jrob56

iTrader: (39)

Ive been in the same dilemma, just got my stall in yesterday and got to the track, best 60ft was 1.9 on some shitty tires. So I dont think a drag shock is needed, with tires alone that will drop quite a bit and I DD my car. The bilsteins is the way Ill go.

From what I have read though, the HD and SLP version are the same exact shock per Bilstein. Unless SLP actually revalves them? Id like a little stiffer spring but dont like the 1 inch plus drop. Saw SLP has a 3/4" package. Never heard of anyone running them though.

tim99ws6

iTrader: (31)

"any" shock will be better than stock is an ignorant statement.

To my little overconfident German sport sedan buddy--because you prefer a stiffer ride, does that mean everyone else does? It's just shock valving guys. And at the end of the day, being able to adjust one to your personal preference will always win over a single valved shock. Sorry.

Now, we can argue all day abou what is "smooth" or "comfy" to ride on. It's a no win argument, but for the guy not interested in handling, with the occasional run to the track, and specifically asking "budget" in his title, I don't think bilstein is the answer. I can get a stock decarbon to work just as well as a stock or aftermarket non adjustable bilstein. So it's not an improvement unless you are talking handling improvement. A comp will outperform both at the track, is adjustable, cheaper, and can be set up neutral, 50/50, so a nice ride quality can still be retained.


Why all the drama?? No need for the "boom" or any of that stupid ****. I'm aware of the section we are in and the primary audience that looks in here. Of course the focal point will be handling and improved lateral g's. But you guys have to look to what the op wants.

tim99ws6

iTrader: (31)

How do you know the valving in a bilstein is what you need? Just asking open ended.


What do you THINK you need valving wise in a replacement shock for your car?

jrob56

iTrader: (39)

I dont know anything about vavling, I know my car works pretty well as is on Decarbons, and from others experience here, they worked as well at drag or slightly better then the Decarbons. Ive seen what completely stock suspension can do on just a cam/stall car and its more then Ill ever need.

Im choosing the bilsteins cuz they are a stock like replacement proven great street shock. Countless members here have run them and they run just as well drag if not a little better than stock. And for dailying they are much better. If SLP put them on the cars that left there back when these were new, they will be fine for me.

I dont think you are getting that we arent drag racers. I have made probably 20 passes in my 5 years in the lsx world. Why would we need a drag shock?

z28bryan

iTrader: (7)

Are we all going to fight over something that's considered personal taste? We've wasted tons of time on ls1tech over how we think setup A or setup B has a better ride quality. It's similar to arguing that steak is a better dinner than a rack of ribs.

So how do we get around this dilemma? I believe the poster needs to explain what type of RIDE CHARACTERISTICS they consider to be a good ride quality. From there we can figure out what types of RIDE CHARACTERISTICS that a specific shock has. This is really the only way you can help someone determine what the best shock is for their personal ride quality preference.

FWIW.. I recommended Bilstiens because there's plenty of people out there that are running Bilstiens on stock springs and find them comfortable. It's essentially what should have come with the car stock. And for a smooth well balanced dampened daily driver, I think running a stock shock in front is a bad idea.

Tim, what other modifications do you have in your setup? Can you explain how exactly that you thought the Bilstiens rode rough? Rough can mean too much damping/jarring before full compression travel.. OR it could mean you are hitting full compression too hard and absorbtion is bad.

tim99ws6

iTrader: (31)

Who said you were a drag racer? Blind faith in what SLP chose to use over a decade ago can be a little behind the wave...no? Go buy a PC from 1998 and let me know how that works out for you. If you haven't ever ridden in a car with Comp 3way's,....how do you know they are "RACECAR"?


Look, I'm not saying Bilsteins are bad, because they aren't. They are a good basic non-adjustable shock. I wouldn't waste the $$$ to buy them new though. For the $$$, there are better options out there is all.

I had BMR springs, torque arm, LCA's, and a panhard rod. The were stiff on compression, and a little unforgiving on rebound in my opinion. If I were to put it in the land of a 12way, and a stock shock were 5/5, I'd say they were around a 8/6 C/R.

I adamently don't feel the QA1 SA's are the way to go, although i've had them for years. The equal C/R on them makes them damn near impossibe to set up correctly, but you can get close. And the $$$ on them is crazy.



I couldn't agree more. I am only judging the OP from what he wrote in his first post. That being said, a stiffer shock, which the Bilstein is, will most certainly ride stiffer than a Comp 3way which is not in the 50/50 setting from my PERSONAL experience.


I'm just honestly blown away that after all the years of improvement to these cars, you guys are seriously recommending a Bilstein shock to the poor guy looking for a good riding "Budget" shock that will perform when he occasionally go to the track.

Go with it this way:

Ride quality=wash because it's personal preference
performance=Comp
Price=Comp

My6speedZ

iTrader: (18)

So the Comp shock with the compression tightened down still manages to produce a responsive ride? I'm not talking about winning no time trials but still managing to handle well enough for any kind of daily driving?

I'm not being a smart ***. I'm asking a serious question, I want to know.

tim99ws6

iTrader: (31)

I'll be honest, at the 50/50 setting, it was really similar to a stock shock...maybe a hair stiffer on compression, but that may be from a new shock and not a worn out old stock one.

jrob56

iTrader: (39)

Alright lets see a link to these things? You have to fully compress them to adjust em?

tim99ws6

iTrader: (31)

yea, bolt them in with the setting you think you need. From there, to adjust, you just unbolt from the bottom hole, and push them up into the car and click to adjust.

http://www.competitionengineering.co...?CatCode=10032


I think Summitt even sells a knock-off version of them as well? Never laid hands on that one though.

My6speedZ

iTrader: (18)

But what for the front end?

It would be lowered on new springs.

tim99ws6

iTrader: (31)

Again, this is going to drive the Strano bandwagon CRAZY, but here's what I've had up front personally over the years:

BMR springs on stock shocks
Eibach pro kit on bilsteins and decarbons
QA1 single adjustables with adjustable coilover
cut front spring on decarbon and bilstein


"Performance" in terms of handling, i wouldnt recommend, but the cut spring was hands down the best riding vs ride height i went with. Plus...it was free, haha. It will only MINUTELY change the spring rate so really no change there. Again, we are talking about your standard issue bolt on street/strip bolt on car. No need to get fancy up front on these cars. Unhook the front sway bar at the track and it should give you enough weight transfer to get the job done on any DR or slick. As for cutting the spring, this is assuming you aren't looking to drag frame and screw with the shock's ability to still put in work up front. I dont get stupid aggressive on the cut. This was the last car i did this on and was a 1.5 coil cut up front with the isolator removed in the rear. Just enough to not "look stock" but still ride like a champ and not drag on anything. And trust me...it had no problem hooking either

JD_AMG

Bilstien valved the shocks to match the stock spring rate, something that didn't change regardless of being over a decade old now. So what worked then wont work now even though nothing has changed?
Id like to throw out there for comparison that Im pretty sure Koni hasn't changed their valving since they put them on the 1LE 4th gens, yet even to this day its "good enough" to win national auto-x champions on...

You're right, some might like an old cadillac type of ride, but I think its safe to assume that most on here would prefer a solid, smooth taut ride seeing that we are driving performance cars, and not some old boats.
As far as "adjust to your personal preference" goes yes, but that only applies to a shock that actually has good valving and adjustment (not drag shocks for example). - Not all adjusters work the same way, and certainly not all shocks are valved the same.
Id like to bring the example of the QA1s back up since Ive experienced them, it didnt matter how you adjusted them, they still rode like crap(too loose but at the same time too jarring) and handled like crap (floaty, loose, disconnected, unpredictable). Then drive around with them and the oil starts to foam up because they are not gas charged, and you get an even looser ride...

So are you saying you only experienced bilstiens on the cut springs and Prokit, and not on stock springs? You never experienced the comp's on the same springs as bilstiens?

tim99ws6

iTrader: (31)

No. I've had an original slp optioned BILSTEIN setup as well with slp springs on that same Camaro in the picture above.

tim99ws6

iTrader: (31)

I also had a Bilstein setup on my trans am at one time as well. It did ride better obviously on the stock slp springs than the eibach's.

BottleBoy1

Another option for you on the rear shocks are some from Calvert Racing. They make the Very Famous & industry leader CalTracs. They bought out Ranchero shocks & offer many options.
They have great customer service too been dealing with them for Many Many years now.
I like to use junkyard V-6 springs in the rear. They are a lighter coil & Help aid in weight transfer which will help the car hook BIG time. On the street it makes night & day difference. I NEVER Ever plan to do some loops in a parking lot for SCCA so I Don't need some stiff truck springs or stiff valving for high speed cornering. Many of my customers can't believe how much Better there car rides & drives with just sub frame connectors & V-6 springs.
My 2 cents been tuning cars to hook on the bottle for 8 years now.

JD_AMG

So were you using the exact same setup (nothing at all different) with bilstiens and the comps?

I love posts like these, shows how little you know.
4th gen fbody V6 rear springs (98-02) are the same rate as the V8 springs, the early 4th gens had a 5lbs/in difference...
As far as stiff rear suspension for cornering, generally speaking drag suspension is WAY WAY stiffer in the rear than handling suspension, and if anything the drag suspension is "truck-like", not the handling suspension.
As for SFCs, talk to the guys that have good shocks first, they will tell you SFCs make little to no difference. I have 3pt welded on, couldn't tell a bit of difference(this was after i fixed the real problem, the shocks). You will see guys who like to corner taking them off as they just add weight and more often then not slow you down... Why? Because all that "flex" people think they are feeling is the **** poor shock dampening making the car feel like its overly loose, causing a jarring ride, and feel like two separate pieces front and rear.

zacht

iTrader: (18)

subscribing...good read so far! bumping it back up!