it properly tuned is what I'm saying. NO full throttle BS unless you just hate your engine and want to pull it out and rebuild it.
For right now, since you said it is running really badly, you should just scan it with a GOOD scanner and pull codes to see what the PCM thinks the problem is. If it's running excessively rich you could have fouled the spark plugs, or destroyed an O2 sensor.
If you think you might be tuning more vehicles in the future, it might be time to invest in HP Tuners for yourself so that you can have the ability to tune anytime you like without being dependent on anyone else. But keep in mind.. It takes YEARS to learn this stuff. The saving grace is that there are lots of good people that will help you, forums to support you, and usually any subject you want to search there will already be a post, or multiple posts, out there for you to read and learn from.
So, which way you wanna go? Step 1. Scan your vehicle for codes. 2. Post up a copy of your current tune and a log. 3. Start asking around for REPUTABLE tuners in your area.
It's going to be a long drawn out process if you are trying to learn this as you go...
That's not entirely true. I think it more revolves around the willingness of a person to want to learn to tune.
If you are serious about it.........Youtube Chopperdoc181 and Goat Rope Garage. Plus the wealth of knowledge here on this very forum. Armed with that info I can muddle my way through a new build fairly well.
I started learning tuning in 2019. That being said I'm not willing to take on someone else's challenges.
OP if you are not wanting to do the tuning I would start looking for an online tuner that can help get you corrected. It won't take a ton of work. The combo you have should come in fairly easily.
I would have to imagine, with not much radical done to engine other than cam and removal of emission and evap a tune shouldn't be too far out of grasp. I don't need full throttle BS, certainly not right now. I need it driveable since ive lost my gas sipper, and am trying to avoid a car payment. I got about 4k for the wreck, which as yall know won't get me much that I can put right into service. So this is my best option if I can do something by the end of turkey day. Really need to give dad his brand new car back. Think I've put 1500 of his 6500 miles on it. :😱 (40 mile one way commute) and well the 3500 dura isn't friendly on the wallet (about $100 a week on diesel) course this 6.0 liter probably won't be getting much fuel mileage either. Hahahaha.
I need to get his gear before I go any further, hoping I can get in touch with him tomorrow once I do that I can post up files.
Where are you located? Any chance there is someone else near you that has HP tuners and can pull a copy of your tune to post here? The P0300 could simply be because of the over lap of the cam causing low speed/idle misfiring. OR, it could mean you have other issues. A log would show us what the fuel trims are doing, and could help us pinpoint whether you have a mechanical problem, or just a tune issue. The misfire tables usually need to be adjusted for a cam like the Truck Norris. After reading your post last night I was reviewing the most recent 5.3L build I did with that cam, and I did make adjustments to the table for misfire-but left the P0300 DTC ON, or available for the PCM to set should the engine really begin randomly misfiring. Some guys like to just shut that code off..... Maybe there are merits to either way, but I personally like to leave that code active as a diagnostic aid for future problems.
Right now, since you have scanned it, reviewing a data log would really help us see what the engine is doing. Being able to review a log right now would greatly benefit us being able to guide you with some changes you can make to the tune to get it dialed in. In short... until you can get your hands back on an HP Tuners interface you are kind of dead in the water.
Your statement "tune shouldn't be too far out of grasp"... If you think that modifying or altering all of your IDLE spark IN GEAR, and IN PARK, spark under speed and over speed, LOW OCTANE and HIGH OCTANE tables, your Base Running Airflow, proportional idle tuning, IAC steps vs Effective area, dialing in your idle counts to the correct number, adjusting rich/lean vs airflow tables for O2 sensor placement, adjusting EOIT, getting your TPS voltage set within the correct parameters, resetting IAC and TPS multiple times along the way, setting the throttle body screw, remapping the ENTIRE VE table, remapping the ENTIRE MAF table, adjusting PE values, is "not too far out of grasp"..... I think you may be changing your opinion once you get into it.
That cam is going to require ALL of what I listed and potentially more... if you want it perfect. If you don't want it to stall as you come to a stop. if you want it to cold start and idle all the way up to full operating temperature without issue.... yea... all of that... You picked a cam that for a beginner is going to be an "advanced" tuning required cam.. A milder cam with less over lap, wider LSA, would be far easier to tune than what you have. That cam is going to chop pretty good at idle and that chop comes at a cost... low volumetric efficiency and the potential for the motor to labor, stall, & not want to run well at idle, and on deceleration to idle.
I'll post up a copy of the tune and you can do a comparison between this post, and yours to see everything that has been changed.
Where are you located? Any chance there is someone else near you that has HP tuners and can pull a copy of your tune to post here? The P0300 could simply be because of the over lap of the cam causing low speed/idle misfiring. OR, it could mean you have other issues. A log would show us what the fuel trims are doing, and could help us pinpoint whether you have a mechanical problem, or just a tune issue. The misfire tables usually need to be adjusted for a cam like the Truck Norris. After reading your post last night I was reviewing the most recent 5.3L build I did with that cam, and I did make adjustments to the table for misfire-but left the P0300 DTC ON, or available for the PCM to set should the engine really begin randomly misfiring. Some guys like to just shut that code off..... Maybe there are merits to either way, but I personally like to leave that code active as a diagnostic aid for future problems.
Right now, since you have scanned it, reviewing a data log would really help us see what the engine is doing. Being able to review a log right now would greatly benefit us being able to guide you with some changes you can make to the tune to get it dialed in. In short... until you can get your hands back on an HP Tuners interface you are kind of dead in the water.
Your statement "tune shouldn't be too far out of grasp"... If you think that modifying or altering all of your IDLE spark IN GEAR, and IN PARK, spark under speed and over speed, LOW OCTANE and HIGH OCTANE tables, your Base Running Airflow, proportional idle tuning, IAC steps vs Effective area, dialing in your idle counts to the correct number, adjusting rich/lean vs airflow tables for O2 sensor placement, adjusting EOIT, getting your TPS voltage set within the correct parameters, resetting IAC and TPS multiple times along the way, setting the throttle body screw, remapping the ENTIRE VE table, remapping the ENTIRE MAF table, adjusting PE values, is "not too far out of grasp"..... I think you may be changing your opinion once you get into it.
That cam is going to require ALL of what I listed and potentially more... if you want it perfect. If you don't want it to stall as you come to a stop. if you want it to cold start and idle all the way up to full operating temperature without issue.... yea... all of that... You picked a cam that for a beginner is going to be an "advanced" tuning required cam.. A milder cam with less over lap, wider LSA, would be far easier to tune than what you have. That cam is going to chop pretty good at idle and that chop comes at a cost... low volumetric efficiency and the potential for the motor to labor, stall, & not want to run well at idle, and on deceleration to idle.
I'll post up a copy of the tune and you can do a comparison between this post, and yours to see everything that has been changed.
I have the Interface he let me borrow this weekend, Im going to download the program and will get datalogs tonight hopefully
Your statement "tune shouldn't be too far out of grasp"... If you think that modifying or altering all of your IDLE spark IN GEAR, and IN PARK, spark under speed and over speed, LOW OCTANE and HIGH OCTANE tables, your Base Running Airflow, proportional idle tuning, IAC steps vs Effective area, dialing in your idle counts to the correct number, adjusting rich/lean vs airflow tables for O2 sensor placement, adjusting EOIT, getting your TPS voltage set within the correct parameters, resetting IAC and TPS multiple times along the way, setting the throttle body screw, remapping the ENTIRE VE table, remapping the ENTIRE MAF table, adjusting PE values, is "not too far out of grasp"..... I think you may be changing your opinion once you get into it.
That cam is going to require ALL of what I listed and potentially more... if you want it perfect. If you don't want it to stall as you come to a stop. if you want it to cold start and idle all the way up to full operating temperature without issue.... yea... all of that... You picked a cam that for a beginner is going to be an "advanced" tuning required cam.. A milder cam with less over lap, wider LSA, would be far easier to tune than what you have. That cam is going to chop pretty good at idle and that chop comes at a cost... low volumetric efficiency and the potential for the motor to labor, stall, & not want to run well at idle, and on deceleration to idle.
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If you have his "HP Tuners interface" this will not be a problem at all. You can use his interface with ANY lap top.. Just pull a copy of your current tune, post it here, and then we can make changes necessary to start it up and drive it for data logging purposes. Really... I made it seem harder than it needs to be... If we can help you... it won't be nearly as difficult as I've made it out to be... But if you were to try and do this on your own, with no help, and no HP Tuners experience, it would be a monumental task.... But... for now.... for simplicity.... just post a copy of your current tune here, and we can "hack it up" for you and get you on the right track. You have come to the right place... just GIVE ME a copy of the tune!!!!!!!!!! (salivates in the back ground)...
If you have his "HP Tuners interface" this will not be a problem at all. You can use his interface with ANY lap top.. Just pull a copy of your current tune, post it here, and then we can make changes necessary to start it up and drive it for data logging purposes. Really... I made it seem harder than it needs to be... If we can help you... it won't be nearly as difficult as I've made it out to be... But if you were to try and do this on your own, with no help, and no HP Tuners experience, it would be a monumental task.... But... for now.... for simplicity.... just post a copy of your current tunehere, and we can "hack it up" for you and get you on the right track. You have come to the right place... just GIVE ME a copy of the tune!!!!!!!!!! (salivates in the back ground)...
His interface wont flipping connect to my laptop, I downloaded the VCM suite and have the scanner open and it wont sync..... I cant even see it when I go to my file explorer.
Stat light on interface is flashing green, next thing right now is to try a different laptop i guess? As far as I can tell this interface is a paperweight right now.
I opened a ticket with hp tuners, and they want info I cant seem to figure out how to give them.
I mean should I be using different scanner software from hptuners, The software doesn't even mention the mpvi3.....I don't recall seeing anything marketed with no support on their own website as bad as this.
What version of windows are you running?
Have you downloaded the drivers and installed them? You must download and install the HPT suite, then also manually DOWNLOAD and install the drivers separately.
Believe it or not I downloaded the Beta version, and it installed the firmware to the interface properly, I cant seem to find any log files though. Not sure if it is an automated process or if he would have had to start it. So I connected all up, started the truck and waited for the stall. When I went to look for a log file, I couldn't find anything, so I hit start scanning and started the truck back up. This is the result.
What version of windows are you running?
Have you downloaded the drivers and installed them? You must download and install the HPT suite, then also manually DOWNLOAD and install the drivers separately.
I had tried everything, but the beta version seemed to fix it. the firmware update that is. see previous post with a working log file
okay, where is the copy of the tune? In your log, why does the engine coolant temp say -38F? Can't be correct. Also, DBW or DBC? If I had a copy of the tune I would not have to ask as I could see that in the tune. Also, are you hybrid, Speed density, MAF only.....? Need to see a copy of the tune! The white line indicating spark on your log is all over the place.. That's a sure sign you got many issues to resolve. No big deal... just show me the tune!
okay, where is the copy of the tune? In your log, why does the engine coolant temp say -38F? Can't be correct. Also, DBW or DBC? If I had a copy of the tune I would not have to ask as I could see that in the tune. Also, are you hybrid, Speed density, MAF only.....? Need to see a copy of the tune! The white line indicating spark on your log is all over the place.. That's a sure sign you got many issues to resolve. No big deal... just show me the tune!
Ok you'll have to direct me on how to find the tune... do I need a copy from my buddy or should I be able to get it from the interface?
11-17-2023, 07:24 PM
Truck Norris Cam install 
