S2000 wants a TA after race!
03-03-2006, 01:09 PM
#241
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Man, this has turned into a pissin contest. But, I want to put some personal experience in here. My good friend has an S2000, stock with exception of an air box.
He and I went to the autocross last fall, both on regular street tires. Our times were close, but he was never able to turn a faster time than me. Now, he was not far behind, but the closest he got was about 1.5 seconds.
He and I went to the autocross last fall, both on regular street tires. Our times were close, but he was never able to turn a faster time than me. Now, he was not far behind, but the closest he got was about 1.5 seconds.
03-03-2006, 01:27 PM
#242
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Originally Posted by bowtieman81
Man, this has turned into a pissin contest. But, I want to put some personal experience in here. My good friend has an S2000, stock with exception of an air box.
He and I went to the autocross last fall, both on regular street tires. Our times were close, but he was never able to turn a faster time than me. Now, he was not far behind, but the closest he got was about 1.5 seconds.
He and I went to the autocross last fall, both on regular street tires. Our times were close, but he was never able to turn a faster time than me. Now, he was not far behind, but the closest he got was about 1.5 seconds.
03-03-2006, 01:58 PM
#243
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Originally Posted by BLACKTURBOS2K
We have a STOCK s2k with a final drive swap and it ran a 13.2. Not too bad there buddy
congrats. but i don't know what a final drive swap is.
josh
03-03-2006, 02:03 PM
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Originally Posted by BlackMagicC5
No, I have nothing against Honda, I own one and love it! I will get another. How are you sticking up for open mindedness? This turned into a F-body vs S2000 debate, and I'm sorry, the F-body is much better. The area that actually gets close is handling. I keep hearing how the S2000 is better around the road course. I think thats total bullshit. The only chane the S2000 has in in a parking lot full of cones, and we all know thats gay and proves nothing. Just because I feel the F-body is a better performer, that means I'm close minded? 
It's just pathetic that an S2000 owner is coming onto an LS1 site to try to convince everyone that S2000's are cool/fast, ect. I should go on a Honda site and start telling everyone how good LS1 cars handle, or how fast they are. I'm sure that would so cool. Then anyone that argues with me would be close minded. Exactly whats going on here with you and your boy. 
It's just pathetic that an S2000 owner is coming onto an LS1 site to try to convince everyone that S2000's are cool/fast, ect. I should go on a Honda site and start telling everyone how good LS1 cars handle, or how fast they are. I'm sure that would so cool. Then anyone that argues with me would be close minded. Exactly whats going on here with you and your boy. "You keep hearing..." blah, blah, blah... From who?
Holy 
, you are talking out of your *** and anybody can see it. "Exactly what's going on here..." I'll tell you exactly what's going on here... No one is trying to convince anyone the S2000 is a better performer... That's just you talking out of your ***. 
...Instead of realizing that what's being said is that the S2000 is a good performer, handling especially, yet not so good straightline. Can you FREAKING understand that for chrissake! What makes you closed-minded are your INITIAL and UNPROVOKED ****-talking remarks about others' cars. Then, you defend yourself by asserting they were all in response to ILLUSIONARY attacks on the F-body's performance. WTF is wrong with you??????? Are you fucked up or something? Been breathing too much gunpowder fumes or helicoptor fuel?
Seriously now, I would think twice about underestimating a modded S2000 on a road course... regardless of "stock" arguments, they are a great canvass to begin a project with. An assessment that has NOTHING to do with LS1's as comparisons.
03-03-2006, 02:07 PM
#245
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Originally Posted by LSfast1
i was laughing at the comment that his dads 5 spd. trans am top out at 110. ok they only come in 6spd. manuals and 4 spd. autos. not 5 spds manuals.
congrats. but i don't know what a final drive swap is.
josh
congrats. but i don't know what a final drive swap is.
josh
My final drive ratio is 3.73... What's yours?
Just an example.
03-03-2006, 02:31 PM
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Originally Posted by bboyferal
Gears, bro.
My final drive ratio is 3.73... What's yours?
Just an example.
My final drive ratio is 3.73... What's yours?
Just an example.
03-03-2006, 07:57 PM
#247
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HP is torque. Its torque above 5250. Period. Mathematical fact.
By having it at high revs with a broad powerband, you can run really nasty gearing effectively. This is why 3L F1 cars go like bats out of hell. This is why no torque bikes can run with muscle cars. They make tons of high rev torque otherwise known as HP and are geared to take advantage of it. HP does matter. Otherwise you would never in the depths of ricer hell ever see a S2000 hang with a stock Mustang GT from a roll. Its got half the peak torque. It would loose to a V6 with gears. It doesnt. Same reason an Integra Type R (the real one, not the POS imitation cars) will murder a base model Integra down the track. It does not have significantly more "torque". Its got more "HP". Basicly more torque at points where the high ratio gearing can be used.
But if you dont have the broad progressive powerband, you really are not utilizing all that high-rev torque much. S2Ks make power from what, 6-9? Thats a 3K powerband. Not broader than a LS1s high 2s to low 6s despite having the more modern hi-flow OHC layout. If you had a S2000 with the same peak torque of 150 or so and the hp was 200 at say 7000, it would be a lot slower even with the more accesable power peak.
This does not apply so much to LS1s. They spend most of their time below 5250, but about half the powerband is above that, especially when you get into cams. So LS1 guys care about torque at least as much as hp. I garrantee you though that if you made an LS1 with a 8000 redline that had lots of high rev torque and similar low rev torque to stock even, it would be a beast. Put 4.10s on it and enjoy the ability to stay in 1st while the other guy lifts, accelerating like a banshee the whole time. Same in second. You basicly get to use your lower gears much longer. And thats a nice feeling.
Different strokes. Personally I like to have equal power and torque peaks. I dont care much about "torque" above 5250. I dont care much about hp below 5250. If you do, your really fighting math, since they intersect there on the dyno anyway, one going up, the other down usually. Fighting math is not a winning idea.
By having it at high revs with a broad powerband, you can run really nasty gearing effectively. This is why 3L F1 cars go like bats out of hell. This is why no torque bikes can run with muscle cars. They make tons of high rev torque otherwise known as HP and are geared to take advantage of it. HP does matter. Otherwise you would never in the depths of ricer hell ever see a S2000 hang with a stock Mustang GT from a roll. Its got half the peak torque. It would loose to a V6 with gears. It doesnt. Same reason an Integra Type R (the real one, not the POS imitation cars) will murder a base model Integra down the track. It does not have significantly more "torque". Its got more "HP". Basicly more torque at points where the high ratio gearing can be used.
But if you dont have the broad progressive powerband, you really are not utilizing all that high-rev torque much. S2Ks make power from what, 6-9? Thats a 3K powerband. Not broader than a LS1s high 2s to low 6s despite having the more modern hi-flow OHC layout. If you had a S2000 with the same peak torque of 150 or so and the hp was 200 at say 7000, it would be a lot slower even with the more accesable power peak.
This does not apply so much to LS1s. They spend most of their time below 5250, but about half the powerband is above that, especially when you get into cams. So LS1 guys care about torque at least as much as hp. I garrantee you though that if you made an LS1 with a 8000 redline that had lots of high rev torque and similar low rev torque to stock even, it would be a beast. Put 4.10s on it and enjoy the ability to stay in 1st while the other guy lifts, accelerating like a banshee the whole time. Same in second. You basicly get to use your lower gears much longer. And thats a nice feeling.
Different strokes. Personally I like to have equal power and torque peaks. I dont care much about "torque" above 5250. I dont care much about hp below 5250. If you do, your really fighting math, since they intersect there on the dyno anyway, one going up, the other down usually. Fighting math is not a winning idea.
03-03-2006, 07:58 PM
#248
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Originally Posted by BLACKTURBOS2K
I can see this, who is the better driver? Im sure you. I also see you have alot of stuff done to your car. i would really like to see stock vs stock with the same driver
Driving skill we are pretty close if not equal. True, I have a decent amount of power, but on that day it was not much benefit. The course was very tight and the temp was only about 40 degrees, and I spun a lot. He did ride around with me one lap, and I rode with him. We agreed our cars were pretty equal for that day. I had more power, but no traction; he had less power but traction.
But stock versus stock its still real close. My friend who has a stock 01 SS was there too. He got within 2 second or so of the Honda, with not as much skill.
03-03-2006, 11:51 PM
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Originally Posted by Sparetire
HP is torque. Its torque above 5250. Period. Mathematical fact.
By having it at high revs with a broad powerband, you can run really nasty gearing effectively. This is why 3L F1 cars go like bats out of hell. This is why no torque bikes can run with muscle cars. They make tons of high rev torque otherwise known as HP and are geared to take advantage of it. HP does matter. Otherwise you would never in the depths of ricer hell ever see a S2000 hang with a stock Mustang GT from a roll. Its got half the peak torque. It would loose to a V6 with gears. It doesnt. Same reason an Integra Type R (the real one, not the POS imitation cars) will murder a base model Integra down the track. It does not have significantly more "torque". Its got more "HP". Basicly more torque at points where the high ratio gearing can be used.
But if you dont have the broad progressive powerband, you really are not utilizing all that high-rev torque much. S2Ks make power from what, 6-9? Thats a 3K powerband. Not broader than a LS1s high 2s to low 6s despite having the more modern hi-flow OHC layout. If you had a S2000 with the same peak torque of 150 or so and the hp was 200 at say 7000, it would be a lot slower even with the more accesable power peak.
This does not apply so much to LS1s. They spend most of their time below 5250, but about half the powerband is above that, especially when you get into cams. So LS1 guys care about torque at least as much as hp. I garrantee you though that if you made an LS1 with a 8000 redline that had lots of high rev torque and similar low rev torque to stock even, it would be a beast. Put 4.10s on it and enjoy the ability to stay in 1st while the other guy lifts, accelerating like a banshee the whole time. Same in second. You basicly get to use your lower gears much longer. And thats a nice feeling.
Different strokes. Personally I like to have equal power and torque peaks. I dont care much about "torque" above 5250. I dont care much about hp below 5250. If you do, your really fighting math, since they intersect there on the dyno anyway, one going up, the other down usually. Fighting math is not a winning idea.
By having it at high revs with a broad powerband, you can run really nasty gearing effectively. This is why 3L F1 cars go like bats out of hell. This is why no torque bikes can run with muscle cars. They make tons of high rev torque otherwise known as HP and are geared to take advantage of it. HP does matter. Otherwise you would never in the depths of ricer hell ever see a S2000 hang with a stock Mustang GT from a roll. Its got half the peak torque. It would loose to a V6 with gears. It doesnt. Same reason an Integra Type R (the real one, not the POS imitation cars) will murder a base model Integra down the track. It does not have significantly more "torque". Its got more "HP". Basicly more torque at points where the high ratio gearing can be used.
But if you dont have the broad progressive powerband, you really are not utilizing all that high-rev torque much. S2Ks make power from what, 6-9? Thats a 3K powerband. Not broader than a LS1s high 2s to low 6s despite having the more modern hi-flow OHC layout. If you had a S2000 with the same peak torque of 150 or so and the hp was 200 at say 7000, it would be a lot slower even with the more accesable power peak.
This does not apply so much to LS1s. They spend most of their time below 5250, but about half the powerband is above that, especially when you get into cams. So LS1 guys care about torque at least as much as hp. I garrantee you though that if you made an LS1 with a 8000 redline that had lots of high rev torque and similar low rev torque to stock even, it would be a beast. Put 4.10s on it and enjoy the ability to stay in 1st while the other guy lifts, accelerating like a banshee the whole time. Same in second. You basicly get to use your lower gears much longer. And thats a nice feeling.
Different strokes. Personally I like to have equal power and torque peaks. I dont care much about "torque" above 5250. I dont care much about hp below 5250. If you do, your really fighting math, since they intersect there on the dyno anyway, one going up, the other down usually. Fighting math is not a winning idea.
03-04-2006, 01:28 AM
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this is getting really ridicilous im suprised they havnt locked this thing........... but thats the internet 4 you, everyone has a 9 second car/they can beat your ***/and they know everything about cars
03-04-2006, 06:38 AM
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Originally Posted by T-rex
249 posts later and ya'll are still beating the **** out of this dead horse.
03-04-2006, 10:08 AM
#253
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This is the streetracing forum? Of course we're gonna beat dead horses!!!
If not... they why are some of you on this forum?
We also get losers that always put in the very cliched remark at some point, "Uh, mods needs to close this..." Let the ******* mods do their ******* jobs... Or become a mod yourself... Or just STFU! Pm the mods and just ask them to close it, but seriously the *****-whining...
Then we get some decent posts like these last couple, that show how HP and TQ are essentially the same thing... They will be different numbers according to where an engine make power... that's it... It's so stupid when people criticize a car by pointing out that though it has 900 rwhp, it will be slow because it has 500 rwtq.
If not... they why are some of you on this forum?
We also get losers that always put in the very cliched remark at some point, "Uh, mods needs to close this..." Let the ******* mods do their ******* jobs... Or become a mod yourself... Or just STFU! Pm the mods and just ask them to close it, but seriously the *****-whining...
Then we get some decent posts like these last couple, that show how HP and TQ are essentially the same thing... They will be different numbers according to where an engine make power... that's it... It's so stupid when people criticize a car by pointing out that though it has 900 rwhp, it will be slow because it has 500 rwtq.
03-04-2006, 11:05 AM
#254
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Dude I was just ******* around.No need for the smartass comments.I'll post when and where I want,just like you so you STFU.Some people on here can take a little humor evidently you aren't one of them.No one is ***** whining there dude, just trying to lighten the mood a little.
03-04-2006, 12:59 PM
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Originally Posted by bboyferal
This is the streetracing forum? Of course we're gonna beat dead horses!!!
If not... they why are some of you on this forum?
We also get losers that always put in the very cliched remark at some point, "Uh, mods needs to close this..." Let the ******* mods do their ******* jobs... Or become a mod yourself... Or just STFU! Pm the mods and just ask them to close it, but seriously the *****-whining...
Then we get some decent posts like these last couple, that show how HP and TQ are essentially the same thing... They will be different numbers according to where an engine make power... that's it... It's so stupid when people criticize a car by pointing out that though it has 900 rwhp, it will be slow because it has 500 rwtq.
If not... they why are some of you on this forum?
We also get losers that always put in the very cliched remark at some point, "Uh, mods needs to close this..." Let the ******* mods do their ******* jobs... Or become a mod yourself... Or just STFU! Pm the mods and just ask them to close it, but seriously the *****-whining...
Then we get some decent posts like these last couple, that show how HP and TQ are essentially the same thing... They will be different numbers according to where an engine make power... that's it... It's so stupid when people criticize a car by pointing out that though it has 900 rwhp, it will be slow because it has 500 rwtq.
03-04-2006, 06:13 PM
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Originally Posted by GMmexican
So what if you had a 100 pound car that made 1,000horese but 2pounds of torque....could it go up a hill? lol
You would not tow much with it though
I think it would be nearly impossible to make such a motor. But in honor of beating the dead horse:
Maybe if you had a like 2mm stroke on a inline 6 with a rediculusly huge ported DOHC head and major major bore that could rev to like 20K. The cams would be massively biased.
Take that you bloody lump of flesh that used to be a horse! (refering to the thread GM, not you) (although that would be a weird insult.)(gonna try that one sometime, see what reaction it gets)
03-05-2006, 10:31 AM
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Originally Posted by T-rex
Dude I was just ******* around.No need for the smartass comments.I'll post when and where I want,just like you so you STFU.Some people on here can take a little humor evidently you aren't one of them.No one is ***** whining there dude, just trying to lighten the mood a little.
maybe not you... Humor is good, too, that's my point so go bark another tree, ******.