Thoughts on Mov It brakes
12-12-2003, 08:38 PM
#21
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"My kit came from Prospeed Motorsports, who are no longer selling the kit. It cost about $1800 new."
Actually he still sells the kit, you just wont ever get it, or your money. Ask me how i know.
Looks like now I go with either Stoptech or Movit.
Actually he still sells the kit, you just wont ever get it, or your money. Ask me how i know.
Looks like now I go with either Stoptech or Movit.
12-13-2003, 04:14 PM
#23
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Just incase anyone wanted a picture. The Rotors are dirty b/c i just degreased my engine cradle (the lines are dried degreaser...not stress cracks. the picture with my wheel on is what they look like all cleaned up. sense then i have changed wheels...but i repainted the 10 spokes gloss black and ran those for a while.
12-13-2003, 09:44 PM
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Just looked at Movits site , they got the Porsche six piston on a 342X34 rotor . drooling , but I still got a long ways to go before these brakes need improving
12-13-2003, 09:59 PM
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I think that calculates to 13.9 in rotor or somthing like that. I just have always said 14. Not to try and make them bigger than they are but it is just easy to say.
12-17-2003, 11:33 PM
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Originally Posted by mitchntx
I've heard both sides of Cryo treating ... those that say it prolongs life and those that say it made no difference.
Not sure who to believe ...
Not sure who to believe ...
You can believe both.Cryogenic processing if done properly can increase the life a rotor by 300% or more.If done improperly the difference will negligable at best.
I am part owner of Core Thermal Processing. We cyrogenically process machine tools and industrial items.We have no plans to get into automotive applications at this time so I haven't spent a great deal of time testing with car parts.I can say that while researching cryogenic processing I have talked to many people and read quite a few studies that show without a doubt cryogenic processing can show a marked improvement in rotor life.As for the why and how.That can get drawn out but I am willing to answer questions if anyone asks.
Last edited by lerajie; 01-08-2004 at 09:36 PM.
12-18-2003, 06:02 PM
#38
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A short how: Pressure is what makes it work. Think of what happens to turn carbon into a diamond. Except this on a much less severe scale.
Here's a short why:
Austenite (a softer form of iron, which is unstable unless certain alloying elements are present)is formed during the hardening process of steels. Through cryogenic processing retained austenite can be converted into martensite (the harder form of iron).The martensite is more difficult to "tear out" of the surface than is austenite.This is due to the difference in the way atoms are arranged in austenite and martensite. What this means is that the probability of forming a wear particle in a steel in which the austenite has been transformed to martensite is less than for the steel containing some retained austenite.
Fine carbide particles (ETA carbides) are formed during the cryogenic processing .The addition of fine carbide particles help support the martensite to make it more difficult to dig out chunks of the material.So when a brake pad is pressed against a rotor the ETA carbides (working as a binder or support system of sorts) help resist the pad material from plowing the steel and wear resistance is increased.
If you have a knowledge of fiberglass at all this may help.Fiberglass is not as strong in chopped mat form as it is in woven fabric form. This is because the chopped mat is unorganized and the particles are not working together whereas the individual strands in a fabric work together to support one another. The transformation of austenite to martensite is similar to changing from chopped mat to a woven fabric. Now think of the formation of carbides as the addition of a resin to the fiberglass.
I hope that helps.
Here's a short why:
Austenite (a softer form of iron, which is unstable unless certain alloying elements are present)is formed during the hardening process of steels. Through cryogenic processing retained austenite can be converted into martensite (the harder form of iron).The martensite is more difficult to "tear out" of the surface than is austenite.This is due to the difference in the way atoms are arranged in austenite and martensite. What this means is that the probability of forming a wear particle in a steel in which the austenite has been transformed to martensite is less than for the steel containing some retained austenite.
Fine carbide particles (ETA carbides) are formed during the cryogenic processing .The addition of fine carbide particles help support the martensite to make it more difficult to dig out chunks of the material.So when a brake pad is pressed against a rotor the ETA carbides (working as a binder or support system of sorts) help resist the pad material from plowing the steel and wear resistance is increased.
If you have a knowledge of fiberglass at all this may help.Fiberglass is not as strong in chopped mat form as it is in woven fabric form. This is because the chopped mat is unorganized and the particles are not working together whereas the individual strands in a fabric work together to support one another. The transformation of austenite to martensite is similar to changing from chopped mat to a woven fabric. Now think of the formation of carbides as the addition of a resin to the fiberglass.
I hope that helps.
Last edited by lerajie; 01-08-2004 at 09:41 PM. Reason: typos
12-18-2003, 08:22 PM
#39
My head hurts ... 
Thanks for that explanation. Shed some light on the subject.
You say:
Would that change the friction properties and thus reduce stopping power?
Thanks for that explanation. Shed some light on the subject.
You say:
So when a brake pad is pressed against a rotor the ETA carbides (working as a binder or support system of sorts) help resist the pad material from plowing the steel and wear resistance is increased.
12-21-2003, 12:08 PM
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That's a good question. Up to this point I have seen no information stating that the the mu of cryogenicically processed items is affected. I would imagine if there is any change it all it wold be very slight.
I have talked to several motorcycle racers who use cryogenically processed rotors and have not heard any of them comment on loss of stopping power.These guys tend to be ultra sensitive when it comes to braking feel so I would expect them to notice (and complain) right away.
I'll look into this and see if I can come up with any information.
I have talked to several motorcycle racers who use cryogenically processed rotors and have not heard any of them comment on loss of stopping power.These guys tend to be ultra sensitive when it comes to braking feel so I would expect them to notice (and complain) right away.
I'll look into this and see if I can come up with any information.
Last edited by lerajie; 01-08-2004 at 09:39 PM.